Wealth Inequality in America

In my opinion Americans actually don't understand how much they are wealth. In USA you can have even lousy 9-5 job and still be able to live better than high middle class in most other countries excluding EU.
I genuinely think that present tax system is good, of course it can be better but the thing I would change is Education Fees. Education in US is really expensive!!!! Some of the best colleges are almost 50000 $ per year! compered to germany where it is less than 2000$ (don't know the real figure this is Aprox.) one must be blind not to see why german are more successful and have brighter future. Their average joe is more educated than 'merican average joe.
pardon me for grammar or any other mistakes I'm not native speaker.
 
Good reason not to be a bottom feeder. Elevate yourself, most top 1%ers started from the bottom too. I don't want anyone telling me how my wealth should be distributed, I don't expect america to tell its citizens that either. Everyone has the same opportunity.
 
Everyone has the same opportunity.

I can agree with everything you've said but this.

Not everyone has the same opportunity.

Someone born in a poor family will not have the same opportunity as someone born in a middle class family.

You can't exactly blame the person for being born in a poor family, neither can you blame the parents for being born poor.
 
take a look at how the poor often spend their time and their money:

* watching reality shows.
* watching sitcoms.
* watching sports.
* reading tabloids.
* hanging out with friends.
* buying junk food.
* buying cigarettes and alcohol.
* buying recreational drugs.
* buying lotto tickets.
* posting to facebook and twitter.

now...

take a look at how the rich often spend their time and their money:

* getting educated about financials.
* watching the markets.
* starting businesses.
* networking with like-minded people.
* saving money.
* buying stocks.
* buying bonds.
* buying annuities.
* planning for tomorrow.
* reading financial publications.

i work in finance so i get to meet those on both sides of the track, and i can tell you the choices that people make daily play a far greater role in their socioeconomic position than any "conspiracy" to keep them down. many people do a fine job of holding themselves back.

for example, buying liabilities instead of investing in assets is one of the biggest differences between the classes, and lottery winners are a good example of this practice. after they blow their money on things that lose value they're worse off than before.

the wealth inequality shows that some people take action, while others don't.
 
Most of the wealthy people have paid their dues, and if you work hard and continue to invest in yourself and businesses, well then later in life you can position yourself to have the power to control things to be most beneficial to yourself.
 
what would you expect ? for Bill Gates and Rockefeller to give away their money to poor people. This planet cannot work like that, USSR have already tried it and look what happened.
Every day there is some amount of people who become millionaires and I bet they worked very hard for it.
you can't sit on your lazy ass and expect to be equal with people who are working their ass off.
 
I can agree with everything you've said but this.

Not everyone has the same opportunity.

Someone born in a poor family will not have the same opportunity as someone born in a middle class family.

You can't exactly blame the person for being born in a poor family, neither can you blame the parents for being born poor.

Twenty One Billionaires Who Started With Nothing


Sheldon Adelson
Age: 77


"Sheldon Adelson grew up the son of a cab driver in Boston's rough Dorchester neighborhood. He started selling newspapers at the age of 12 and later dropped out of college to become a court reporter. According to The New York Times, Adelson sold toiletry kits to motels and tried mortgage brokering, then struck it rich when he founded Comdex, an annual computer trade show. He went on to build Las Vegas hotels around conventions, rather than casinos?not that he left the casinos out. At the end of 2006, The Times has estimated, Adelson's net worth had grown by about $1 million an hour for two straight years."


Carl Berg
Age: 73


"At the age of 10, Carl Berg's father died and his schoolteacher mother was left to raise him alone in rural New Mexico. To pay his way through college, Berg repaired vending machines at day and worked as a clerk at what Berg called "the best hotel in town" at night. Berg took the hotel job with the goal of meeting someone that would give him a job in investment banking. "My theory worked fine," Berg says and explained that he eventually approached a regular who turned out to be the largest home builder in the country. The man offered Berg a job in the local office. "I would call all the time and raise hell about way they were running the home office," Berg says. "When I got ready to graduate college, he said 'Berg, if you're ready, you can come run the mortgage company.'" Eventually, Berg used the skills he learned in the mortgage business to make a real estate fortune in Silicon Valley. From there, he branched out into venture capital, a business he continues today. "The way I'm approaching it is, I'm trying to give someone else the opportunity that I had," Berg says. "I do everything I can to make the company succeed." Today, Berg is chairman and chief executive of Cupertino (Calif.)-based Mission West Properties (MSW), a giant real estate investment trust."


Stephen Bisciotti
Age: 50


"Stephen Bisciotti's father died when Bisciotti was just eight years old, leaving his mother to raise three children alone. Bisciotti worked his way through school and went into the temporary help business after graduating from Salisbury State in Maryland. At 23, Bisciotti and his cousin founded a high-tech temp agency in a basement office; sales reached $1.5 million in the first year. He built that company into Allegis Group, now among the nation's top staffing firms, and stayed true to his Maryland roots in 2004, when he bought the Baltimore Ravens National Football League team."


Leon Charney
Age: 72


"Leon Charney made more than a billion dollars from real estate investments, especially in properties around Manhattan's Times Square. The Leon Charney Report, his weekly cable TV show, states that his "rise to international prominence is a classic 'American Dream' story." Charney started amid humble beginnings as the child of immigrant parents. His father's death while Charney was young left the family destitute. Charney worked his way through college and law school, singing at times for money. (He still serves as a cantor.) With $200 in the bank, he started a law firm and first came to prominence advising President Jimmy Carter on the 1978 Camp David Accords."


John Paul DeJoria
Age: 66


"No stranger to hard times, John Paul DeJoria was born to immigrant parents and spent time in an East Los Angeles foster home. Following two years in the U.S. Navy, his odd jobs included stints as a janitor and gas station attendant. At times he was homeless. DeJoria worked his way up in hair care and cosmetic companies before joining with Paul Mitchell in 1980 to launch a hair products company, putting up an initial investment of just $700. The packaging was printed in black-and-white because color printing was too expensive."


Larry Ellison
Age: 66


"Ellison was born in Brooklyn to a single mother, who asked an aunt and uncle to raise him in Chicago. According to the Academy of Achievement, Ellison dropped out of college and drove to California after his adoptive mother died. There, he held odd jobs for eight years before founding a software development company in 1977. That venture is today known as Oracle (ORCL), one of the world's largest technology companies. This year, Ellison achieved a dream in the realm of sailing when he won the America's Cup and brought the oldest trophy in international sports back to the U.S. for the first time in 15 years."


Alan Gerry
Age:81


"The son of Russian immigrants, Gerry dropped out of high school to join the Marines. He started a tiny television repair business after training via the G.I. Bill. In 1956, starting with $1,500 saved from his business, Gerry borrowed $20,000 to create a cable company and worked from the ground up, borrowing carefully without equity partners or initial stock offerings. By the time he sold to Time Warner Cable (TWC) in 1996, Cablevision Industries had become the country's eighth-largest cable provider, with 2,500 employees and 1.3 million subscribers. "We were filling a need," Gerry says. "People were so hungry for television.""


Alec Gores
Age: 57


"Raised in Nazareth, Israel, Alec Gores moved with his family to Flint, Mich., at the age of 15. Members of his extended family were in the area and he worked at everything from stocking shelves to being a butcher at his uncle's grocery store while obtaining computer science and math degrees at Western Michigan University. On graduating, Gores started a company to sell software and hardware to small and midsized businesses. After selling it to Continental Telephone in the early 1980s, he realized he no longer wanted to start businesses from scratch, so he started buying promising companies he believed were underperforming. Today, with $2.7 billion under management, Gores Group has acquired more than 80 companies since 1987 in the areas of industrial equipment, technology, telecommunications, health care, and business services."


Harold Hamm
Age: 64


"Harold Hamm grew up milking cows, gathering eggs, and feeding chickens. The youngest of 13 kids born to sharecropper parents in Oklahoma, Hamm says that he hardly remembers a time when he wasn't working. "We came up working for the family unit," Hamm says. "You certainly learned quickly to do your part." At the age of 20, he bought a water pump truck to deliver drilling fluids and service drilling rigs. "That is the company that became Continental Resources (CLR)," Hamm says. "It was a very meager start." He says he raised his kids in much the same way he grew up. As his fledging company got off the ground, Hamm's wife kept the books and his daughter, starting as young as six, would answer telephones. At the end of last year, the Enid (Okla.)-based company estimated its proved reserves at 257.3 million barrels of oil, with interests in 2,317 wells. Continental Resources generated $627.7 million in revenue, according to the company's 10-K. Hamm remains at the helm. As he puts it: "I get as much excitement going to work today as I did when I was 20 years old."


George Joseph
Age: 89


"Born to a Lebanese restaurateur in West Virginia, George Joseph flew a B-17 in World War II and returned home to earn a degree at Harvard University on the GI Bill. When he graduated, he started working for Occidental Life as a systems analyst by day and an insurance salesman by night. "I learned a lot about the insurance business during this time and it opened my eyes to some opportunities in other areas," says Joseph. He applied what he had learned to a new model of selling auto insurance that covered all risk areas. He founded Mercury General (MCY) in 1962 and built the Los Angeles-based insurer into a company with 2009 revenues of $3.1 billion."


Kirk Kerkorian
Age: 93


"Kerkorian started earning money for his Armenian-immigrant family at the age of 9, according to the Las Vegas Review-Journal. He dropped out of eighth grade to become a boxer known as "Rifle Right Kerkorian" and earned his first serious paychecks ferrying bombers across the Atlantic Ocean for Britain's Royal Air Force during World War II. He turned his flying practice into an airline and eventually went into constructing many of Las Vegas' biggest hotels. Kerkorian later branched into buying troubled companies such as automakers through Beverly Hills (Calif.)-based Tracinda. He has been Detroit's rescuing angel and menacing demon through various rounds of owning stock in General Motors (GM), Chrysler, and Ford (F). Since recession set in, Kerkorian and Tracinda have quit automotive stocks and diversified."


Ken Langone
Age: 75


"Born to a plumber and a cafeteria worker in Roslyn Heights, N.Y., Kenneth Langone dug ditches and worked as a caddy while at Bucknell University. To help pay for school, his parents mortgaged their home. Langone later earned an MBA at New York University on a part-time basis. His first fortune came in 1968, when he partnered with Ross Perot to take Electronic Data Systems (HP) public. In the 1970s he teamed with Bernard Marcus to start Home Depot (HD), which they eventually took public in 1981. Langone hasn't kept the rewards all to himself: In 1999?and again in 2008?he reportedly gave New York University separate gifts of $100 million."


Ralph Lauren
Age: 71


"Ralph Lauren graduated high school in the Bronx, then dropped out of college to serve in the Army reserve. Next he worked as a clerk at Brooks Brothers, then toiled as a tie salesman?which caused him to decide that men were ready for wider, brighter designs. According to a profile in Time, Lauren sold $500,000 worth of ties in 1967, the year he started designing them for St. Louis-based Beau Brummell Cravats. The next year, he started Polo (RL) with $50,000 from clothier Norman Hilton. The company tallied $5 billion in revenue during its 2010 fiscal year."


Carl Lindner Jr.
Age: 91


"In 1938, when Carl Lindner Jr. was 19, most milk was delivered by milkmen. Carl Lindner Sr. came up the idea of selling milk from the family's dairy farms in grocery stores, eliminating a lot of delivery costs. Carl Jr. and three siblings helped support the family by running milk routes through the Depression, then expanded the business into what would become one of the Midwest's largest chains of convenience stores, Cincinnati-based United Dairy Farmers. Eventually Lindner branched into insurance and real estate. From 1999 to 2006, he owned a controlling interest in the Cincinnati Reds of Major League Baseball."


David Murdock
Age: 87


"Homeless and with little more than a few cents to his name after serving in World War II, David Murdock borrowed $900 from a Good Samaritan. He bought a diner in Detroit and flipped it for a profit of $700, then used the proceeds to buy a car to drive to Arizona. In the desert Southwest, he started building homes, starting a real estate empire that grew to include Dole Foods Co., Castle ? Cooke, and nearly all of the island of Lanai, Hawaii. Murdock's credo is listed on the company website: "To do the impossible, you must see the invisible."


Thomas Peterffy
Age: 65


"Born during a Russian bombing raid in 1944, Thomas Peterffy moved to New York in 1965, as a refugee from communist Hungary. He spoke no English when he arrived, but found a job as a draftsman, according to Forbes. In 1977, he bought a seat on the American Stock Exchange and shocked traders in the early 80s when he brought an early handheld computer to the floor. The company that eventually grew out of that seat on the AMEX became Interactive Brokers Group. According to a November of 2005 profile in Interactive Brokers, Peterffy wrote computer code in his head while trading during the day then went back to the office later to apply computer models to trading. Those early uses of computers made him a pioneer in the field. Today, the company website claims Interactive Brokers logs more than one million trades per day. "


Howard Schultz
Age: 57


"Howard Schultz grew up in a Brooklyn housing project, where his father worked from one blue collar job to the next. After attending college on a football scholarship, Schultz worked at Xerox (XRX) and in 1979 became general manager for Swedish drip coffee maker Hammarplast. This led him to a small Seattle chain called Starbucks Coffee Co. In 1987 he acquired the company's retail unit for $3.8 million. Today Starbucks (SBUX) operates more than 17,000 stores in almost 49 countries, generating more than $10.7 billion in 2010 revenues. Schultz told Portfolio.com in 2008 that his decision to provide health insurance to employees who work more than 20 hours a week was due to a period of time his father spent laid-up with a broken ankle. When Schultz was named a recipient of the Horatio Alger Award, he told the Horatio Alger Assn. that his parents were essentially "working poor" who had been unable to live the American Dream. "My story is as much one of perseverance and drive as it is of talent and luck. I willed my dreams to come true," Schultz said."


Kenny Troutt
Age: 62


"The son of a bartender, Kenny Trout grew up in Mt. Vernon, Ill. He sold insurance to get through Southern Illinois University. In 1988, Troutt founded Excel Communications, a company that grew to be the fourth-largest long distance carrier in the country in just seven years. Troutt retired in 1999 and turned some of his attention to racehorses. This year his horse, Super Saver, won the 136th Kentucky Derby."


Albert Ueltschi
Age: 93


"At the height of the Depression and still in high school, Albert Ueltschi opened a hamburger stand to earn money with the goal of learning to fly. Using the eatery as collateral, he bought a bi-wing airplane with $3,500 he borrowed. According to a profile in The Warren Buffett CEO: Secrets of the Berkshire Hathaway Managers, a book by Robert P. Miles, Ueltschi sold rides, put on airshows, and eventually flew clients around the country. In 1951 he borrowed $15,000 to start FlightSafety International, a company to train pilots. Ueltschi sold it to Warren Buffet for a reported $1.5 billion in 1996."


Oprah Winfrey
Age: 56


"Born in poverty in Mississippi and raised in Milwaukee, Oprah Winfrey moved to Nashville in 1968 to live with her father. Two years later, she won a scholarship to attend Tennessee State University. At 19 she was hired as Nashville's first African American TV correspondent. In 1983, she relocated to Chicago to take on the AM Chicago talk show later renamed The Oprah Winfrey Show. Her work in movies, radio, and publishing built an influential business empire. The first African American to appear on Forbes' billionaires list, Winfrey has frequently been the sole African American to make the roster."


Source: http://images.businessweek.com/slideshows/20101123/twenty-billionaires-who-started-with-nothing
 
Oprah Winfrey
Age: 56


"Born in poverty in Mississippi and raised in Milwaukee, Oprah Winfrey moved to Nashville in 1968 to live with her father. Two years later, she won a scholarship to attend Tennessee State University. At 19 she was hired as Nashville's first African American TV correspondent. In 1983, she relocated to Chicago to take on the AM Chicago talk show later renamed The Oprah Winfrey Show. Her work in movies, radio, and publishing built an influential business empire. The first African American to appear on Forbes' billionaires list, Winfrey has frequently been the sole African American to make the roster."

correct me if i'm wrong but 2.7$ billion from a tv show and a 165$ million/year salary ? seriously ?
maybe i'm missing something but something is not right about it :)
 
you can't sit on your lazy ass and expect to be equal with people who are working their ass off.

That's understandable. Most people seem to believe that they are entitled to wealth just because they were born. They moan about how others have it better of and how it's easier for them to make a living, but what they don't see is the work these people do. I've seen these types of people and most of them do fuck all with their lives. They expect to have fun and enjoy life while doing nothing.

When speaking of wealth in these terms, I have no issues with wealth distribution at all. But when I first came into this thread, my impression on the matter of wealth wasn't to do with people who don't work. It was to do with the way the monetary system works and the way peoples taxes are used.

And then I got confused about what the whole thread was about.
 
Nice list of "rags to riches" grandmas and grandpas. Thanks. For me a few millions would be enough!
D.
 
Central banking is the problem. If our Government would print their own money instead of letting the privately owned Federal Reserve issue currency with interest to our government this would not be a problem. It would be a level playing field for all, but there would still be a huge curve because the FED could not print money with nothing to back it other than the taxes the government steals and exploits from us at incredible rates. I am currently paying between 40 and 50% of my income in taxes as many other middle income to upper income. It would stop the 1% from gaining too much power, which is derived from money.

I don't think you completely understand how the Federal Reserve works, and I'm also surprised at the amount you pay in taxes. For the first part, while the Federal reserve does have private parts, by and large it is a governmental entity. Their board of governors is appointed by the commander in chief, and these appointments approved by the senate. The Federal Reserve is actually ENTIRELY constitutional, so I'm not sure what you're arguing about and how it's "printing of money", or controlling of the monetary supply would help leveling the playing field.

Secondly, why are you not minimizing your taxed income through other means? Be it deferred investment & retirement vehicles (401k's, IRAs), reduction of income through "paper losses" granted through "deferred maintenance" in real estate, or other deferred income realization. It amazes me that 40-50% of your income would go to taxes, especially in America. Maybe in Sweden, Norway, or Finland - who have such socialistic taxes, or unless you are an "independent filer" banking upwards of $183,251 a year would 40% or MORE of your income be in taxes. Is this the case? If not, I smell a pile of shit.

I can go into great detail about WHY our wealthy inequality came into play, but that would be a large wall of text into itself. Let me know if you're interested in learning more.
 
The idea of wealth "inequality" is just stupid...

If you had a good idea, marketed it, expanded it, and became a millionaire, would you want people telling you what to do with your money? The people who make these videos want it to be "fair", they do that with higher taxes, and more laws/regulations. If they want a strong middle class, they need to realize that punishing the "upper" class for their accomplishments is not the way to achieve that.
 
What would the list of Billionaires that started off with millions and/or billions look like?

"Just Anyone" can win the lottery too, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea to rely on that for your retirement.
 
Wealth Inequality is Life, Wealth Equality is Bull Shit a Lie
 
You have to be very, very careful whenever you are presented graphs that represent statistics on the internet because they are, almost without question, incorrect or misleading.

When leading with something like distribution of wealth, it is generally separated by order of magnitude rather than a bar graph.

Think about it like this: Bill Gates has given over half (50%) of his wealth to charity. He is still the 2nd richest man in America.

So how will that graph look if I manipulated it to represent Bill Gates?

Bill Gates has ~100Billion dollars, making him the richest in a nation of 300 million and therefore puts him in the top 99.9999997% of people in wealth.

He gives away 50% of his wealth, yet he is still in the same percentile.

Nothing is "messed up", basically the easiest way to not be poor is to not be poor. It might be difficult to grasp unless you study economics and statistics however the distribution of the wealth to a smaller group of people is the natural end-game of the capitalist society; in theory if there is no monopolization laws then capitalism will actually end with a winner who controls the means, production and wealth of an entire society.

Now, why the cost of living is so difficult for the lower 20% is an entirely different sociological issue completely unrelated to how much wealth the upper class have (in fact, if the top 20% removed their wealth from a society and invested elsewhere in foreign lands it wouldn't affect the socio-economic condition of the country).

There are so many factors such as the unregulated nature of insurance, hospitals, doctors and patients which make healthcare unaffordable.

There are infrastructure inefficiencies that are completely grievous in regards to the education sector which creates an unskilled workforce, or lessen the value of a tertiary qualifications that creates shortages in the labour force.

Basically, one animated graph with a voiceover is such a misleading representation of what is wrong and what could be done; so don't trust everything you hear or read the Internet.

This post included. I'm a right-wing libertarian so I suffer cognitive biases and preferences yet I can intellectualize that economic theory is nowhere near sophisticated enough to come up with answers to sociological issues on a macro scale. You should realize this too and make any and all interpretations based on your moral philosophical , not someone else's.
 
go back to the constitution and all will be fine but the 99% hate the constitution and liberty and demand they be regulated. people hate to be free and are scared of it.
 
in theory if there is no monopolization laws then capitalism will actually end with a winner who controls the means, production and wealth of an entire society.

This is probably the most absurd statement I 've heard against capitalism for quite a while. I can't even begin to think what kind of confusion of ideas led to it :o Let me guess; was the last book you 've read in economics written in 1867? :D

I'm a right-wing libertarian so I suffer cognitive biases and preferences yet I can intellectualize that economic theory is nowhere near sophisticated enough to come up with answers to sociological issues on a macro scale. You should realize this too and make any and all interpretations based on your moral philosophical , not someone else's.

There is a huge confusion of such terms due to widespread abuse/misuse worldwide (e.g. the term "liberal" in Europe is more or less the opposite of what "liberal" is in US) so out of curiosity, what defines a right-wing libertarian where you live? (e.g. to me these terms together make no sense)
 
Last edited:
It might be difficult to grasp unless you study economics and statistics however the distribution of the wealth to a smaller group of people is the natural end-game of the capitalist society; in theory if there is no monopolization laws then capitalism will actually end with a winner who controls the means, production and wealth of an entire society.

This is probably the most absurd statement I've heard against capitalism for quite a while.

The statement is no more absurd than the Libertarian belief that unfettered capitalism should ultimately result in utopia.

I'd like to know of one example, one country, that best exemplifies that a completely unregulated economy somehow raises the quality of life of all it's citizens.
 
The statement is no more absurd than the Libertarian belief that unfettered capitalism should ultimately result in utopia.

Each man has his own utopia, so your statement is unprovable. On the other hand, his statement is easily provable wrong deductively and even empirically.

I'd like to know of one example, one country, that best exemplifies that a completely unregulated economy somehow raises the quality of life of all it's citizens.

Open a history book and you will be amazed. For your convenience, lots of industrial countries in the 19th century, with the great leader being the US.
 
Back
Top