Google update question

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ryannull

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I had a website get hit on 5/31. It was ranking very well, all the way up to 5/30 and the next day, it tanked.

I figured I got caught in one of Google's update. Like most, I decided to wait it out. As of today, I still don't rank for any keywords.

Now, I am trying to determine whether it was hit, by Panda or Penguin. I did some research on Google's update release dates. There was Penguin 1.1 on 5/25 and Panda 3.7 on 6/8.

I have always assumed it was Penguin, because I have 900+ backlinks and 875+ are targeting the same keywords.

My question is, when Google releases an update, does it take effect immediately, or does it take a few days?
 
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It might take a few days and you most likely were hit by penguin. You should do A LOT of anchor diversifying or probably just start over.
 
I plan on diversifying my anchor text, but if it was hit by Panda, diversifying won't matter.
 
Don't start over. Try diversifying your links and also focusing on the sitewide content. What kind of niche is it? Do you have call to actions on every page? We've seen some on site factors that have been playing a role like opt in forms on every single page, etc.
 
domainmadness said:
I think it's quite obvious that you were hit (at least) by penguin.
Click to expand...

Numbers wise, yes.

Which leads me back to my question. Penguin was released on 5/25, and I didn't get hit until 5/31. So, it took 6 days for the update to complete throughout their entire database?
 
RightInTwo said:
Don't start over. Try diversifying your links and also focusing on the sitewide content. What kind of niche is it? Do you have call to actions on every page? We've seen some on site factors that have been playing a role like opt in forms on every single page, etc.
Click to expand...

I had no intentions of starting over. I decided to try and wait it out. As soon as I was hit, I look at my link profile and it was obvious I was targeting only a keyword.

When Penguin was 1st released on 4/19, I survived. I saw the future problem and started targeting generic and partial match. Up until 4/19, I was only targeting 1 keyword heavily. So, I was puzzled why I survived the 1st Penguin release and not the Penguin 1.1 (assuming that is what it is). I should have been wiped out.

I can't disclose the niche, but no call to actions, just a form on the homepage.

Since my backlink count is low, is should be easy to recover, if it is Penguin.
 
I had some important sites that survived Penguin and got hit by 1.1 --- all I can guess is that the sites were "on the border line" so survived the first time, but G refined the algorithm further to catch more sites in 1.1 and beyond.
 
reallife said:
I had some important sites that survived Penguin and got hit by 1.1 --- all I can guess is that the sites were "on the border line" so survived the first time, but G refined the algorithm further to catch more sites in 1.1 and beyond.
Click to expand...

That is a safe assumption. That was one of the hypothesis I had.

What was the date you got hit? If you don't mind me asking.

I guess, I am having trouble grasping that Penguin 1.1 was released on 5/25 and it took 6 days to get to me.
 
I got hit on 5/26. I understand why you're wondering why it took a few days, but as an example I'm still seeing after-shocks from the last Panda update, and that was last week. So I guess 5-6 days is definitely possible. One of the things I've wondered is whether they roll the update through some niches later than others; it's seemed that way to me at times.
 
reallife said:
I got hit on 5/26. I understand why you're wondering why it took a few days, but as an example I'm still seeing after-shocks from the last Panda update, and that was last week. So I guess 5-6 days is definitely possible. One of the things I've wondered is whether they roll the update through some niches later than others; it's seemed that way to me at times.
Click to expand...

When you got hit, did you drop on certain keywords or all of them?
 
ryannull said:
I had no intentions of starting over. I decided to try and wait it out. As soon as I was hit, I look at my link profile and it was obvious I was targeting only a keyword.

When Penguin was 1st released on 4/19, I survived. I saw the future problem and started targeting generic and partial match. Up until 4/19, I was only targeting 1 keyword heavily. So, I was puzzled why I survived the 1st Penguin release and not the Penguin 1.1 (assuming that is what it is). I should have been wiped out.

I can't disclose the niche, but no call to actions, just a form on the homepage.

Since my backlink count is low, is should be easy to recover, if it is Penguin.
Click to expand...

Fortunately since your backlink count is low, I think you are in better shape than most people that were hit by penguin. I know you can't disclose the niche, but what type of link building were you doing?
 
ryannull said:
Numbers wise, yes.

Which leads me back to my question. Penguin was released on 5/25, and I didn't get hit until 5/31. So, it took 6 days for the update to complete throughout their entire database?
Click to expand...

You probably just didn't notice your change in rankings until the 31st. I get fluctuating, and lagged behind rankings from different sources. My iPhone seems to see rank changes a full 24+ hours well before my laptop IE. My chrome see's different rankings all together. Even with some rank trackers I notice a similar pattern.
 
ryannull said:
My question is, when Google releases an update, does it take effect immediately, or does it take a few days?
Click to expand...

I wonder if demotion isn't relative. Google waits to see how the rankings turn out after the 1st round of demotions before deciding to demote again. I think of it as the "bounce rate" period. Other people call it the "Google Dance" which might accurately describe what is happening, but doesn't try to explain why.

When Google talks about "unnatural" I don't think they are measuring against some kind of absolute standard, but rather instead it's a relative standard developed by comparing similar sites.

1) Compare top 10 sites
2) Determine 3 of those 10 are "extreme" in some way, compared to the other 7.
3) Demote those 3, and let the new rankings develop, to be determined in part by bounce rate, which takes time.
4) Compare new top 10 sites.
5) Determine 2 of those 10 are "extreme" in some way,
etc...

One thing I wonder about is how "low" in the rankings does Penguin affect. Has anyone ever seen a #52 site get demoted by Penguin to #149? My sense is that that Penguin only seriously demotes the top 20 or so.
 
B. Friendly said:
I wonder if demotion isn't relative. Google waits to see how the rankings turn out after the 1st round of demotions before deciding to demote again. I think of it as the "bounce rate" period. Other people call it the "Google Dance" which might accurately describe what is happening, but doesn't try to explain why.

When Google talks about "unnatural" I don't think they are measuring against some kind of absolute standard, but rather instead it's a relative standard developed by comparing similar sites.

1) Compare top 10 sites
2) Determine 3 of those 10 are "extreme" in some way, compared to the other 7.
3) Demote those 3, and let the new rankings develop, to be determined in part by bounce rate, which takes time.
4) Compare new top 10 sites.
5) Determine 2 of those 10 are "extreme" in some way,
etc...

One thing I wonder about is how "low" in the rankings does Penguin affect. Has anyone ever seen a #52 site get demoted by Penguin to #149? My sense is that that Penguin only seriously demotes the top 20 or so.
Click to expand...

That's an interesting theory that seems to make some sense, based on the way the "dance" goes.
As for a #52 site demoted, I've definitely seen stuff like that - sites that were hovering in the 25-50 range that disappeared from the top 100 after a Penguin update.
 
RightInTwo said:
Fortunately since your backlink count is low, I think you are in better shape than most people that were hit by penguin. I know you can't disclose the niche, but what type of link building were you doing?
Click to expand...

I used a couple reputable BST services. So, it wasn't the services, because I have used them on many sites. Web 3.0 properties, articles, wikis, high pr backlinks, high pr forum networks, edu posts.
 
B. Friendly said:
One thing I wonder about is how "low" in the rankings does Penguin affect. Has anyone ever seen a #52 site get demoted by Penguin to #149? My sense is that that Penguin only seriously demotes the top 20 or so.
Click to expand...

Its funny you bring that up. Prior to 5/30, the highest position I got was the 3rd page. On 5/30, I hit page 2 and the next day, is when I tanked. The first thing that came to mind is that Google has more evolved filters for the top 20 positions and is more conservative beyond 20+.

I don't know if that's true, but it was a theory I was pondering. When I looked at my link profile, it was pretty obvious from there.
 
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