Suspicious BST Reviews

ContentExpert said:

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Use the report button with proof please.

How can we provide proof? We can't see the backend of BHW. We can't see IP's, PayPal adresses, PM's etc.
So how can we get proof.. exactly, we can't.

But we all know it because we all use common sense.

Jayder said:

How can we provide proof? We can't see the backend of BHW. We can't see IP's, PayPal adresses, PM's etc.
So how can we get proof.. exactly, we can't.

But we all know it because we all use common sense.

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Well, you are wrong once again and it is getting tiresome from you.

BassTrackerBoats said:

Well, you are wrong once again and it is getting tiresome from you.

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He's right though.

People can't see very much, other than report accounts that look suspicious how can mods expect members to have proof when they can't see anything other than a username and a post?

Can you give an example of the kind of proof you expect people to share when they report posts?

Mods constantly say what you're saying, but no one ever shares what moderators mean when they say "give us proof".

It's a circular argument, we can't provide proof due to limited information, you won't look into it unless proof is provided.... meanwhile people using fake accounts and fake reviews keep profiting from a forum.

All this does is encourage people to use fake reviews as they know at this point mods won't look into it.

SlappinDaBees said:

He's right though.

People can't see very much, other than report accounts that look suspicious how can mods expect members to have proof when they can't see anything other than a username and a post?

Can you give an example of the kind of proof you expect people to share when they report posts?

Mods constantly say what you're saying, but no one ever shares what moderators mean when they say "give us proof".

It's a circular argument, we can't provide proof due to limited information, you won't look into it unless proof is provided.... meanwhile people using fake accounts and fake reviews keep profiting from a forum.

All this does is encourage people to use fake reviews as they know at this point mods won't look into it.

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We get reports where people are 'reselling' services and the report states; ' he's reselling services'

Now if the person reporting can turn around and show the service the person is reselling and share that, then we have proof.

Same applies for supposed fake reviews; If the person reporting can show us a connection, be it on a different forum post where someone is asking for reviews etc, then we can act on that. Show us proof that accounts are connected.

Without any form of proof, these 'accusations' are nothing more than speculation.

SlappinDaBees said:

He's right though.

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Nah, he is just witch hunting... him and his buddies have been doing that for some time now.

We have access to the seller's back end he constantly complains about and I'm 99% sure he has been told that.

I should not have given him a break his last warning by just temp banning him.

That won't happen again.

All this does is encourage people to use fake reviews as they know at this point mods won't look into it.[/QUOTE]

We look into a lot more than you would think and do it without reports as well. If you think there is something amiss, report it with whatever proof you have access to. There are a whole bunch of us to check things out.

MisterF said:

Same applies for supposed fake reviews; If the person reporting can show us a connection, be it on a different forum post where someone is asking for reviews etc, then we can act on that. Show us proof that accounts are connected.

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So if a seller creates 50 fake accounts on BHW with no connection on the public forum (why would there be?) and then spams 50 fake reviews with photo shopped ranking charts then unless the regular members can find the connection then the seller will get away with it?

This is why I think people are getting frustrated. We are blackhats, anyone with 2 braincells can see that is a huge vulnerability in the process.

BassTrackerBoats said:

We look into a lot more than you would think and do it without reports as well. If you think there is something amiss, report it with whatever proof you have access to. There are a whole bunch of us to check things out.

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Once again you have not detailed what proof you expect regular people to have access to.

Circle arguments.

SlappinDaBees said:

So if a seller creates 50 fake accounts on BHW with no connection on the public forum (why would there be?) and then spams 50 fake reviews with photo shopped ranking charts then unless the regular members can find the connection then the seller will get away with it?

This is why I think people are getting frustrated. We are blackhats, anyone with 2 braincells can see that is a huge vulnerability in the process.



Once again you have not detailed what proof you expect regular people to have access to.

Circle arguments.

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This was all addressed back in January ( in a thread you posted in ) https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/is-sarkar21-using-bots-to-review-his-own-service.1086022/#post-11710926

SlappinDaBees said:

Once again you have not detailed what proof you expect regular people to have access to.

Circle arguments.

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And I won't.

Your idea of proof would be different than others as we are all individuals.

If you think you have proof then please report with the proof you think you have.

We'll take it from there.

MisterF said:

This was all addressed back in January ( in a thread you posted in ) https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/is-sarkar21-using-bots-to-review-his-own-service.1086022/#post-11710926

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I wasn't talking about sarkark specifically.

This situation seem (on the surface without data) to be very common, and if it's not common I imagine it will be when you both admit there is a huge flaw in the system here that you refuse to acknowledge.

SellerA has a thread selling PBN links.

SellerA knows that the more replies/reviews/ranking graphs he can get on the thread, the more hes doing to sell.

SellerA creates 1 new account per week using TOR or a proxy. He posted 3 times per week on the open forum and then replies to his own thread with "purchase made trans id ISF3jd"

SellerA waits two weeks, logs into his new fake account and posts "OMG BIG RANKING INCREASE LOOK AT THIS RANKING GRAPH"

SellerA repeats this 20-30 times.

How would a regular member provide proof that these false reviews are fake?

This is false reviews in it's simplest form.

The only people you're catching are the fools who ask for reviews via PM or whatever... This kind of stuff is easy to prove for regular members.

But how do they prove that SellerA is using fake accounts/reviews? Where/how do people report that?

Are you saying this is not going on in BHW?

BassTrackerBoats said:

And I won't.

Your idea of proof would be different than others as we are all individuals.

If you think you have proof then please report with the proof you think you have.

We'll take it from there.

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That again makes absolutely no sense. Proof is factual and binary, things either prove something or they don't. Proof is not an opinion or emotional decision, there should be no grey area.

SlappinDaBees said:

there should be no grey area.

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And there is none.

You don't make the call; the staff does.

You provide what you think is proof and we do the real work.

You're ignoring the clear flaw in this forum with my point.

If SellerA leaves no public footprints but things clearly look wrong (with 30+ 10 post accounts leaving reviews in the thread), how would a regular member bring that to a staff members attention with the proof that you constantly ask for?

BassTrackerBoats said:

You don't make the call; the staff does.

You provide what you think is proof and we do the real work.

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I don't think regular members should make calls, the staff do a good job.

I'm asking what proof you need to do the real work?

SlappinDaBees said:

I'm asking what proof you need to do the real work?

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Whatever proof you have.

It can be infinitesimal or it can be huge.

I rank #1 1-10 for buy viagra

Transaction #DEADBEEFB00B5

Guaranteed best service 10/10 will buy again.

Ok fuck it.

I think I (and everyone else reading this thread) just found a very profitable venture.

SlappinDaBees said:

Ok fuck it.

I think I (and everyone else reading this thread) just found a very profitable venture.

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If only you knew how we find fake reviews you might just think your profitable venture was not as profitable as you think.

bartosimpsonio said:

I rank #1 1-10 for buy viagra

Transaction #DEADBEEFB00B5

Guaranteed best service 10/10 will buy again.

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The thing is that transaction id is real with the service(s) in question.

The system DD mentioned: "new marketplace" system solves this fake-review thingy. But that system has its own problems. I think BHW is moving in the right direction now (i don't see the love-magic spams anymore) and we are close to finding a proper solution to this marketplace issues.

I just don't buy any service that has 100s of reviews from new profiles.

Unreliable Witness said:

When considering buying a BST I ignore reviews from anyone except a select handful of active, reputable members. Its not a foolproof method (the quality of the service might not always be the same), but serious sellers who are really in business are likely to offer reviews to the same people knowing the weight they carry.

Just filter out reviews from members who don't regularly contribute.

Some mod reviews are great (@Zwielicht and @BassTrackerBoats). The marketplace could be improved if all marketplace mods gave similar detailed reviews, and if services were reviewed say once a year.

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When i buy a service i look at all the reviews and how long the service has been active, I then look at the last page to see if the service is still bringing results and if there are any negative reviews.

Closing this as it has gone from a forum suggestion/feedback to a lounge thread.

But I reiterate:

If you think the review is fake, please report it with any evidence you have.

We do not tolerate that sort of thing on BHW on any level.

A lot of the one timers are coming here from other places though and are encouraged to join the forum or revive their account if it has been lying stagnant and that is a part of the reason people think reviews are not authentic in some instances. It looks hokey (it looks hokey to me too until I peeled back some layers on the onion).

There are an abundance of ways for us to check things that may not be as they should be on BHW and we have a lot more access to accounts than one would imagine so if there is fraud in the "giving reviews" department we would love to hear about it so we can stamp it out.