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Poker Collusion, Would you do it?

Discussion in 'Making Money' started by Dillusion, Oct 1, 2009.

  1. Dillusion

    Dillusion BANNED BANNED

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    Ok, I have been making some major research in poker, from everything I read and tested I have found that poker collusion is probably the most stable and profitable black hat method that I've come across.

    For those who don't know, poker collusion in a nutshell is having 2 or more seats occupied at one given poker table.

    I've been testing this system playing manually for the last 24 hours, the way I did it was booting up 2 virtual machines within my system, on the first I opened a full tilt table with my traditional login, on the other I created a new login and entered the same table.

    I played in the play money section with 5/10 blinds, after some 8 hours of play I had racked up an average of 10.000 chips on BOTH accounts.

    Now the matter at hand is the following, obviously all poker tables online have an explicit TOS against collusion, my question is, just how often do they actually catch a colluding player?

    Doing some basic math, using my playing skills with an initial deposit of $50x2 on both tables, I can profit between $50 - $100 per hour using collusion.

    Would you advice on such a practice?
     
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  2. jsmith00075

    jsmith00075 Regular Member

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    Use your own PC and a VPS :p That would be your best choice imho (first time I heard about the collusion, but I am not a poker player so..)
     
  3. outsidethesquare

    outsidethesquare Regular Member

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    I'm not entirely sure about this but i think that some of the larger online casino's can detect when two players are on the same table and never get involved in pots together, playing only ever the stronger of the two hands. If you were to do this you would need to make it look natural, occasionally going in the same pot together and perhaps even making a few heads up plays against each other for show.
     
  4. khanhdum

    khanhdum Regular Member Premium Member

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    Using a vps and your pc would have the same ip. They don't let the same ip at the same table in real money. Also you could use a proxy, but I guess a private proxy would only work, since if it's pubic, they will be able to detect it.

    Anyways, I don't condone this at all, but they probably won't catch you if you're on a low money tables.
     
  5. outsidethesquare

    outsidethesquare Regular Member

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    If you would like to JV perhaps, i would be willing to collude with you on say NL25 on PokerStars over an instant messenger to see how it goes?
     
  6. whodi

    whodi Junior Member

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    Your maths might be off as well.... I know for a fact playing for real money and play money on Full Tilt (Which im into big time) are two different worlds.
     
  7. Dillusion

    Dillusion BANNED BANNED

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    If I were to apply this with real money, It would only be through the use of a private proxy, and I would always be using new accounts every week.

    I would purchase a new verified paypal account or VCC every week, create a new full tilt account, collude, cahsout, and repeat the process in the following week.
     
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  8. toxtom

    toxtom BANNED BANNED

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    YES! go for it of course ;)

    Btw have any good source where I can read about this poker collusion as well and see how and what to do?
     
  9. Dillusion

    Dillusion BANNED BANNED

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    This is knowledge I gathered through reading dozens of articles and trial and error on full tilt.

    Anyway, I am thinking about writing an ebook on the subject and give it away for free on BHW, since the community here never ceases to amaze me.

    On a second note, where would you advise me to sell an ebook on the subject?
     
  10. Zakk-

    Zakk- Junior Member

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    Digital point. They will buy anything over there. XD
     
  11. toxtom

    toxtom BANNED BANNED

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    Forget them!
    Go Spam in Poker Rooms your email saying you can teach them stuff what will make them $100/hour and ask for all the guide ~$500!
     
  12. webblackart

    webblackart Registered Member

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    try it with real money!
    the poker rooms dont care for the playmoney tables.

    from all i know about it it is not realy easy doing collusion. the problem is that you normaly use new accounts and every stupid statistician will see that something goes wrong.
    it is not normal in the low stats that you meet again and again the same person and more over it is not normal that always the same two in sum have a profit.
    the other thing is about cashing your money out; every of the bigger poker rooms like to see prove of payment and prove of identity, so using legal ways you will have quite fast a limitation of getting new accounts. i think that is more than black hat, if you like to do things like this right, there are other methods that bring easier money.


     
  13. playercool

    playercool Junior Member

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    First make NO basis on play money tables. People do stupid things on play money. It isn't real poker.

    Second. I will make no more comments about this because I play online poker and I think you are a scammer for doing this. You are basically stealing money.


    I can't recall where I read this. There a thieves in Europe and that is their full time career...if you want to call it that. They refuse to steal from the little shops though. It won't even enter their thought. They only steal from the rich(as in huge department type stores). I am not condoning stealing by any means. But if you must take from someone, take from someone who more than likely won't miss it.
     
  14. IcedCube

    IcedCube Junior Member

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    I've done this in the past, back when Poker didn't bore me. Here's what you do:

    1. Buy a few private proxies.

    2. Use your own IP for your main account. Deposit the full possible amount, insert REAL data (home address, phone, bank acc/cc, etc)

    3. Use a private proxy and a VCC for a different account and try to get a nice bonus on your initial deposit. Insert w/e info, no one cares.

    4. Enter a room with 6 players with both accounts (using a private proxy on a second PC for the second acc.).

    5. Play for a few hours or so, keeping both accs marginally in profit and also heads-up against yourself from time to time. NEVER sit next to your other account.

    6. Try to get a lot of <insert name for the bonus you get when you play an excessive amount> points so you can get the bonus on your VCC account. (at any point in the week)

    7. After this, go play some random low-stake rooms (5c SB, 10c BB) and try to not lose anything.

    8. Meet back in a room every once in a while (Day 1 and 2, day 4, day 6 and 7, e.g.) and remain in profit, step it up if you want.

    8. Buy-in and play the major million dollar in prizes tournaments in PartyPoker hosted in the weekends, but only those where the top 3 players move on to the next bracket.

    9. Try to meet up with yourself, and otherwise play these for the lulz. If you're any good, you'll get a prize anyways.

    10. Next week, after 3 days of not seeing your VCC account (still play on it!), lose to your main account, and you'll get whatever profit + bonus you have, as well as the 100% initial deposit bonus (which is about $50, $300 max).

    Then repeat as necessary.

    PROTIP: if you have $100, try to keep $25 saved, and try to force people to all-in in cash games if both of your accounts are in the pot, one before and one after the person you want to all-in. Of course, both accounts must be near guaranteed to win the pot. If the person all-ins, you follow with your second account, if he doesn't, you obviously fold the other account. If one of your accounts loses their entire stack because of this, you can simply re-enter with a lower buy-in and heads up against yourself ;o

    OTHER PROTIP: meet a few people here that play people and are competent enough to double-team, and reliable enough to share (or otherwise just do it with friends of yours), and team up with them individually, on a set day (for example, meet every 10-15 days for a few hours). This could work with a bunch of VCCs and Private proxies.

    Additionally, sign up with a dozen of people to major tournaments, make an MSN group chat (AIM, XFire, Y!M), and when you do meet each-other, you can do the same thing. As the rooms are top_3_advance, you can therefore easily take higher spots and guarantee the next room for multiple players.

    ANOTHER PROTIP I JUST THOUGHT OF: never play play money or otherwise free tournaments. Just don't.

    EDIT: that's PokerStars, not PartyPoker. My bad.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2009
  15. BozoClown

    BozoClown Junior Member

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    Get yourself 10 accounts, 10 proxies and VMs plus a spreadsheet. Two player collusion should give you 45(10C2) games. When the first player completes their 9 games, you cash him out. Do that until all the players are cashed out.

    Then create another bunch of 10 players. Play and cash them out. Then mix the first bunch of players with 2nd. This should give you 190 games.

    The biggest huddle may be creating the accounts and moving the money.
     
  16. jsmith00075

    jsmith00075 Regular Member

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    and welcome to the BHW :)
     
  17. nytrolic

    nytrolic Registered Member

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    Me and a couple of friends used to do this about 5 years back, what we used to do was drive down to the student/university housing area in a van, then 3 or 4 of us would pick up on the unsecure wireless networks, and all join the same game, play together and split the earnings.

    We didnt do it seriously, only for a bit of fun and because we just could.

    Paid for our nights out tho!
     
  18. mightybh

    mightybh Senior Member

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    I tried it and been caught. Me and a friend of mine were playing and speaking on Skype. We were still allowed to play but not on the same table. The pattern is actually quite obvious and most sites have an algo in place for that.

    On top of that, you are not really maximising your revenue. In fact, I would rather play against lets say 6 players colluding than 6 players playing on their own. If you want to test this, I'll be more than happy to take your money. You will also end up paying 2,3,4 or even 9 times the blinds.
     
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  19. MikeHustle

    MikeHustle Power Member

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    collusion always seemed sort of dumb to me... The only advantage you have is that you can calculate the odds slightly better, and you can maximize position on a bad player( place your players to the right)...

    I would love to play 100 tables of 25nl, and earn 4bb/hr = 100/hr

    I would like a simple bot that would fold my BS hands, and give an audible alert when I receive a playable hand: "table #29, 10-9 suited, on the button, passive blinds"

    That would be worth creating. Or buy an eastern euro slave girl to do the same thing.
     
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  20. three3s

    three3s Regular Member

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    First of all, collusion is a waste of your time. Your talking about colluding with $50 on 2 tables? At these stakes your probably only playing at 0.25/0.50 limits. If you had spent the time reading some poker books and basic strategy instead of spending it on research on how to collude then you would probably have the skills to win consistently playing straight at these levels anyway.

    If your going to colluse then at least wait til you have a bankroll where you can sit down with a few grand at higher levels and make the reward worth the risk.