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How many times should I link from a PBN?

Discussion in 'Black Hat SEO' started by tiiberius, Oct 10, 2019.

  1. BassTrackerBoats

    BassTrackerBoats Super Moderator Staff Member Moderator Jr. VIP

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    Actually Google detected that in 2009 but the year is not important; the fact is that it is one of the worst SEO strategies in today's world.

    Good old Lemonarian brought us the link wheel which made us a ton of money and when Google found it out we all had to reboot.
     
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  2. GregFromMoonsy

    GregFromMoonsy Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Yes, it's true - however still many people "doing" the SEO in this way.
    The second worse strategy is build the "silo" with much more worse sites as each higher level.
    Also often the tier 3 is the last - what not exists in real interlinked database.

    And here expiring domains doing great job - because we have all tiers done and it's done very well.
    The only bad thing, for expired domains (or deleted) is imposible to hide the footprint - domain registration date.
    With many links from such domains - Google also know that somebody trying play the algo.

    Cheers, Greg.
     
  3. ContentExpert

    ContentExpert Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Ah, the good old easy-to-rank days.
     
  4. BassTrackerBoats

    BassTrackerBoats Super Moderator Staff Member Moderator Jr. VIP

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    The nice thing about Google catching that is I made unreasonable money after it was caught by providing a service that was automated and undid all that damage from the link wheel days.
     
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  5. GregFromMoonsy

    GregFromMoonsy Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    For sure you remember that all changes with new links was visible very quick.
    That was great time to many tests - for which today months are needed.

    When any page was penalized in that time - PageRank was reseted.
    Today the only signal we have - it's search engine visibility, however I was learned how to use it in proper way.

    In that time I was created many PBN sites for one of largest link exchange network.
    Pretty easy and great money, where on each subpage with PR4 you can place 10 links x $2 each.

    For this reason I've created the system, which was able to crawl and detect PR for all subpages.
    So, simple site with 10-30 pages generated $100 - $500 monthly without any hassle where I was paid on auction $100-$400 per domain.

    bhw_image_003.png

    It was pretty nice time ;)
    Also on above image is visible how Moz MR was pretty close to OLD PageRank.

    Cheers, Greg.
     
  6. GregFromMoonsy

    GregFromMoonsy Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Who will say PBN not working :D

    Backlinks_indexer_Twitter2.png
    Backlinks_indexer_Twitter5.png

    What an extremely stupid men :D
    Seems, they need to add new meta tag "Google please rank me better and destroy my competitors"

    Cheers, Greg.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 13, 2019
  7. Shwepps

    Shwepps Regular Member

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    Mind sharing them?
     
  8. tiiberius

    tiiberius Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    That's interesting. Their computing power must be absolutely insane.

    You gave me new inspiration to learn programming (finally) :)

    What language(s) have you written it in?

    Iti s a big problem.

    What you described is a reciprocal link exchange. Their are not fans of that.

    There is no "method" per se.

    I'm just mentioning common scenarios people use to link out from PBNs. Their Pros & Cons.

    You can apply some if it to guest posting I guess.

    I think ideally you want one link per guest post host to your money site.

    So scenario #1.

    Very nice :)

    What was it called?

    Excellent proof indeed.

    Also... these cry babies are so annoying.
     
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  9. GregFromMoonsy

    GregFromMoonsy Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    There is plenty of them, one day I'll create thread about it.
    However I can give you the simple and most repeated examples:

    - 3 tiers silo, pretty unnatural way of build backlinks which NOT EXISTS in natural link building.
    - PBN links from ONLY deleted domains, where domain registration date is the footprint which you can't hide.
    - peak of links without any new content - NOT EXISTS in natural link building ( when no traffic over those links ).
    - peak of links from sites without any traffic PBN's / web2.0 - NOT EXISTS in natural link building.
    - bad anchor text ratio
    - bad freessl/paidssl/nossl ratio
    - bad follow/no-follow ratio
    etc...

    Cheers, Greg.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 13, 2019
  10. GreenGrass2019

    GreenGrass2019 Junior Member

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    But instead of website.com I should link it to the posts right? like website.com/paper/paper-is-great and an anchor text that is related to the post subject.
     
  11. Links-Stream

    Links-Stream Junior Member

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    G
    Thank's for this manual!
     
  12. tiiberius

    tiiberius Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Peak is definitely a problem (unnatural velocity all of a sudden) but no traffic is not. Most of the internet don't have traffic, including legit sites.

    Also, traffic can come from sources search engines cannot track or money site simply isn't using any of their tracking scripts.

    That's totally up to you.

    What are you trying to achieve?

    Glad you like it :)
     
  13. GregFromMoonsy

    GregFromMoonsy Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Google have a lot of tools to confirm the traffic, even in case when you not use any tracking scripts, ex:

    - Chrome
    - Android
    - Google DNS
    - Google Fonts (used by most of WP themes)
    - Google Maps (used often on money sites)
    - Google Captcha
    - SERP click stream

    Google are able to verify in many ways over 60% of traffic, so even with 20 monthly visits - about more than 10 they know.
    It's an illusion that they aren't able to verify it.

    Also each natural link brings the traffic, even if it's just single visit.
    Poor link building don't brings any traffic, so with more such links - Google exactly know that you trying cheat the algo.

    If their algorithm will find such suspicious behavior - they will run another set of algorithms,
    for example rank transition function ( called by mistake - Google dance )

    rankTrans1.png

    Cheers, Greg.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 16, 2019
  14. tiiberius

    tiiberius Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    True. I have PBNs with traffic, links on them get clicked and results are more significant than on those that don't.

    However, even if link is completely hidden from the visitors, so it's impossible to get clicked but it's still visible for googlebot, rankings will improve. So they definitely count.

    Traffic flowing through links is definitively not mandatory.

    No traffic on money site and influx of links, that's another story.
     
  15. GregFromMoonsy

    GregFromMoonsy Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    @tiiberius

    The point is - not to give even ONE single reason of suspicious behavior for Google algo.
    Only then the SEO job is pretty effective and safe.

    By disregarding one signal (which you know) you don't know how much more signals you not considered (which you don't know).
    Because you must to know a lot of Google patents to consider them.

    In my opinion it's very weak point of thinking and not safe for sure, especially in long term perspective.
    So, I am choosing always the best possible methods to stay behind the scene, because its Google scene.

    In additionally you shouldn't give the competitors any sign of your work - the best way here is blog/site with traffic which in reality is the PBN.
    From the PBN with significantly traffic you can give the links to bloggers and receive from them links to your site without any
    anxieties that anybody will be able to discover it - including Google Search Quality team.

    That is the difference - because I am the big friend of bloggers ;)
    Cheers, Greg.
     
  16. GreenGrass2019

    GreenGrass2019 Junior Member

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    Trying to rank posts with keywords using guest posting or backlinking services
     
  17. tiiberius

    tiiberius Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    I agree on the risk reducing and future proofing your campaigns.

    This is relatively easy to do with private blog network.

    However...

    With public ones it becomes very tricky.

    I chose to hide links to actually lower the risk (and it did) because competitors where constantly reporting them, neg-seoing them and de-indexation was terrible.

    Crawlers don't pick them up, and even if they somehow find them, they think the link was removed and it's outdated report so they move on.

    Not to mention crazy things clients are doing with unnatural velocities and over-optimized anchor text.

    It's usually the money site that does something "flag worthy", then PBN gets discovered.
     
  18. tiiberius

    tiiberius Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Looks like we are not on the same page at all.

    This thread is an advice on PBN linking. If you are using services, you have no control over links. You can't use this advice.

    Also, "backlinking services" can be anything.
     
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  19. GregFromMoonsy

    GregFromMoonsy Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    @tiiberius

    In general public PBNs are very risky for at least few reasons.
    But also there are some people who aren't able to build own PBN myself.

    The next thing - all kind of BL crawlers - such Ahrefs, Moz, Majestic etc...
    Ahrefs are pretty easy and quick to block without any footprint, as they use ovh.com

    Moz also is easy to block, they currently use wowrack.com
    But when it coming about the Majestic - they are use much clever crawling methods.

    You need a lot of data from many traffic sites to know all their IP ranges.
    In other case - only robots.txt is the option, which is the footprint.

    For this reason, you can find Majestic in most of robots.txt files.
    Of course, you can block them on User Agent string - but you never know if in reality it is the Majestic.
    Also for example my crawlers testing User Agent for such kind of blocking.

    So, the only effective and safe method is build the real site with traffic.
    And use the links from such PBN via blog / other sites - ONLY in this case you haven't any footprint.

    All the other tricks, such change html link to text can be detected.
    If Google will detect such tricks - they will reset the links power.

    Also when Google will detect some "unnatural" behavior,
    such bad anchor text ratio or any other signs - there is pretty clear - what's come on.

    As I am always repeating - SEO's doing that many mistakes, that even in result they don't know how Google detected them.
    Bad ratio / unnatural link building schema are the most common things.

    Cheers, Greg.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2019
  20. tiiberius

    tiiberius Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Actually, there is another way. Instead of blocking the "bad" guys, you only let the "good" guys in.

    This way nothing is blocked per se and everyone sees what they are supposed to see.

    It's definitely flag worthy as well, however, very few people are doing it like this so it's "safe" for now