Create an IT company with zero dollars

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Marko T said:
Actually that is exactly how Upwork works.
Click to expand...
You have to pay upfront and your money goes to escrow for fixed work.

https://support.upwork.com/hc/en-us/articles/211063748-Fixed-Price-Protectionhttps://support.upwork.com/hc/en-us/articles/211068208-Escrow-for-Fixed-Price-Jobs
vinnyMS said:
Forgot to mention

When there's no job, the programmers could create tutorials for a YouTube channel with computer programming language as a subject
Click to expand...
Forget creating tutorials they can actually build another YouTube in their free time. How awesome !
 
vinnyMS said:
Go on Upwork
Hire 4 programmers
You make a deal to find them jobs and pay them per job completion
When the job is complete, you pay them, that's the only way
You act as a middle man between clients and programmers
You only pay them after the job is done and you receive the money

It's a company for 0 dollars
Click to expand...

This is a thing I think many people have thought about before. Basically, you're looking to start a dev agency, but outsource HR and Finance to Upwork.

There are some challenges with this plan:
1. You are not valuing your time and energy here. Which you will spend a lot on this.
2. If a developer screws you over with bad code, you're responsible in front of the client. If you hire developer from India/Pakistan (which is often approach in these schemes) have fun trying to get a refund if they refuse.
3. You did not outline any tangible value that you are able to provide as a middle-man.
4. Finding clients is not easy (goes back to point 1 of "time is money"). Developers and dev agencies are dime a dozen.
5. Any proper company will require you to have a tax identity for invoicing purposes. Particularly true if the client is a listed company.
6. You will have big troubles keeping your pricing competitive
7. If you let developers communicate directly with the client, they will figure it out really fast and cut you out. So then to stop that, you'll need to have a company and hire people to impose NCC. That costs a lot of money and effort as you will need HR, Finance, payroll, tax IDs and et cetera. You cannot impose NCC on freelancers in most cases.

Only cases where I've seen this work is where the middle-man is a subject matter expert and can provide some tangible value. For example, one senior developer who I know did this, but they acted as the spearhead of the development team, communicating with the client several times a week, conveying their wishes to developers and made sure that the output matched the requirements.

It's doable technically, but definitely not as easy as your post portrays it. You will have to be available a lot OR then hire someone to do client communication, and pay their salary *and trust them to do good work), further driving your overall price up and making you less competitive. I would say it's at best a part-time jobs worth of work.
 
sam55 said:
You have to pay upfront and your money goes to escrow for fixed work.

https://support.upwork.com/hc/en-us/articles/211063748-Fixed-Price-Protectionhttps://support.upwork.com/hc/en-us/articles/211068208-Escrow-for-Fixed-Price-Jobs

Forget creating tutorials they can actually build another YouTube in their free time. How awesome !
Click to expand...
I know how Upwork works, been earning 10s of thousand of $ this way. I find clients on Upwork and then find people on Upwork to finish this for me.
 
Marko T said:
I know how Upwork works, been earning 10s of thousand of $ this way. I find clients on Upwork and then find people on Upwork to finish this for me.
Click to expand...
Interesting! If I may ask, how much elbow grease you have to put in and how much work was it to get this kind of setup going? Definitely it's easier than being a firefighter or a prison guard, but I'm sure it wasn't (and isn't) a walk in a park exactly.
 
justalazyseo said:
Interesting! If I may ask, how much elbow grease you have to put in and how much work was it to get this kind of setup going? Definitely it's easier than being a firefighter or a prison guard, but I'm sure it wasn't (and isn't) a walk in a park exactly.
Click to expand...
Not a walk in the park as sitting in front of your PC/Laptop is a pretty bad thing for your organism.

The key is to know how to find a cheap but quality freelancer for your project. When you find them just tell them what needs to be done the way your client demanded from you.

Then if you offered some free changes (3 for example) you tell your freelancer that he will do 4 free tweaks if needed. So, always demand a bit more from your freelancer to be on the safe side.

Once client pays you, you release money to your freelancer.

And you can get $500 job at Upwork and delegate that work to your freelancers for $50.

The key is quality, do not chase cheap work, unless you need first 5 star ratings, which is a must. Good clients avoid newbies.
 
justalazyseo said:
This is a thing I think many people have thought about before. Basically, you're looking to start a dev agency, but outsource HR and Finance to Upwork.

There are some challenges with this plan:
1. You are not valuing your time and energy here. Which you will spend a lot on this.
2. If a developer screws you over with bad code, you're responsible in front of the client. If you hire developer from India/Pakistan (which is often approach in these schemes) have fun trying to get a refund if they refuse.
3. You did not outline any tangible value that you are able to provide as a middle-man.
4. Finding clients is not easy (goes back to point 1 of "time is money"). Developers and dev agencies are dime a dozen.
5. Any proper company will require you to have a tax identity for invoicing purposes. Particularly true if the client is a listed company.
6. You will have big troubles keeping your pricing competitive
7. If you let developers communicate directly with the client, they will figure it out really fast and cut you out. So then to stop that, you'll need to have a company and hire people to impose NCC. That costs a lot of money and effort as you will need HR, Finance, payroll, tax IDs and et cetera. You cannot impose NCC on freelancers in most cases.

Only cases where I've seen this work is where the middle-man is a subject matter expert and can provide some tangible value. For example, one senior developer who I know did this, but they acted as the spearhead of the development team, communicating with the client several times a week, conveying their wishes to developers and made sure that the output matched the requirements.

It's doable technically, but definitely not as easy as your post portrays it. You will have to be available a lot OR then hire someone to do client communication, and pay their salary *and trust them to do good work), further driving your overall price up and making you less competitive. I would say it's at best a part-time jobs worth of work.
Click to expand...
he just found out one of "TuToRiaLz" youtube video of Iman Gadzhi.
 
It is called drop-servicing and with it why just an IT company, one can start any service related "company" this way. I just started 1000 companies today :confused: ... It is all as easy as ABC ... Just find freelancers to do tasks and negotiate pricing. For getting clients, no need for any marketing at all :confused:, clients will miraculously appear out of nowhere :confused:
 
Trust WorkShop said:
It is called drop-servicing and with it why just an IT company, one can start any service related "company" this way. I just started 1000 companies today :confused: ... It is all as easy as ABC ... Just find freelancers to do tasks and negotiate pricing. For getting clients, no need for any marketing at all :confused:, clients will miraculously appear out of nowhere :confused:
Click to expand...
I wish my businesses would miraculously make clients out of thin air. Breathing clients in, breathing clients out.
 
I think OP have not idea what kind of headache one will face as a tech middleman without technical knowledge.

Any "Experienced" developer can already overpromise in delivering something that is too ambitious.
Worst if the sales middleman that knows nuts about tech development, coding and processes.
How will you know what can or cannot be done by developer as per client's demand and ensure project to be completed within budget and with profit?

Dream is good, but I can totally smell the baking of disaster!

And by saying having 9 developer will instantly improve the delivery deadline already expose to the fact that you do not know what you're talking about.
It's not even about just management skills, you're just a pure unrealistic guru trying to lead the blind!

Or maybe just maybe, you're trying to promote your udemy course?
 
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I already have my software company since 2020 when covid started and i've had 2 clients groups from the US. The company's cofounder was my (ex)friend who no longer works here, who i trust and who always delivers on time, and has lots of valuable knowledge. I outsourced another developer from upwork (indian) who got the job done. 3 of us were working in a team and having daily meetings.

I'd say the hardest part is first of all
1) finding clients
2) hiring the right types of developers

Currently i have no cofounder so it's difficult to run the whole thing by myself. And i cant find 1 single person who wants to join the cofounder position and run it together. Everyone just keeps asking "how much u gonna pay me" which is extremely annoying. No one has the entrepreneurial mindset. Everyone just wants salary right away. In this case it's better (but more difficult) to run it by myself. If anyone wants to join as a cofounder without asking me for money straight away he's welcome for a discussion call
 
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