The holy grail?

[Hansj80]

Isn't everything able to become an addiction though?

Very much true only some things are more addictive than others.. I see candy crush and other freemium games as gambling also.... hook you into the game with the first X levels easy as f*ck... then making it impossible to proceed unless buying some random lootboxes... same with other games anyways...it's just a cash cow method to disguise gambling in young games... or making adults make a fool out of themselves thinking it aint gambling but just "candy crush" lol

 

[Reposado]

Very much true only some things are more addictive than others.. I see candy crush and other freemium games as gambling also.... hook you into the game with the first X levels easy as f*ck... then making it impossible to proceed unless buying some random lootboxes... same with other games anyways...it's just a cash cow method to disguise gambling in young games... or making adults make a fool out of themselves thinking it aint gambling but just "candy crush" lol

It's pretty genius, isn't it? It's also interesting to see how long it has been able to persist without any gov intervention.

 

[TomTheCat]

I've become addicted to making money.

 

[Hansj80]

I've become addicted to making money.

Notm me. I've been fortune and broke during all these years, money doesn't do much unless you know what makes you happy and money is just a means right... You get otherwise weird situations where you end up snorting coke off a hooker then reflecting wtf you are doing with your life....so money is good...but it won't make you happy on its own I think

 

[chrisuchiim]

One can call it the holy grail because you own it

true bro, social media will come and go, likewise other strategies, some will even act up sometimes, suspend account without reason, but your emails is your property for life. i wish i knew this secret many years back, my life would have been soooooooooooooooooooooo awesome, but never too late.

 

[chrisuchiim]

Notm me. I've been fortune and broke during all these years, money doesn't do much unless you know what makes you happy and money is just a means right... You get otherwise weird situations where you end up snorting coke off a hooker then reflecting wtf you are doing with your life....so money is good...but it won't make you happy on its own I think

Yea, u ar right to an extent, but yet, you can be happy without money, or can you?

 

[Elvlin]

The Holy Grail "is commitment, Research,do it, fail, find out why, do it better, repeat"
there no single method that won't get outdated. you need to keep it updated, in your own way. (not only IM, in any business)
Every method that shared online always lack details (cause they dont' want to share it) , or with details than got saturated in no time.

 

[OlafRustle]

Well there is some truth to it. I'm close to have at least 18 companies in the last 15 years across 4 countries and 3 continents speaking 4 languages. Not saying this to impress but it is more to emphasize the vast majority of necessary diversification and the fuckups that come with it . If you want to start a business from A to Z I am probably knowledge enough to guide the noobs into it from Legality, paperwork, website, design, influencers, actual press releases, radio etc etc. I even know the whole process of patent filing and actually getting a patent. only thing I have not tried yet is selling potatoes at the corner of the street haha.

It's not easy to always hustle, just wished you could just put 200% of your energy into 1 project and watch it grow... instead before it even grows it being smashed haha

18 companies and 18 successful companies are two different things.
Also you have your answer: selling potatos is the solution. Food never goes out of fashion.

 

[SpawneR]

This is the type of business that is still developing, and it's a non-stop run for money. 3 years is even a great period of time for something to work! You just need to keep learning and trying different things

 

[PremiumAds]

Not really a Holy Grail but when I started selling ad accounts I thought the business would last a year if I was lucky.
4 years later and still going strong, sadly there's too many copycats and wannabe sellers.

 

[Hansj80]

Yea, u ar right to an extent, but yet, you can be happy without money, or can you?

Just enough for living costs and I'm good I don't live in New york though and neither in india so still living cost of around 2500usd

The Holy Grail "is commitment, Research,do it, fail, find out why, do it better, repeat"
there no single method that won't get outdated. you need to keep it updated, in your own way. (not only IM, in any business)
Every method that shared online always lack details (cause they dont' want to share it) , or with details than got saturated in no time.

very true!

18 companies and 18 successful companies are two different things.
Also you have your answer: selling potatos is the solution. Food never goes out of fashion.

yeah that was a vague statement of me , I was always having multiple ones running on average 3/4 companies at any given time. I would say around 50% of them total were succesfull financially but if you read closely... most of the markets i moved in became saturated or forced to compete at budget prices which makes it not viable to maintain. So those 18 companies in around 18 years... it's more around 3/4 companies which would last on everage between 2/4 years... some less than 1 year and some almost 8/9 years. If I indeed did not have multiple baskets I would indeed be forced to sell potatoes....

p.s. even potatoes are risky business.... small margins and dependable on the crop/weather/regulation etc etc. I aint easy to be a farmer haha

true bro, social media will come and go, likewise other strategies, some will even act up sometimes, suspend account without reason, but your emails is your property for life. i wish i knew this secret many years back, my life would have been soooooooooooooooooooooo awesome, but never too late.

You mean email marketing? email list building ?

 

[chrisuchiim]

Just enough for living costs and I'm good I don't live in New york though and neither in india so still living cost of around 2500usd
Yes, the the secret and the permanent holy grail of this internet marketing thing, if you are not doing it, just start now and small ok. give yourself few year you will very fine.


very true!



yeah that was a vague statement of me , I was always having multiple ones running on average 3/4 companies at any given time. I would say around 50% of them total were succesfull financially but if you read closely... most of the markets i moved in became saturated or forced to compete at budget prices which makes it not viable to maintain. So those 18 companies in around 18 years... it's more around 3/4 companies which would last on everage between 2/4 years... some less than 1 year and some almost 8/9 years. If I indeed did not have multiple baskets I would indeed be forced to sell potatoes....

p.s. even potatoes are risky business.... small margins and dependable on the crop/weather/regulation etc etc. I aint easy to be a farmer haha




You mean email marketing? email list building ?

 

[OlafRustle]

I aint easy to be a farmer haha

That is why knowing computers and marketimg can help you outcompete the other farmers.
It's called a skillstack so if your not the best at one thing but good at some it stacks you higher than others.
You might not grow the biggest potatos but you know how to sell them too.

 

[Hansj80]

That is why knowing computers and marketimg can help you outcompete the other farmers.
It's called a skillstack so if your not the best at one thing but good at some it stacks you higher than others.
You might not grow the biggest potatos but you know how to sell them too.

all that talk about potato makes me drive to the mcdonalds now... THANKS! are you working for them? are you here to enchant people with potato talk to buy potatoes?! who is your leader!.... sorry just went a bit overboard with that random rant haha

But you are spot on, I actually had a phonecall today with a prospect and the reason he indeed picked me was the "jack of all trades" part. And the skillstack has helped me in the past to view stuff from an different angle. Skillstack is wonderfull... i'm using that term now since I didn't know it before haha

maybe...just maybe..... the holy grail is not the motion of having an "eternal source of income out of 1 project" but the holy grail is to be able to adapt to change, and with that... having stacked skills is essential... meh just thinking out loud i guess....

 

[skule]

Thanks for moving the thread!

I already diversify and have multiple streams in different segments and markets. However it does feel like continue working on things that never really come to full fruition. I have been an chameleon all my life with approaching this self reliance of income as opposed 9 to 5. with it comes obviously these uncertainties which in some countries is the same as being employed.

SEO is surely not dead and I think what you said it is fluid ...so the approach has to be fluid too..


To give a small intro.

1. At 11/12 I build and ran those annoying ringtone websites and made some good money on it back then,
2. At 15/16 I opened my first webdesign company to create websites
3. At 18 it was turned into a hosting company, one of the big ones but also expensive ones....budget hosting companies kind of killed the market then for me and I checked out.. mind you this was during an age where you had to pay for data traffic on your server and harddisk were expensive af and so were servers.
4. At 19 I turned to brick and mortar style and offered laptop/network/pc repairs
5. At 22 I started with RC drones/planes selling them and it ran pretty sweet untill aliexpress and banggood and hobbyking killed the fun for the biggest players in the game and killed them, along with me haha
6. At 26 I started selling licences 3d printers during the hype years and it was not bad but the marges were terrible
7. I thought about porn sites but it's just not my cup of tea
8. So at 30 I was back at with IM and building sites

But the game has changed allot off course and building websites and doing design work has changed also... with fiverr and tons of other places it cuts in your margin. Most of the jobs are grabbed by indians/pakistanis and other asian countries... I understand that because it's a simple living cost difference and I don't hate on them it's a simple equation.... their living costs is 500 usd... mine is 2500 usd ... so yeah their prices is 1/5 of mine haha.

but that does not take away the inevitable of certain things
- as everyone is getting more connnected more potential customers
- more people online also offering services for lower fees as their living cost is less than where you live
- any market you find, it can quickly be saturated or hijacked before it attracts momentum
- any affiliate you get, as soon as they are full they cut you off... like amazon.... unless you start blogging about the best wordpress plugins and create affiliates based on your reviews etc etc... that might work still donno...


Only conclusion I can have and make...
Change is inevitable, so changing your business model is also inevitable. It was just a bit easier like 100 years ago.... you would walk up to a store and it has been run for generations.... but now.... you are at 1 point a business banker then you are doing silly vlogs on youtube... then some blogger.... then back to crypto trading... all in less than 10 years time..... it's just insane and tiredsome.... maybe I was hoping I was the only one and others have an solution....while knowing this a challenge everyone has....

You were able to stick to web dev since your ringtone webpages and it would be a holy grail from ringtones webpages to SEO imagine doing SEO for that amount of time you could have a lot of audience and traffic right now.

As you can see you already passed for a holy grail, and each of the things that you tried are holy grails to do money just find one thing that you are passionate enough do a couple of twists work hard for a couple of years and make side incomes with everything that you learned of the twists.

 

[Hansj80]

You were able to stick to web dev since your ringtone webpages and it would be a holy grail from ringtones webpages to SEO imagine doing SEO for that amount of time you could have a lot of audience and traffic right now.

As you can see you already passed for a holy grail, and each of the things that you tried are holy grails to do money just find one thing that you are passionate enough do a couple of twists work hard for a couple of years and make side incomes with everything that you learned of the twists.

yeah with the ringtone part it developed quite fast and sites popped up left and right and back then my SEO skills were shite


I'm mostly passionate about doing nothing ahha.... but to be honest... what really really makes me smile is doing market manipulation .... and with that i mean human manipulation for marketing purposes. We all do this off course from the moment we decide a font or webpage colour.... but I'm more thinking russian style election manipulation that would some kickass project to work on.

 

[skule]

yeah with the ringtone part it developed quite fast and sites popped up left and right and back then my SEO skills were shite


I'm mostly passionate about doing nothing ahha.... but to be honest... what really really makes me smile is doing market manipulation .... and with that i mean human manipulation for marketing purposes. We all do this off course from the moment we decide a font or webpage colour.... but I'm more thinking russian style election manipulation that would some kickass project to work on.

Then go for it.
Everyone is going to say “that is dead” “you will loss money” etc but if you are passionate for it that will work just a couple of twists and its done

 

[t2van]

Just enough for living costs and I'm good I don't live in New york though and neither in india so still living cost of around 2500usd



very true!



yeah that was a vague statement of me , I was always having multiple ones running on average 3/4 companies at any given time. I would say around 50% of them total were succesfull financially but if you read closely... most of the markets i moved in became saturated or forced to compete at budget prices which makes it not viable to maintain. So those 18 companies in around 18 years... it's more around 3/4 companies which would last on everage between 2/4 years... some less than 1 year and some almost 8/9 years. If I indeed did not have multiple baskets I would indeed be forced to sell potatoes....

p.s. even potatoes are risky business.... small margins and dependable on the crop/weather/regulation etc etc. I aint easy to be a farmer haha




You mean email marketing? email list building ?

Sigh. Farming isn't easy no. But if you stick with "traditional farming" then yes the margins will be tight and farmers will always moan about prices. Source - am a farmer.

Thanks for moving the thread!

I already diversify and have multiple streams in different segments and markets. However it does feel like continue working on things that never really come to full fruition. I have been an chameleon all my life with approaching this self reliance of income as opposed 9 to 5. with it comes obviously these uncertainties which in some countries is the same as being employed.

SEO is surely not dead and I think what you said it is fluid ...so the approach has to be fluid too..


To give a small intro.

1. At 11/12 I build and ran those annoying ringtone websites and made some good money on it back then,
2. At 15/16 I opened my first webdesign company to create websites
3. At 18 it was turned into a hosting company, one of the big ones but also expensive ones....budget hosting companies kind of killed the market then for me and I checked out.. mind you this was during an age where you had to pay for data traffic on your server and harddisk were expensive af and so were servers.
4. At 19 I turned to brick and mortar style and offered laptop/network/pc repairs
5. At 22 I started with RC drones/planes selling them and it ran pretty sweet untill aliexpress and banggood and hobbyking killed the fun for the biggest players in the game and killed them, along with me haha
6. At 26 I started selling licences 3d printers during the hype years and it was not bad but the marges were terrible
7. I thought about porn sites but it's just not my cup of tea
8. So at 30 I was back at with IM and building sites

But the game has changed allot off course and building websites and doing design work has changed also... with fiverr and tons of other places it cuts in your margin. Most of the jobs are grabbed by indians/pakistanis and other asian countries... I understand that because it's a simple living cost difference and I don't hate on them it's a simple equation.... their living costs is 500 usd... mine is 2500 usd ... so yeah their prices is 1/5 of mine haha.

but that does not take away the inevitable of certain things
- as everyone is getting more connnected more potential customers
- more people online also offering services for lower fees as their living cost is less than where you live
- any market you find, it can quickly be saturated or hijacked before it attracts momentum
- any affiliate you get, as soon as they are full they cut you off... like amazon.... unless you start blogging about the best wordpress plugins and create affiliates based on your reviews etc etc... that might work still donno...


Only conclusion I can have and make...
Change is inevitable, so changing your business model is also inevitable. It was just a bit easier like 100 years ago.... you would walk up to a store and it has been run for generations.... but now.... you are at 1 point a business banker then you are doing silly vlogs on youtube... then some blogger.... then back to crypto trading... all in less than 10 years time..... it's just insane and tiredsome.... maybe I was hoping I was the only one and others have an solution....while knowing this a challenge everyone has....

So you not really stuck at anything. Running a "business" at 15 -16 hats off to those who do it but id not call it a business no one is going to give a 200k contract to a 15 year old... You can make money in web design places like fiverr and all those other sites have been around in one form or another I was successful as a designer for over 18 years and was bringing in high 5 to low 6 figures a year doing it!

Price is always going to be a driving factor BUT then you need to avoid those type of customers or not focus your business around it. Thats the problem with service based businesses people set them up with little to no experience, no contacts and no money. What happens next? Rent is due. So they take on the shit list clients promise the moon for $50 and then fail to deliver.

Where as if you got a side line focused on building up a name doing high quality work, looking for the right clients you only need ONE maybe TWO and the doors open.

Well there is some truth to it. I'm close to have at least 18 companies in the last 15 years across 4 countries and 3 continents speaking 4 languages. Not saying this to impress but it is more to emphasize the vast majority of necessary diversification and the fuckups that come with it . If you want to start a business from A to Z I am probably knowledge enough to guide the noobs into it from Legality, paperwork, website, design, influencers, actual press releases, radio etc etc. I even know the whole process of patent filing and actually getting a patent. only thing I have not tried yet is selling potatoes at the corner of the street haha.

It's not easy to always hustle, just wished you could just put 200% of your energy into 1 project and watch it grow... instead before it even grows it being smashed haha

Sounds like you have zero experience. Part of putting energy into something is to watch it grow there will ALWAYS be competition.

I also have had 18+ companies. Two where a business. One broke but set me up, the other is setting the foundations for my kids to take over. The rest are just failures loss of time and money I've even been arrested over my businesses dealings. I also know the ins and outs of patent systems.

But then saying you had 18 companies in 15 years sounds cooler than just being honest.

Is that some kind of sales pitch your pushing advising how to set up a business with everything in place? Is the ebook going to be company no.19?

I think my definition of the holy grail is different. It means using a method/market/niche etc which is guaranteed to bring revenue and it cannot be disputed or challenged by time or change of market ties.

But that is impossible, there is no market which is safe. Even likes of google and facebook either have to buy out growing competition or they have to digg into new markets to stay profitable.... just wishful thinking I guess haha.
I mean even male prostitute does not make much money now does it... no one wants to see my hairy ass sliding down the pole now do they

No offence. BUT the shit your spouting on here from the replies I read you know manure is high in demand? Try and convert some of your posts into sales. Maybe that could be company 20.


If you want ZERO competition go figure out how to run a car of sea water.

 

[Hansj80]

So you not really stuck at anything. Running a "business" at 15 -16 hats off to those who do it but id not call it a business no one is going to give a 200k contract to a 15 year old... You can make money in web design places like fiverr and all those other sites have been around in one form or another I was successful as a designer for over 18 years and was bringing in high 5 to low 6 figures a year doing it!

I didn't stick to it either, in those days there was no fiverr... what you did was going place to place suited up trying to sell webdesign services to companies who just got dial-up connection. Back then indeed 1 customer would pay 5/10 k easily for a design if you met the right company. luckily I did for a while, moved on to the hosting part which again when being first does not always mean you will be the biggest. Very basic at the beginning of it hosting and servers were just really expensive....couple of years later servers and hosting became more easy to start... budget hosting started... then you are kind of stuck with loads of expensive servers that have become obsolute and customers that are fleeing at the same time to budget. I took a gamble and took my profit and checked out because reinvesting that amount of money with no clear end in sight with the budget hostings the market was becoming too volatile. So no .no-one would give a 200k contract to a 15 year old. If you are in disagreement with me about the definition of "business" then please resort to your closest dictionary

Price is always going to be a driving factor BUT then you need to avoid those type of customers or not focus your business around it. Thats the problem with service based businesses people set them up with little to no experience, no contacts and no money. What happens next? Rent is due. So they take on the shit list clients promise the moon for $50 and then fail to deliver.

Where as if you got a side line focused on building up a name doing high quality work, looking for the right clients you only need ONE maybe TWO and the doors open.

As mentioned before if you read my other post, one of the main reason I would scrap it ..was market changes. Customers are driven by price and some by quality... however the amount of people that are driven by price outmatches greatly the amount of people who would pick quality... I like to refer again back to my hosting example and also RC example where giants in the business like horizon hobby and robbe basically had to slash shut down shop everywhere because of aliexpress/hobbyking etc.... so it's effect was felt by market leaders who had been in the game for 30 years.... got wiped out by cheap labor and cheap shipping... nothing against them... just how the market works ey

Sounds like you have zero experience. Part of putting energy into something is to watch it grow there will ALWAYS be competition.

I also have had 18+ companies. Two where a business. One broke but set me up, the other is setting the foundations for my kids to take over. The rest are just failures loss of time and money I've even been arrested over my businesses dealings. I also know the ins and outs of patent systems.

Again, if you are in disagreement with me about the word "experience" please consult your closest dictionary. There will indeed always be competition. I am sorry that your choices lead to your arrest, but very happy that you have found your way back and earn your money in an healthy way. whatever your path has been, you must have had your own personal challenges and growth... I would be the last person to criticize your journey. Whatever it takes to put food on the table mate go for it

But then saying you had 18 companies in 15 years sounds cooler than just being honest.

Please tell me which part has been dishonest? if nothing more... it would actually mean I had a lot of mess ups down the road and some really good ones now what really would be cool if had become the king of the ringtone world and I would have like a sick autobiography selling on amazon telling about the whizkid who started selling ringtones at a young age hahah, dear lord I can already see the front design of it haha.... ....so nothing cool about any of it now right.... it is YOUR perception that I try to come across as cool but not my INTENTIONS...try to change those dark glasses and chill out mate

Is that some kind of sales pitch your pushing advising how to set up a business with everything in place? Is the ebook going to be company no.19?

No lol, I'm a terrible writer and I would not even attempt consultation work. I like to learn and share instead... isn't that the reason we are all on BHW?

No offence. BUT the shit your spouting on here from the replies I read you know manure is high in demand? Try and convert some of your posts into sales. Maybe that could be company 20.

Nothing goods comes out whenever you start the sentence with "no offence..." then follow it with "BUT" .
other examples;

• I'm not a racist BUT
• she is not fat BUT

If you want ZERO competition go figure out how to run a car of sea water.

shucks.... I am too late...
http://www.bbc.com/autos/story/20161010-driving-the-saltwater-sports-car

Then go for it.
Everyone is going to say “that is dead” “you will loss money” etc but if you are passionate for it that will work just a couple of twists and its done

thanks mate!

also others thanks for your views and comments,

 

[t2van]

I didn't stick to it either, in those days there was no fiverr... what you did was going place to place suited up trying to sell webdesign services to companies who just got dial-up connection. Back then indeed 1 customer would pay 5/10 k easily for a design if you met the right company. luckily I did for a while, moved on to the hosting part which again when being first does not always mean you will be the biggest. Very basic at the beginning of it hosting and servers were just really expensive....couple of years later servers and hosting became more easy to start... budget hosting started... then you are kind of stuck with loads of expensive servers that have become obsolute and customers that are fleeing at the same time to budget. I took a gamble and took my profit and checked out because reinvesting that amount of money with no clear end in sight with the budget hostings the market was becoming too volatile. So no .no-one would give a 200k contract to a 15 year old. If you are in disagreement with me about the definition of "business" then please resort to your closest dictionary

I ignored the rest of the waffle.

So when you was 15 you walked up to these companies remember now you already said at 18 you turned that company into a hosting business so I assume you gave up on it... BUT anyway at 15 you walked into these businesses in a suit and got a 5k job?

"At 15/16 I opened my first webdesign company to create websites"

I know the time frame you are referring to not many businesses would dump out 5k when on dial up when print advertising was still a thing and was offering better returns..