Vegetarians

farfetchedmoney said:

Why there is a large number of vegans that stigmatize the eating of flesh is astonishing. Why can't you just want to be a vegan because you think it would make you more lighter, energetic or something. Why does it has to be attached to some harming animals stuff?

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Money. Their gurus want to expand their customer base and what 's better than using the classic cult tools?
Then again, imagine the huge amounts of money if at some point in the future they can successfully lobby for their "health/moral platform" in the government

jazzc said:

Money. Their gurus want to expand their customer base and what 's better than using the classic cult tools?
Then again, imagine the huge amounts of money if at some point in the future they can successfully lobby for their "health/moral platform" in the government

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The problem is killing other sentient life. It takes decades of activism for nations to realize that killing and opressing the innocent is wrong. Maybe in years to come people like you will evolve to learn compassion for other sentient life

shaddelick said:

The problem is killing other sentient life. It takes decades of activism for nations to realize that killing and opressing the innocent is wrong. Maybe in years to come people like you will evolve to learn compassion for other sentient life

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Shaddelick I admire your dedication. I think you should move on though. They're not going to change, they are greedy gluttons, forget about trying to change their views.

All of you meat eaters should listen this speech! Its
[h=1]The Best Speech You Will Ever Hear[/h]

RacerXar said:

All of you meat eaters should listen this speech!

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I skimmed through it. I especially liked the part where he said that humans are physiologically herbivores. What a crap talk

If that 's the best speech you 've ever heard, I must ask, have you ever visited TED?

these threads always go downhill fast, don't they?

meanwhile, I'm eating homemade bacon and eggs and drinking homemade apple cider...

but, continue what you guys were talking about...

one more point - for you to live, something else must die. Vegetable farming is not without death. millions of deer, mice, raccoons, coyotes, (yes, even people), etc get killed every year so you can eat your veggie burger. That's just life. There is no way to get away from that. You can trick yourself into thinking you are reducing it by going veggie.

But I'm telling you right now, there is more death in that veggie burger than in a roasted rabbit I raised and butchered myself.

And for those of you who like to talk about the sentient life thing, have you ever heard plants make music? google it. Plants are aware and respond to their surroundings, just not in the same ways as animals. Drawing an invisible line in the sand of what to eat/not to eat based on your perception of their sentience is rather egocentric.

Humans evolved around eating meat as part of their diet. There are no vegan civilizations, no long term vegan cultures.

There are ways to produce meat without harmful environmental impact, and the same goes for veggies. You just can't get either of those in WalMart.

i am a veggie and i take veggie 6 days in a week and on sunday i cant control the smell of the non-veg my mother cook.I love animals but i get tempt to what my mom cook.It became habit from childhood .what to do? Its difficult to control it,failed many times stop eating non-veg

shaddelick said:

Again, we are Apes. Humans are apes and we do not need to eat meat.

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humans are very different from the other apes, especially when you compare digestion systems. And by the way, Chimps eat meat, often small monkeys, insects, etc, and they are our closest relatives.

a good case could be made that because we require B12 (only found in meat), we do need meat.

You know the Gorilla deals with that? They eat their own feces. That's right. Gorillas eat shit, because they don't tend to eat enough meat to get the b12 they need.

Like Gorillas, we produce B12 in our large intestine, but it does not get absorbed. So, I say to vegans, you don't have to eat meat to be healthy, just eat shit, instead.

wexzone said:

humans are very different from the other apes, especially when you compare digestion systems. And by the way, Chimps eat meat, often small monkeys, insects, etc, and they are our closest relatives.

a good case could be made that because we require B12 (only found in meat), we do need meat.

You know the Gorilla deals with that? They eat their own feces. That's right. Gorillas eat shit, because they don't tend to eat enough meat to get the b12 they need.

Like Gorillas, we produce B12 in our large intestine, but it does not get absorbed. So, I say to vegans, you don't have to eat meat to be healthy, just eat shit, instead.

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I always say us and other apes eat meat at times, but we dont need to. The reasons the chimps eat monkeys are other then just food. Many scientist are confuse why they do it, but it seems to be more about a dominance thing, not necessity.

B12 is the only argument anyone can have about needing meat. But more research on B12 needs to be done since there is a lot of uncertainty.

Meat isnt the only place to find B12, there is some in sea weed and other sea vegestables. Also it can be made by eating nutrisional yeast. Nowadays B12 is put in a lot of non animal products. You sound bias saying its only found in meat. When you google searched the terms 'what nutrients can only be found in meat' you should have seen there are many ways to get more then enough B12 in our system.

привет;4661429 said:

Shaddelick I admire your dedication. I think you should move on though. They're not going to change, they are greedy gluttons, forget about trying to change their views.

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Some people are just oblivious to what they do to others, other people are just wicked and encourage others to be wicked like themselves. They see nothing wrong with torturing and killing other beings and there families to eat, yet if that were to happen to them and there family i am sure they would be saying what we are saying. I think just like most acts of oppression ends and those being oppressed get there due rights, eventually we will extend that right to all sentient beings. Its not the end of the world per say that someone eats meat, but by raising the issue here, some might begin to give it more consideration.

I figure the amount of suffering that the human animal puts other sentient beings through, it is not such a big deal for me to deal with the headache of defending them here. Its not like its killing me or anything. But your right, i said enough here for now on the innocent ones behalf

shaddelick said:

Meat isnt the only place to find B12

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no, you are right. It can also be found in your feces.

shaddelick said:

When you google searched the terms 'what nutrients can only be found in meat' you should have seen there are many ways to get more then enough B12 in our system.

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there are other nutrients that are found in vegetables, but are inferior in their vegetable form. Vit A is one, Vit D is another.

I don't care what anyone eats, really, but trying to claim that you are healthier and causing less harm by eating veggie burgers and seaweed is being dishonest with yourself.

We've been eating meat for more than a million years. There is no modern vegetable that can say the same thing.

Meat is by far the most nutrient dense food around. I can eat my home raised rabbit, just what will fit on my plate (1 lb), or I could choke down a whole bale of hay (60lbs). They both have similar levels of macronutrients. Which would you choose?

I choose the rabbit, cause hay tastes like shit.

One German guy who's in this sport about power, like lifting, moving a truck in your back, etc. stopped 6 years ago eating any meat. Right after he stopped, his performace curve moved up exponential!

So it's definitely a lot healthier being vegetarian, and it is giving you more power aswell.

You just need the will & a good cook!

madoctopus said:

I don't agree. I'm not in the mood to present my arguments but will give you one single pointer - Shaolin monks and especially students are 100% vegetarian yet they train heavily since dawn to dawn. Does it mean it will work the same for a normal person? Probably not as Shaolin monks also have an extremely healthy lifestyle, clean air, water, natural food, they meditate, are spiritual, etc. However they are proof you can be very healthy just being vegetarian as long as you also take care of other aspects in your life. Otherwise you are very likely to need a certain amount of animal food to get what you need for your diet.

also, to take this to an extreme there are people in the world (only heard of 2 that are currently alive, one from australia I think) that live exclusively on Prana (vital subtle energy) for years. In other words, they don't eat and don't drink anything, they take all the energy they need through they very open/developed chakras directly from the universe. Obviously there are a lot more those who would like to think they do that but actually don't and there are cases where people died while kidding themselves about this.

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Black.Star said:

Well for me humans are animals aswell.
And as a hungry animal I think food is a really good reason to justify killing.

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You missed a point there, Humans are "Social" Animals
and why are we social - it's Wisdom which sets us apart from animals
And wisdom can not let you kill someone just for pleasure (atleast mine won't)
killing an animal for food could be justified if and only if that is your last option for survival but such situation persisted only during the days of "Early Man".

jazzc said:

Morality is a subjective term. We are all free to define our values and shape our thoughts. So, for you, eating meat may be a grotesque act of vandalism. For me, it may be enjoyable. See, everyone 's happy with their own version of the world

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I believe morality is a frequently abused term, people bend truth and reality to suit their own selfish motives, that is not morality, that is what I call hypocrisy. Killing for enjoyment and pleasure can not be moral.

ButcherPete said:

The "holier than thou" attitude of vegans/vegetarians does piss me off, though.

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I believe we all are such sinners that we should leave it to God to decide who is holier and who is not, I think you misunderstood it in the first place itself, it's not that a veggie will be feeling more holier than you; but by being vegetarian you can feel the purity in thoughts and mind. Like I said earlier: As is the food, so is the mind. And obviously by "Vegetarian Food" I mean "Healthy Vegetarian Food".


I've seen some replies saying that Eskimos in polar regions eat meat and even at times I've come across people claiming that meat eating is essential to survive in colder areas(like the polar regions) but there is no scientific explanation supporting this claim, it is nothing but a myth. One can survive and be healthy and fit eating vegetarian food even in polar regions.

To all meat eaters,
Einstein once said: Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance; and rejecting vegetarianism without even trying it out would be utter ignorance, so why don't you try it out and go vegan for a couple of months, eat healthy veggie food and then compare your experience.
Even I was a meat eater for many years, but eventually I gave it up and now its been over an year since I became a vegetarian

Apart from this The United Nations (U.N.) said in a 2006 report that raising animals for food generates more greenhouse gases than all the cars and trucks in the world combined. So apart from reducing our dependence on fossil fuels we could also encourage others to adopt a more ?eco-friendly? vegetarian or vegan diet! (source: http://www.saawinternational.org/introtoglobalwarming.htm)
Livestock is Responsible for 51% of Green House Gas Emissions

I believe saving Mother Earth and being eco-friendly is a reason enough to be vegetarian

You all just need to break it down to natures most simple reasoning: Human beings are meant to eat meat, but eating meat without balancing it out with vegetables is bad. Also, human beings are meant to be ACTIVE. So many people forget to take that into account in this argument/debate.

Of course a lazy meat eater is at more of a risk of health complications than a lazy vegetarian. Red meat contains good stuff as well as saturated fats and cholesterol. How do you combat saturated fats and cholesterol? Exercise. Yes, you have to go outside and run, it's what humans are meant to do.

So, in a nutshell:

If you're going to live on a couch: Don't eat meat.

If you're going to live an active life: A nice steak every once in a while is great.