Is it time to change PBN with REAL blogs?

[The Gambler]

Hello, everyone,
How are you doing today?

Today I want to discuss with you a subject that most of you will be interesting in knowing about,
Majestic & Ahref... are starting doing some bad sh*t these days,
People who own a PBN will know what I'm talking about here,
Majestic & Ahref bots are starting to reveal PBN, so competitors will report your PBN to google,
I know most of the PBN will not pass a manual review and that will result in big losses, especially if you're running a business with your network (Selling backlinks...).
I know that some of you start to look for solutions to this, but bots are getting smarter every day, so even if we keep fighting we'll lose many blogs in the process.
It's only a matter of time until .htaccess will not be enough to block bots, especially if the bots are using normal browser agents.
This subject will concern even people who own a PBN for personal use, because if your competitors are getting access to your PBN URLs, then it's just a matter of time until Google is blacklisting & deleting your links.

So what's the solution to this?
I think we should step up to the next level of PBN.
I was thinking about this for some time now, and I can only think of one solution to beat this,
Instead of creating a simple PBN, I think it's time to create real websites on good domains.

a real website is :

• Premium theme with a custom logo
  
• Handwriting content with a good quality that's relevant to the niche of the website
  
• Having essential pages (depend on the type of the website): Terms, Privacy policy, contact us...
• Creating social profiles (Fb, Insta...)
• Update the content of the website regularly [1-3 articles per week] (depend on the nature of the website)
• Posting new content to social profiles
• Doing good on-page SEO
• Manage social profiles and try to get some followers to make it look like a real website
• Get a google account for the website with Analytics, Webmaster... (this is the hard part, because you'll need to get creative to do this without leaving a footprint)

If you can make your website look like a real website, then I don't think you need to block any bots,
you'll pass any manual review,
And at the same time, if this is done right, you'll even get more authority and metrics to the domain name, so that's will increase its ranking and the websites you link to.

There's a lot to talk about in this subject, and I like to see what you think of this, and how we can do this more effectively.
And of course, if you have other ideas please feel free to share.

 

[bartosimpsonio]

Present day PBN's should look like real blogs.

If your PBN doesn't look like what you describe as "real blogs", it's not going to work.

 

[The Gambler]

Present day PBN's should look like real blogs.

If your PBN doesn't look like what you describe as "real blogs", it's not going to work.

It's not the case for everyone,
I've seen tons of PBN that in my point of view will not pass a manual review.

 

[MountainGuy]

It's not the case for everyone,
I've seen tons of PBN that in my point of view will not pass a manual review.

I agree, There are a ton PBN's out in the open that are low quality as far as the look ... cant see how they could pass any link juice and the site they are pointing at is #1 ... Could be a lot of other factors at play but it seems like more than coincidence that when I check my free 10 links a site has at #1 often they have sites are(clearly) PBN's for links.

 

[RAYRAY7]

Even the PBNs that look like real sites might not pass manual review. The outbound link ratio is usually the main reason why. Lately, some are presented as "news" type sites that write about everything.

The key is to set up your own PBN with good content and you should be fine. Your content length should be 1,000 plus words per article. None of all that spun crap.

 

[The Gambler]

I agree, There are a ton PBN's out in the open that are low quality as far as the look ... cant see how they could pass any link juice and the site they are pointing at is #1 ... Could be a lot of other factors at play but it seems like more than coincidence that when I check my free 10 links a site has at #1 often they have sites are(clearly) PBN's for links.

The quality of a PBN will affect the quality of the backlinks,
Most people think it's just about the domain metrics, but it's not.

Even the PBNs that look like real sites might not pass manual review. The outbound link ratio is usually the main reason why. Lately, some are presented as "news" type sites that write about everything.

The key is to set up your own PBN with good content and you should be fine. Your content length should be 1,000 plus words per article. None of all that spun crap.

Good point,
For links to other sites, I think the perfect thing is to link to a website only once and the same goes for the article, you should only mention the website once in the article.
For the outbound link ratio, this is where most PBN that offer backlink services to others sucks, especially if the network is small.

 

[magicjones]

1-3 articles per week? I don't even do that much on my money sites, twice a month for money site and MAYBE a new page per 3-4 months on the PBNs. Instead of making it a blog maybe try to make it more of a static resource site. Many, many real organization sites hardly ever update their site yet they have very strong metrics and indexing well. Just my 2 cents.

 

[davids355]

Thread moved.

 

[Backlink Database]

This is exactly what I’m working on right now, though most people would not invest the cost + scalability issue.


Most PBNs tend to outrank the money site itself.

The concept is easy, but implementation is another thing.

 

[bartosimpsonio]

It's not the case for everyone,
I've seen tons of PBN that in my point of view will not pass a manual review.

Those will get nuked rather quickly.

 

[AdultRanks]

Present day PBN's should look like real blogs.

If your PBN doesn't look like what you describe as "real blogs", it's not going to work.

Yup this exactly. It's 2019 why would anyone risk having their PBN's compromised because of a lazy network?

We need to keep these PBN's updated with new content and also new backlinks.

 

[TheStrandDiaries]

Present day PBN's should look like real blogs.

If your PBN doesn't look like what you describe as "real blogs", it's not going to work.

Yup this exactly. It's 2019 why would anyone risk having their PBN's compromised because of a lazy network?

We need to keep these PBN's updated with new content and also new backlinks.

I agree with this.

There's no point in spending time on something if you are not going to do it correctly. It will get hit because people don't want to click into a junk website. The only thing a fake website will produce is a high bounce rate, which leads to a penalty. I have seen many blogs from members here over the years who post their website link on their profile. I would say 98% do not have working social media links on their site. The social media icons are there, but the links lead to nowhere. I have also seen contact pages/contact email address that do not work and bounce back as "email undeliverable". Just those two things alone is enough to lose credibility. Not just with Google, but with customers as well.

The idea is to create a collection of websites that provide quality up front when customers click on your site. Once you have that built, then you sell backlinks as the icing on the cake. I think people are trying to do backlinks first, without having an actual blog.

 

[Matheus Moreira]

In my honest opinion 99% of ANY link building campaign WONT pass a manual review.

You dont need to be a genius to spot a link scheme, no matter the quality of the sites you are putting on it... so in the end it doesnt matter that much if your PBNs are super high quality/legit or not, that is still fake af and still totally against google guidelines.

That being said, if you can sleep better knowing that you are doing "quality work", go ahead and do it, i just dont think its that worth though.

 

[The Gambler]

1-3 articles per week? I don't even do that much on my money sites, twice a month for money site and MAYBE a new page per 3-4 months on the PBNs. Instead of making it a blog maybe try to make it more of a static resource site. Many, many real organization sites hardly ever update their site yet they have very strong metrics and indexing well. Just my 2 cents.

There are many types of websites you can use in your PBN,
1-3 articles a week for a news site in your PBN can be considered low depend on the niche of that website.
But for a static website, you can like add 1 post each week or two depending on the niche and type.

Thread moved.

Thank you.

This is exactly what I’m working on right now, though most people would not invest the cost + scalability issue.


Most PBNs tend to outrank the money site itself.

The concept is easy, but implementation is another thing.

I agree, people invest in the domain but don't invest in the quality of the website (Design, content ...),

Those will get nuked rather quickly.

Yep

Yup this exactly. It's 2019 why would anyone risk having their PBN's compromised because of a lazy network?

We need to keep these PBN's updated with new content and also new backlinks.

Building backlinks for a PBN is really something 99.99% of people don't do,
I think it's something essential.

I agree with this.

There's no point in spending time on something if you are not going to do it correctly. It will get hit because people don't want to click into a junk website. The only thing a fake website will produce is a high bounce rate, which leads to a penalty. I have seen many blogs from members here over the years who post their website link on their profile. I would say 98% do not have working social media links on their site. The social media icons are there, but the links lead to nowhere. I have also seen contact pages/contact email address that do not work and bounce back as "email undeliverable". Just those two things alone is enough to lose credibility. Not just with Google, but with customers as well.

The idea is to create a collection of websites that provide quality up front when customers click on your site. Once you have that built, then you sell backlinks as the icing on the cake. I think people are trying to do backlinks first, without having an actual blog.

Yes, that's what happened when I checked some PBNs here and there,
No social profiles, no contact form is working properly, no essential pages (Privacy policy, terms...)

In my honest opinion 99% of ANY link building campaign WONT pass a manual review.

You dont need to be a genius to spot a link scheme, no matter the quality of the sites you are putting on it... so in the end it doesnt matter that much if your PBNs are super high quality/legit or not, that is still fake af and still totally against google guidelines.

That being said, if you can sleep better knowing that you are doing "quality work", go ahead and do it, i just dont think its that worth though.

That's why I've started this thread.
We should try to be in that 1% that pass a manual review,
so if you can make our websites look natural and legit, then we can pass a manual review easially.

 

[magicjones]

In my opinion the websites that publish too often look spammy more than anything. Unless you are providing many links to clients, why spend the effort in making fake news sites when it's sooo much easier to make a static page that you can add links into. Take a look at a real foundation website and use their model. None of them have very active blogs, so by posting so much I think you actually stand out as a PBN. Example https://agsdcf.com/ See it's a static website but they still update it once a year, that's my model and it works for me well good indexing and less work.

 

[magicjones]

You've got to remember, there is not a big reason for many legitimate foundation websites to be pumping out blog posts. That screams PBN more than anything. So once you start doing that it's clear there is SOME motive for it, which makes me look at the links in the articles they post. Now if it was just a fake foundation website I might not notice if it was set up well enough... just my thoughts.

 

[jonasnarvas]

So if your PBN blog has lets say 20 articles you add only 1 backlink in one of the articles? Or you could add more?

Moreover what is the best way to add the backlink? Just somewhere in the article with keyword anchor text? Looks a little bit unnatural. At the end of the article? Or maybe any other ways?

Finally how do you promote your high quality PBN? It also should get some backlinks?

 

[magicjones]

How many real websites do it is to make a sponsors page or links page example. Many software projects actually have casino and other spammy links on their homepage, yet they still rank first regardless. Also many of these sites sometimes never update for years, or maybe just add one paragraph to the homepage describing changes. Only spam PBNs make tons of crappy blog posts with links in them. If you're not a serious news publisher don't waste your time, too easy to see it's spam IMHO.

 

[The Gambler]

In my opinion the websites that publish too often look spammy more than anything. Unless you are providing many links to clients, why spend the effort in making fake news sites when it's sooo much easier to make a static page that you can add links into. Take a look at a real foundation website and use their model. None of them have very active blogs, so by posting so much I think you actually stand out as a PBN. Example https://agsdcf.com/ See it's a static website but they still update it once a year, that's my model and it works for me well good indexing and less work.

You've got to remember, there is not a big reason for many legitimate foundation websites to be pumping out blog posts. That screams PBN more than anything. So once you start doing that it's clear there is SOME motive for it, which makes me look at the links in the articles they post. Now if it was just a fake foundation website I might not notice if it was set up well enough... just my thoughts.

How many real websites do it is to make a sponsors page or links page example. Many software projects actually have casino and other spammy links on their homepage, yet they still rank first regardless. Also many of these sites sometimes never update for years, or maybe just add one paragraph to the homepage describing changes. Only spam PBNs make tons of crappy blog posts with links in them. If you're not a serious news publisher don't waste your time, too easy to see it's spam IMHO.

That's a good approach, but I do think a PBN should be more diversified,
If for example, I'm going to get backlinks to my money site, I would love to get links from static websites & dynamic ones.
Yes, I know the biggest challenge here is the cost to maintain your PBN, but if you're looking to cut costs by providing spun articles & not updating your PBN, then you're doing something wrong and you'll get caught sooner or later.

So if your PBN blog has lets say 20 articles you add only 1 backlink in one of the articles? Or you could add more?

Moreover what is the best way to add the backlink? Just somewhere in the article with keyword anchor text? Looks a little bit unnatural. At the end of the article? Or maybe any other ways?

Finally how do you promote your high quality PBN? It also should get some backlinks?

It depends on what you want to do with your PBN,
If your PBN is just for your websites:

• 1 Link per Article
• I will link to my money website only 1 time on each blog on my PBN

If you PBN is used to sell backlinks:

• 1 Link per Article
• Between each Article that contains backlink, I would create other ones without backlinks
• I will also link to a website only once on a blog on my PBN
• I will also link to other websites (Very known ones like CNN, Forbes...) on other articles, so the blog will look more real

I will also build high-quality backlinks to my PBN from time to time (Profiles, Social Medias...)
That will make your websites look more real.

 

[magicjones]

That's a good approach, but I do think a PBN should be more diversified,.
but if you're looking to cut costs by providing spun articles & not updating your PBN, then you're doing something wrong and you'll get caught sooner or later.

I see your point but also let me describe why I feel working so hard on PBNs is not even worth the effort.

Because the thing is, with your way you will make the articles good right? Well, if you are writing good articles, you would surely make more returns by posting them on your money sites.

I don't see it as cutting costs by not updating my PBNs. I would rather make the type of website that doesn't need to be updated (think brick & mortar company, organization, software fork, etc.). Simple website with pages only, no posts. Write the entire website in a few hours, make it look like a real business and you're done for the year.

Then you can spend that extra money you saved on more auction domains, which is what really counts in link building.

Just my two cents for readers who are thinking about different ways to do it, good luck anyway you choose