Who Here Banks Offshore?

Oh, and one last thing - do NOT use a London company to form an overseas corp if you are in the UK. Or an EU one. Or hire a CPA in the USA if you're American.

Deal directly with the professionals located in the jurisdiction so there is no file in a UK / USA office to be handed over in any case

White-Collar said:

(In response to me)


This is one of the things I was taught in my first year of law school. It may not be like this in every country, but it is certainly like this in the United States.

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Yes the US like to do that sort of thing. The bribery example Ronin used above was one I was familiar with.

If you are a U.S. citizen, then the U.S. has personal jurisdiction over you even if you are not located within its territory.

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I better not comment here

If someone is a U.S. citizen then the only way that they can have immunity from U.S. law is to renounce their U.S. citizenship; have that renunciation recognized by the U.S. Federal government; and thereafter to completely stay out of any U.S. territory.

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If you want to renounce your US citizenship it needs to be done PROPERLY.

If the US gov is of the opinion that someone is renouncing to avoid tax they will STILL want to tax that person for quite a few years to come.

So it doesn't even end there

silicon_ronin said:

Hi,

Just a few quick ones...

Many laws do not go with territory only, but with citizenship

For example, where I live you just do not get government contracts without bribing officials. However, any US company that bribes an official, even through their local agent, will get nailed for criminal prosecution at the executive level back in the USA.

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That is a good example of (US) government stupidity. This assures that US companies have little chance of getting contracts in quite a few places on this globe and it puts them at a huge competitive disadvantage in the international market place.

It's common practise here for locals to coerce a US bidder to bribe and win the contract - then hold evidence of this bribery and milk the US company dry by extortion

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Makes sense....

As for UK citizenship and residence - tax is purely on residence.

Regards

Ronin

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AFAIK not for all taxes. At least not as long as you are a UK citizen deemed to be UK domiciled while not being UK resident.

Fantastic thread. Thanks to everyone for taking the time to share so much valuable information. My 2 cents: I know OP isn't American, but Americans who wish to cheat Uncle Sam are best off renouncing their citizenship because you'll get caught eventually.

silicon_ronin said:

Hi,

We had an Australian forcibly rape a 14yo girl where I live and then walk away after bribing a police chief for US$8K. I had him dragged back to Melbourne in handcuffs where he is still rotting in jail. His citizenship nailed him.


Ronin

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I would just like to thank you for doing this. Pedophiles and rapists deserve nothing better than to be killed, or rot to death in jail. Too many foreigners go to developing Asian countries, and hope that they can get away with having sex with children (and there are plenty of locals that engage in these horrible acts, or at least promote it for the foreigners). I'm glad that there are some people out there who make life much more difficult for these assholes.

silicon_ronin said:

Hi,

I use British Virgin Islands (BVI) and Belize companies with a bank account and mailing address in Hong Kong, where income derived offshore is non taxable and the banks welcome foreign companies to open accounts. I'm a Citizen of an EU country that only taxes residents - but I haven't lived there in over 40 years, and I work in an Asian country that only taxes foreigners on locally sourced income, so I don't pay anywhere

My banking is multicurrency and with ATM card and internet access. I've used the same bank and incorporators for various companies in this way over 19 years and it works well

If you are a US Citizen, you're screwed by and large, as your money is needed for bailing out Wall Street and the White House - but OP said he was not.

I would avoid Gibralter or any EU jurisdiction to be honest, the days are numbered

Regards

Ronin

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You have to be joking with BVI.

UK will crack you open in a second.

Plenty of good banking in Europe. Just don't be stupid and pick Switzerland or something. Ever heard of Andorra cracking during its entire history? Been around a lot longer than some crap island haven.

Or even just run your business through Hong Kong. Paying a small flat tax is a lot better than most countries.

silicon_ronin said:

They don't even need to hunt you half the time. One thing they do here is the State Dept cancels the US Citizen's Passport and advises the Immigration Dept of the country you are in that you no longer have a valid travel document. This goes on to the computer. Next time you attempt to renew your visa or enter or exit the country, you are held in custody as an undocumented alien.

...and of course the only country that will accept such a stateless former US citizen is the US

They can short cut an extradition process in this way

So, for starters, if you're going to piss off a government, piss off someone else's and not your own?



Regards

Ronin

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Wrong. You can be a stateless person and reside in a number of countries.

stevesdata said:

I would be really interested in any good solutions / advice for UK residents as I looked into this a while ago and much of the advice was more for US based ppl.

Much of the advice I got last time pointed to the Virgin Islands I believe. There were lawyers that set it up in central London. The only problem is if something shady happens with the country / their govt.

Many thanks for anyone that can help.

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Hmmm. Lets see lawyers set up your corporation in London. The lawyers are members of the BAR. Who runs the BAR? Virgin Islands will roll in an instant.
Privacy, privacy, privacy.

gen3ric said:

Fantastic thread. Thanks to everyone for taking the time to share so much valuable information. My 2 cents: I know OP isn't American, but Americans who wish to cheat Uncle Sam are best off renouncing their citizenship because you'll get caught eventually.

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Renouncing your citizenship is like shooting up a signal flare. Very few people overseas do it. They just live elsewhere indefinitely and never return to America.

I will say it and I will say it once. 75% of the info in this thread is complete crap. Do proper due diligence and don't listen to a bunch of people who are bs'ing or you may end up in prison.

newmanhia said:

You have to be joking with BVI.

UK will crack you open in a second.

Plenty of good banking in Europe. Just don't be stupid and pick Switzerland or something. Ever heard of Andorra cracking during its entire history? Been around a lot longer than some crap island haven.

Or even just run your business through Hong Kong. Paying a small flat tax is a lot better than most countries.



Wrong. You can be a stateless person and reside in a number of countries.



Hmmm. Lets see lawyers set up your corporation in London. The lawyers are members of the BAR. Who runs the BAR? Virgin Islands will roll in an instant.
Privacy, privacy, privacy.



Renouncing your citizenship is like shooting up a signal flare. Very few people overseas do it. They just live elsewhere indefinitely and never return to America.

I will say it and I will say it once. 75% of the info in this thread is complete crap. Do proper due diligence and don't listen to a bunch of people who are bs'ing or you may end up in prison.

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Do you have an alternative to propose?

I am a European citizen but currently living in Australia and wondering how best to manage my tax affairs. Could it be worth a quick trip to Hong Kong to open up and account there?

newmanhia said:

You have to be joking with BVI.

UK will crack you open in a second.

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I've been using BVI companies, with HK virtual office and banking, for numerous ventures over a span of two decades (which is a tad longer than a second)

Structured properly through competent people it works well

newmanhia said:

Been around a lot longer than some crap island haven.

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The BVI is the world's most popular offshore haven and many of the newer ones model their laws on the BVI because it works

newmanhia said:

Or even just run your business through Hong Kong. Paying a small flat tax is a lot better than most countries.

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I do run my (BVI) business through Hong Kong and pay zero tax as does all income not earned in HK. I learnt this whole structure in 1990 from a mega-wealthy HK business dynasty I had the privilege of working with then. The patriarch had over 200 ventures and companies, all of them held in separate BVI companies for privacy and spin-off value, with HK office and banking. They walked me through opening my first BVI incorp. Oh, and they're still mega-wealthy post crash. The majority of BVI companies are owned by offshore Chinese, it was the HK money that put BVI on the map

newmanhia said:

Wrong. You can be a stateless person and reside in a number of countries.

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Not in the one I'm living in. They put you in an immigration detention centre inside a military base (Camp Diwa Bago, South of Manila) where you don't even get fed. I visited a poor German left to rot there some years ago.

newmanhia said:

Hmmm. Lets see lawyers set up your corporation in London. The lawyers are members of the BAR. Who runs the BAR?

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I posted earlier in this thread that you should never use local professionals to set up an offshore structure - you set it up using offshore resources

newmanhia said:

Virgin Islands will roll in an instant.

newmanhia said:

US Birgin Islands or BVI

newmanhia said:

Privacy, privacy, privacy.

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Exactly why I use BVI

I have no doubt that if a government with clout wanted my details from the BVI, they could lean on someone and get them

Fortunately, as my BVI company (under BVI Law) is not required to submit accounts (or even keep them) or hold meetings or keep detailed records or ever submit anything except an annual filing fee - they don't know zip about me here

A BVI company is a license to operate anywhere in the world. As long as you pay the yearly fee that's it - don't ask / don't tell

newmanhia said:

Renouncing your citizenship is like shooting up a signal flare. Very few people overseas do it.

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Renouncing US Citizenship is the ONLY way to legally NOT pay US taxes

newmanhia said:

They just live elsewhere indefinitely and never return to America.

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Sure, they do here. An hour's drive from my home in the Philippines is Angeles City, the red light capital of the Philippines and home to thousands of retired US military who do just that. They hide away, never file a tax return, think they got away with it...

Then one day their close family back home is ill or dead and they want to visit for a goodbye or a funeral. Or they get seriously ill and cannot afford or get treatment here - but they can get VA treatment stateside for free. So they sneak back home and the Feds are waiting with the handcuffs.

I've seen this often enough.

That kind of advice WILL get you in jail

Cheers

Ronin

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firstrate said:

Do you have an alternative to propose?

I am a European citizen but currently living in Australia and wondering how best to manage my tax affairs. Could it be worth a quick trip to Hong Kong to open up and account there?

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I started my first offshore corp when I was living in Perth, West Oz, and doing business in HK and SE Asia. The rules have tightened since, you would have seen those recent prosecutions over Vanuatu including Glenn Wheatley and others.

HSBC HK allows you to open an account just by walking in with a passport and an opening deposit. They are linked tightly to HSBC Australia making it easy to move money in minutes.

If you incorporate offshore you are required to pay tax on any company you effectively control but don't have the same benefit in offset for losses, they stack the deck nicely. You can however have the offshore company receive all the offshore income, make sure all offshore costs including your own overseas are paid by this entity, and minimise income nicely away from the same level of scrutiny you would have down under with a Pty Ltd.

For starters though I would definitely recommend opening a HK bank account simply as an escape vehicle if need be. Park some money for just in case.

If you open an account in HK, use your European Passport. As a European residing in Australia you are required to pay Aussie tax, not European tax in most most cases. If info is going to be reported, let it be reported to the authorities who do not currently have a claim on your income.

Hope that helps

Ronin

newmanhia said:

You have to be joking with BVI.

Ever heard of Andorra cracking during its entire history? Been around a lot longer than some crap island haven.

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Yes, Andorra caved in a few years ago after EU pressure.

Wrong. You can be a stateless person and reside in a number of countries.

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Unfortunately being stateless causes more trouble than it solves

Renouncing your citizenship is like shooting up a signal flare. Very few people overseas do it. They just live elsewhere indefinitely and never return to America.

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Like Ronin said, for US citizens, it is the ONLY way to do it. IF you renounce you need to do it PROPERLY or they will STILL want to tax you for years after you renounced.

I will say it and I will say it once. 75% of the info in this thread is complete crap. Do proper due diligence and don't listen to a bunch of people who are bs'ing or you may end up in prison.

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I would agree with that, but that only

What about this solution:

Open a personal bank account in Switzerland/Lichtenstein and go the bank personally when you need money. As far as I know you can have 10.000EUR with you when going to another country. Grab 2 friends withdraw 30.000EUR if you need that much and your country will never know that money existed or am I wrong?????

I don't live far from Switzerland. Is this a good solution for me? (I don't want to open a company)

any thoughts?

Not much of you know much about the actual law concerning Americans. Please read up on the CFC laws. (Controlled Foreign Corporations) It is basically a legal way for internet marketers to no pay taxes on foreign earnings they physically do not take possession of. There are almost no more "secret" as in they won't give up your info tax havens anymore as the West has been cracking down on these countries, and they cracked. There are no more European tax havens, all the former tax havens in Europe HAVE DIVULGED tax information to the IRS on some of their US clients. (But not all)

There are still tax havens, but almost all will sell you out in a minute for aid benefits. Why do something illegally, when you can legally not pay taxes. Consulting on this type of stuff usually costs thousands, and the best of these lawyers are in the Southern US Florida/Texas. Offshorepress has some good info on this in one of their books.

Switzerland will "stop" their banking privacy in january 2010 for most EU countries

Somebody mind telling me if and what things changed? I am pretty much in the same situation as OP was, I'm also from Europe -> Austria. Need to gather as much information about paying less taxes, anonymity and so on, not that information from an internet board is very reliable there but it's something. Also looking for professionals who can help there.

I will probably start a new thread in the next few days but wanted to bring this one back already for discussion.

Thanks!

Hi,

i found a good proider for all needs:

http://www.asiabs.com

Does anyone know a good and stable credit card solution for offshore companies ? ( no 3rd party scammers )