Let's Agree "Scam" and "Made a bad purchase" are 2 different things...

What I would like to see is "For best results "....

For instance we see graphs all the time, probably fake half the time but they are there. Perhaps they should mention the measurable that the site has so a buyer can gauge if that is a good service for them.\

For example a graph might be showing a result from #50 to #8 in a month site demographics include- Age 2 years, 87 pages of content, no prior links or 2,500 links already prior to starting, KW volume 3,400 searches per month, competition 500k sites.

Lets face it, its the newbs that get snagged the most and this might help them decide if they are looking at the right service. Granted the seller may still lie about all of the above but hopefully we have a few more ethical sellers than non ethical sellers and YES if they guarantee anything they need to back that statement up.

I was expecting such a thread long time ago, but there is always a good time to start a debate regarding this matter.
Reading all above said I may add the followings, trying not to repeat what my fellows said above:
1. SEO is not and will not be a perfect business - there are always up/down
2. To be able to buy a SEO Service you must know that there are many classes of ranking, submission and advertising by using different SEO methods, you must know what to choose for you then to be able to consider what is the best service from that area.
3. To sell a SEO Service - that is the biggest part where I may say most of the community declare themselves "GURU, MASTER, GODS" but they're not, I strongly advice all my clients first to be sure that they want to work in a Black Hat Methods because are different then the White Hat, second I strongly suggest to see my previous results and then to tell me if they have questions.
4. Scammers - the WORLD is full of them - they are everywhere and we will not be able to escape from them unless we're careful with whom we deal and we try to know as much as we can before we even give $10 in advance. This is why usually the real business players are ignored because they ask for $20
In the end, I don't want to be boring but you must open your eyes and READ what is written in all the selling threads that you're trying to purchase - BEFORE you Purchase - NOT AFTER. How to pay for a service that is saying clearly Black Hat and they to go and make a SL because you got penalized - Is a RISK (high one) when you pay for Black Hat Service you must know that.
Cheers - a cold beer for netmoney1 (from Madrid)

Maybe a quick set of 'Terms and Conditions' that must be agreed to by the purchaser and the seller before the "Buy" button can be clicked.

Philosophically I feel if somebody buys something in a thread they have a right to post pretty much whatever they want for feedback and the provider has a right to refute that feedback if they so choose. If somebody with a BST is really that afraid of the words a customer might use scammer is probably a good word for them.

I always enjoy looking g at Speed Ranks ads lol. They rely heavily on old school marketing.

+1 totally agree with this. Sellers should also be more careful choosing titles of their BSTs IMO. Some thread titles are ridiculous as well.

Spot on netmoney1! We have both discussed this many times the main problem I feel lays with the sellers and their guarantees.... STOP making stupid retarded guarantees to get sales!! Also STOP the bullshit penguin/panda/zebra proof lies to also grab sales, because no one in their right mind can make such claims and still be truthful! Anyone that makes claims like this should be avoided like the plague and deserves to be shit listed for false advertising!

Guys you're only setting yourselves up for a shit storm later on, be honest with your clients from day one and your business will do much better in the long run I could start giving examples here of idiot sellers even competitors of mine which have done these very things, the thing is though their sales threads are all gone now gone in a whirl wind of bad feedback and chaos in their threads because of the very issues I mention so I'd be at a loss to link you to them lol but I'm guessing everyone knows the sorts of threads I'm talking about, don't fucking bullshit the people that put bread on your table guys sheesh it's not rocket science! Be honest and you'll last a lot longer and people will respect you for it....

Also the new BST mods no offence here but you guys are approving some seriously questionable stuff lol I often wonder if you's even read the threads before approving them, I'm all for the free market but for the love of god it's easy to spot a BST which is complete BS and going to cause issues later, BSTs like that would have been denied denied denied in the old days and there was a lot less shit lists then too, coincidence? heh maybe....

Just my 2 cents for what's it worth!

If a seller gets blamed he usually says "I am only a linkseller" and that's completly true.
But 99% of the BSTs aren't advertised as these.
They promise rankings and act like there is no chance of penalties.

For us it's obvious that there is a high risk, but for most newbies it's not.

Liaata said:

If a seller gets blamed he usually says "I am only a linkseller" and that's completly true.
But 99% of the BSTs aren't advertised as these.
They promise rankings and act like there is no chance of penalties.

For us it's obvious that there is a high risk, but for most newbies it's not.

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I would bet that every one of the reputable guys that sell links tell the client, if asked, that they should be doing an all around SEO process and not rely on one method only. I not only do that on my Linkpushing thread (because I only sell links there) but I also write that on my blog.

It costs me a little business, because many want a one stop shop, but when one buys backlinks they are buying links and not rankings.

SkyrocketSEO said:

nobody is selling cars in BSTs

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but strangely cars used to have BSTs... then they crashed

Also the words hypocrite and full of complete turd comes to mind reading some of the replies in here but I shall keep my little Irish mouth shut

You know what, I completely agree with what netmoney said. I am okay with people giving guarantees but only if they can stick with them and refund the money if desired results are not reached.

And Tommy, what the fuck is your problem? I always feel the need to comment at what you say because every time you post anything, you are calling other people "retards", "idiots", "Hypocrite", "complete turd". If you are going to do the exact same bullshit yourself, maybe you could try being nice to other people for a change?

antichrist said:

And Tommy, what the fuck is your problem? I always feel the need to comment at what you say because every time you post anything, you are calling other people "retards", "idiots", "Hypocrite", "complete turd". If you are going to do the exact same bullshit yourself, maybe you could try being nice to other people for a change?

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wtf are you talking about now? My problem is clearly stated in my response open your damn eyes, you've got a serious hard on for me you always have done, any time I post your on my back fuck away off would ya. How I express myself is of no concern to you.

Time test battle proven does not mean safe retard, it means they fucking work and have been proven to work which they clearly do lol Speed Rank is the one service here which has been consistant in working since opening over a year and half ago so I can justify using "Time Tested", it does NOT say safe does it? It does not say guaranteed #1 spot, the difference is very clear to spot, but carry on nit picking at me I know you get off on it

You also choose to leave out the rest of the white excert lol here you go...

The service is manual hand made links, its as safe as you could get wile still manipulating rankings, which at the end of the day is bh anyway, its NOT update proof and its NOT some cheap bullshit lines like I was getting at so stfu, twist my words what ever way you like dude but I think we both know whats up here

"Our links are the best on the market" - LOL dude this is standard marketing of course you will say yours are the best fuck I'd say I can justify that too tbh, what I don't say is they are penguin or whatever proof or make up complete bullshit, but again you're clutching at straws lol

I have been told numerous times that 1st tier is native english writers. Then low and behold they never are. So ya bst sellers will lie for sure I have seen it time and time again. What are we gonna do about it? Shit talk them and call them out on their thread? Why would I do that when they have my keywords and can destroy my site with neg seo? They do have you by the balls at this point. Best bet is to just cut your losses and move on.

Most BST are garbage and most people in the know will agree. I am willing to pay good money monthly but honestly cannot find anyone.

Also, mods should do random buys from BST under aliases to get a true feel of what is going on with their service. It is nothing to give top notch service for the reviews then give garbage after.

You say its safe, then contradict yourself and say it is not. You said they are guaranteed to work, but you don't guarantee anything. You just said they are blackhat, but advertise as whitehat.

I certainly don't have a "hard on" for you. You are just an asshole to people and must get kicks from insulting members every time you post.

Is it really too much to ask for to treat people with a little respect?

t0mmy said:

wtf are you talking about now? My problem is clearly stated in my response open your damn eyes, you've got a serious hard on for me you always have done, any time I post your on my back fuck away off would ya. How I express myself is of no concern to you.

Time test battle proven does not mean safe retard, it means they fucking work and have been proven to work which they clearly do lol it does NOT say safe does it? It does not say guaranteed #1 spot, the difference is very clear to spot, but carry on nit picking at me I know you get off on it

You also choose to leave out the rest of the white excert lol here you go...

The service is manual hand made links, its as safe as you could get wile still manipulating rankings, which at the end of the day is bh anyway, its NOT update proof and its NOT some cheap bullshit lines like I was getting at so stfu, twist my words what ever way you like dude but I think we both know whats up here

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antichrist said:

You say its safe, then contradict yourself and say it is not. You said they are guaranteed to work, but you don't guarantee anything. You just said they are blackhat, but advertise as whitehat.

I certainly don't have a "hard on" for you. You are just an asshole to people and must get kicks from insulting members every time you post.

Is it really too much to ask for to treat people with a little respect?

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Manual - as safe as you can get while still manipulating rankings, NOT update proof or using cheap lines in my thread title to wharp ppl in.

Its very fucking easy to see the difference between "GUARANTEED #1" & "UPDATE PROOF" etc etc from what you have pointed out, again though this is you knit picking at me because your obsessed for whatever reason

Ask around you'll soon see how honest I am with clients, shit I turn people away every day because of their wild expectations usually brought on by previous sellers!

I give respect to people that deserve it, you and the clowns I'm pointing out do not deserve my respect and I refuse to be a brown nose, if I don't like someone I say it

The fact that you even took the time to look through all my threads, make screen shots, upload them and then post here shows how obsessed you are LOL

Anyway I won't post again as its diverting netmoney1s thread as seems to be all to common here, kiddies trying to score e-peen points heh

jimmylegs said:

I always enjoy looking at Speed Ranks ads lol. They rely heavily on old school marketing.

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Just seen this cheers Jimmy, I hope you like those hot ladies in bunny outfits and egg puns haha see no need to bullshit for clicks just throw a few titties in the mix

antichrist said:

You are just an asshole to people and must get kicks from insulting members every time you post.

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That's all you needed to respond with. 100% agree with that. He is such a hypocrite, he creates bullshit threads about how BHW should be ran in his perfect little world, he delivers shite services, insults members, belongs to a circle jerking group who back each other up and wank each other off, yep it's sad but true.

Anyway there's no point arguing with him in this thread or any because he just gets his circle jerking friends to back him up on his bullshit posts. They also post complete horseshit and bully members, I've seen members not allowed their own opinion because these dicks gang up on them and post complete wank.

I reported t0mmy about 2 months ago when he called one of my friends a 'faggot'. Is this really the type of person anyone wants to work with? I reported him and guess what? He only got 1 day perm banned, so if he gets away with insulting members, then why can't I? He more than likely gets abused in real life, that's probably why he's such a cunt on this forum. So fuck you t0mmy and all your shitty fucking posts, also fuck the pricks who gang up with t0mmy and bully members.

T0mmy uses *lawyer English* to troll noobs. Many of them wont understand what he actually means.

There's a lot of wrong in this thread like the people who don't have backbone. I'm not gonna start pointing out names but seriously, one dude should seriously get a life IMO. He wants BHW to be Teletubby land wherein everything is run according to the desires of his very little mind. It's the same guy who posted about me and a friend saying that we were both the same accounts in a section where we practically had no access to give our side of the story. You call this being professional. "I've even reported a few other accounts I suspect and hope that the mods will take care". Ooh, there's some serious BS here. Listen up, I've been on this forum for over a year now and I'm practically tired of this bullshit you've been handing me since day one. It's also the same reason why I've stopped posting here anymore. It's also the reason why so many members have even stopped logging in. It's because of people like you. Who in their right minds would want to post knowing that they're going to be called a scammer in waiting for no reason? You're also the kind of person who doesn't speak up. If you had something against the specific group of us, why not just confront us instead of wimping out?

Sure, you've earned $850,000 bucks from a BST. Good for you. Does that give you the right to bullshit at every member? Sure, you've paid a lot of money in advertising revenue, does that give you any special status? No.

I haven't made record breaking sales here. But every sale I made, I ensured that my customer was perfectly happy. Oh and also, I didn't end up in the shitlist

Good luck getting buyers with a foul attitude like that.

Sorry for deviating the topic but this had to posted. The hypocrites and bullshitters had to be exposed.
Btw, this has nothing to do with the OP.

I think there should be limit of talking orders for all BST to protect buyers.some scammers coming under different names and run away with money.