A Personal Plea

GreyWolf said:

@newnetworks -

Maybe you just need to learn why nufaman makes comments like that. There really is a point, and it isn't because he likes to be rude. He isn't trying to demotivate anyone from trying to be successful, he's just trying to discourage them from making these types of threads.

They might be acceptable on other forums like WF or DP, but on BHW they are seen the same way as "How can I make $xxx a day" threads. If you've read the forum rules then you should know those type threads are not allowed here.

You seem to think that nufaman makes comments that aren't very helpful and somehow you're a good person to point that out to him. Nufaman has been around for close to a couple years now, during that time hes made close to 1700 posts. He's recieved a lot of thanks for many of his posts and has built up a pretty decent reputation on the forum. He also uses some of the services in the bst threads and has a good itrader score as well. Some of those posts might seem non-productive to you, but those are usually made in an effort to get people to understand they shouldn't be making these types of threads. His might not have been the most informative for the OP to know what to do, but it was probably by far the best reply given to show that these threads are discouraged on bhw. Aside from those type of posts nufaman has made many many helpful posts answering questions asked in pertinent threads. The number of those helpful posts far exceed the type you're complaining about, and more to the point he's made vastly more of those helpful type posts than you have yourself.

You on the other hand have been around about 6 months, that's plenty of time to have been participating in the forum and yet you still only have 22 posts. I don't think you're relly the right person to be calling nufaman out on things regarding the social structure of the forum. You've gotten some thanks and even some reps for your posts, that's a good start so kudos to you for that. Keep participating like that and after awhile you might reach a level it's worth trying to make a point like you tried making with nufaman. You might also want to pay a little attention to the forum rules though if you want to do that. Thing's on this forum are a little different than you find on forums like WD or DP. You should try to learn what's expected of people here and why the forum is structured that way. That's what made bhw as popular as it's become, so most of us here do what we can to keep it that way.

The Black Hat World forum is all about how to make money online. It's loaded with threads on various tips and methods for how to do that. Why would anyone think they need to ask the question "How can I make money?" The answer to that question is go join BlackHatForum, and then start looking for a method that makes some kind of sense to you. It's kind of pointless to ask that general question on a forum that is itself the actual answer to the question.

There's a reason "Please Help Me" threads like this are discouraged on the forum. Overall they aren't very productive. All that threads like this accomplish is to get a lot of random unrelated suggestions about what the guy should do collected into one thread. For the most part the suggestions are based only on what the individuals feel works best for them. That doesn't necessarily mean they'll even be the best suggestions for the thread starter's skill set. Since all those ideas are already presented in specific forums and threads anyway, it's better for the thread starter to just read through the existing threads to find methods that might be more suitable for them. It really very productive for the forum to just open new threads just to fill up with all those methods over and over again.

It's kind of like going to the book store and buying a book on how to do something. Then instead of reading the book, people just write a letter to the author asking him what they should do. It would be pointless to do that because that was the purpose of the book. What should the author do in that case, rewrite the book again just for each person?

That's what happens with threads like this one. Each time a new one is opened, then everyone that feels like it goes into the thread and reposts random methods that are already thoroughly described in more specific threads. Those specific type threads are valuable and what's encouraged on the forum. They're much more useful than threads like this one.

Good Luck to you and Happy New Year!!!

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brianrwin said:

I do read the forum posts as much as I can, and there are some great posts and a lot of very intelligent posters that make helpful and thoughtful posts.

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newnetworks said:

at nufuman
lets get the air cleared here......
1). i was simply trying to highlight that the guy was desperate in my (humble) opinion.
2). i was also trying to state that noone deserves to be slated the way you did.
(better 4 u to have not posted, and simply moved on / ignored than bash him).
3). I ACKNOWDEGE 100% what input and influence and benifits you have contributions to this forum. No doubt about it. you ARE a valuable member.

However,
I really accept and acknowledge the positive comments / issues raised
made by Greywolf.
His post was very good answer, (except that it was personally directed towards me,
where in fact it would have been better to make such a statement to all members who may be tempted to make a post such as the OP).
this universal approach suggested by member JesusBack i think also suggested making such a response everytime someone makes a post like that.
BUT
IMHO , a lot of readers of this thread have actually learned a lot from it,
whether it is by knowing what is an acceptable comment to post or not to post.

ALSO
IMHO, new members must be ENCOURAGED to post, and have the CONFIDENCE to post,
rather than feel alienated and scared to offer their 2 cents worth.

nufaman
FINALLY, rather than producing a positive response, and comment, what did you decide to do?
...simply to negativ rep me, and use the words F*uc k Off,
in your reason for neg repping.
I guess this sort of remark from you kinda sums this thread all up for you.

i am NOT picking a fight by the way, but standing up for myself, and letting YOU know that i will have the honour and dignity to walk away, and let it be, rather than stooping to your low level of response on this thread.

best wishes by the way.

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GreyWolf said:

OK Brian - I said earlier that since this thread already gave you some suggestions I'd come back to give some of my own advice. That doesn't mean I think these threads are a good idea, but simply because I think some of the suggestions might be steering you in the wrong direction. They're good suggestions and methods that can be very successful, but I think based on the information you gave in the first post I think you'd be better off sicking with traditional type sales. It sounds like your already used to that type of business.The internet equivalent of that is affiliate marketing.

Doing adsense as previously suggested isn't a bad idea, but the primary way of making money with that is with SEO. You need to have your own domain and hosting, build a good website and get the site high enough in the serps to start getting traffic. There's a lot of things that can be done to accomplish that, but they either involve a lot of time to do yourself, or money to either buy tools or pay for services. Typically adsense is also a low paying method. The way to really make money with it is to have many sites, each making a little money and then the combind income starts becoming more substantial. It isn't a bad idea, but you already said your already stressed for time.

With affiliate marketing, a website can be helpful but isn't an absolute necessity. If you have a website SEO can be helpful to get traffic if you get it high enough in the serps, but again it isn't necessary. Basically it's similar to being a salesman in any other type of industry. You sign up as a salesman for a company with worthwhile products to sell, then you canvas for leads that might be interested in the products, promote the products to those leads, close as many sales as you can, and then collect your paychecks. There's ways to do all that within the time schedule you have, and you can do it with little to no out of pocket expenses on your part. I've definitely simplified it in this description, but I really do think it looks like the method that would work best for someone already experienced in sales.

Think of it in the same way as what an Independent Insurance Agent does. They sign up with several different insurance companies that give the agent a wide variety of products to sell. They aren't employees of the various companies, but rather just have access to the products to sell. The agent though runs his own company, it's up to him to generate the leads and promote the products. But when he makes the sale, he gets a substantial commission for it. The great thing is he doesn't have to sell a lot of of individual products. He might only sell one medicare supplimate a month, but he also sells one whole life plan, a couple term life plans, etc. So he only makes one sale a month of a product for each company, but combined he's actually made commission on many sales for himself. I chose an insurance agent as an example because they sale intangible products. That's really similar in concept to the type of products sold online, all you have to do is make the sale and then collect your commission. There isn't any shipping, or handling of goods to be concerned with.

There's lots of ways to do this type of marketing. Write articles linking to your affiliate link. Make classified ads on CL. Or if CL seems too hard for you there are other classified sites. Make FB profiles and promote your products there. Advertise in your local newspaper. Put flyers up on bulletin boards. etc. TapTapper already gave you a lot of good suggestions. You can choose strictly informational products and be an affiliate through clickbank, promote lead generation products for cpa companies, even promote real products for things like Amazon, Ebay, clothing stores, software companies, etc.

Anyway that;s the direction I'd say on what direction to look in. The rest of my advice is just the basic stuff - don't keep bouncing around, decide the business model you're going to work in and then stay focused on that plan. Think of what's expected of you at your current job. Think of this in those same terms. Define what tasks need to be accomplished, priortize them, and then make yourself do them for your new business the same way you make yourself do them for your current job. Treat it as if it is a second job that you're lucky enough to be able to do from home. Evaluate your home time to determine what your best work schedule could be. Be realistic about how mush time you can devote so you don't over burden yourself, but then set yourself some defined hours in which you're 'at work' for your new business.

That's pretty general information, you need to go look through the forums for specific methods and techniques for doing all that. Just remember as you find threads on topics unrelated to the plan you establish, don't let them sway you onto a new project. It might be worth reading unrelated threads, but only because they might contain some information that could still be related. If it doesn't then move on to another thread, don't get sidetracked into following a new method.

That isn't a lot of help, but hopefully it can give you an idea of how to get on the right track.

Good Luck and Happy New Year!!!

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brianrwin said:

Hi,
My name is Brian, and I've been trying my hand at making money online for about 5 years. Except for a short run on Ebay, I haven't been very successful yet. I am extra motivated now due to my family, and working a horrible job.
I'm probably older than most on here at 36 years old, and I'm married with 2 wonderful, sweet children, a 5 yo daughter and 3 yo son. My wife is a teacher (which is an under-appreciated job these days) and I work in sales. I have to leave home an hour and a half before work to drop them off and take the long drive to work. By the time I get home its late, and I barely have time to eat before the kids go to bed.
My job is making outbound sales calls to customers in between answering non-stop incoming calls to place orders and ask questions. Our phones ring non-stop, but we are still expected to accomplish a million other things and work like dogs. We are all put under constant pressure- Everyone is unhappy and stressed, but no one at my work wants to look for another job due to fear over the economy.
For 2011 I want to create a better life and want to be able to provide for my children and have time and energy to spend with them. When I get home, I am usually too drained to get on the computer and work on a PPC campaign or blog or what have you. But I force myself to do it, and I haven't had success. It has also been hard to focus on one idea and be persistent.
I've been a lurker on here for some time, and get inspiration and ideas from people on the board. I've also tried some of the ideas people have been nice enough to share. I'm still looking for something, or even a couple things, that would allow me to get off the hamster wheel and leave my job. If I could average about $100 a day, I could do it.
Does anyone here have any suggestions or examples of what I could do? Feel free to message me if you prefer.
Thank you for any responses, and Happy New Year!

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• you ARE old
• you've been unsuccessfuly TRYING to make money for five (holy fu.ck) years
• you HAVE to leave home early to drop off kind and take long drive to work
• you get home late and barely have time to eat before kids go to bed
• you are FORCED to work like a dog and your job and accomplish a million things
• you are PUT under constant pressure there
• everyone is unhappy and stressed at your work (I assume it includes you)
• everyone is afraid to change jobs due to FEAR over the economy (I assume it includes you too)
• when you get home, you ARE usually too drained to get on the computer and work
• you are looking for SOMETHING that would allow you to leave your job

• you chose TRYING for five years insted of DOING
• you DO NOT HAVE to do anything in life, it is YOUR CHOICE to leave home early and come late
• no one forced you to work like a dog, you CHOSE this behaviour and run it yourself
• you control the thoughts you think therefore you CREATED your own streess and unhappiness by thinking in a negative way
• you CHOSE to be afraid of the economy
• you CHOSE a job that you hate and you CHOOSE to keep going to this job

1. Decide EXACTLY what you want (be POSITIVE here)
2. Take massive action
3. Analyse results
4. Stop doing what dons't work and DO MORE of what DOES WORK.

privateop said:

I've been in sales my whole life and been crushed by the economy. I'm literally starting over. I thought I had some answers...did for a while and things were going pretty well, then it all went to hell. Have a family and little kids too. I'm responsible for them.

I'm seriously considering the affiliate marketing and your post is very helpful. I'm new to IM and it is really hard to drill down on the direction to go. Even in affiliate marketing alone, there is so much information and so many different approaches people are taking. It is so hard for a new person to know what is real and how to make it work. There is so much competition and so many people not making money or losing money as they stab at an approach hoping it works.

I'm willing to invest a great deal of my time and any money I can. I'm willing to learn but also all for outsourcing if it gets the job done quicker. Job and career gone and I have to make something here work.

My biggest fear right now is investing whatever money I have left into something that doesn't work and then being completely screwed. I'm new to this but don't have much margin of error.

I know there are a lot of resources available, but I'm asking you (and anyone else for that matter) if there are any particular resources I can use to get me pointed in the right direction? I understand the basic concept of affiliate marketing, don't know how to do it specifically though.

There are many many people trying this and not getting anywhere with it. How do I go about finding the right methods that do work? I need to get there so I can then put it into practice. Then I can focus on how to do each particular part.

Right now, researching the information here and on search engines is the equivalent of 10,000 people all trying to sell me on their methods at the same time. Then there are a handful of people who know exactly what to do but aren't talking...which I can understand. However, I'm willing to make others money for their assistance. I just need a certain amount to cover the bills. I'll do the grunt work too. I just need to make something work! Desperate, yeah...more like I have to make this work no matter what! Stupid, no. Confused and overwhelmed, yeah.

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privateop said:

My biggest fear right now is investing whatever money I have left into something that doesn't work and then being completely screwed. I'm new to this but don't have much margin of error.

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privateop said:

I just need a certain amount to cover the bills. I'll do the grunt work too. I just need to make something work! Desperate, yeah...more like I have to make this work no matter what! Stupid, no. Confused and overwhelmed, yeah.

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cash202 said:

You have the same mindset problem, mate. Read my previous post.

Listen to yourself.



The majority of thing you try WON'T WORK. You job is to find
ones that WILL.



LOSER mentality. Cove the bills. Make something work.
What a loads of c.rap.

WHAT EXACTLY DO YOU WANT?

Write it here in this post. What exactly will make you happy now?

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privateop said:

You don't even know the half of it. Add illness and near death to the equation. I've fought through a lot and not quitting now. Yes, right now I need to cover the bills. Needs have to come before wants at times. What I'm saying is there is no reason to be greedy. Of course I want to make more than that and live comfortably for my family and myself, like it always has been until recent years. If it was just me, no big deal...but I need to take care of my kids. Yes, I need to make it work. That means I will make it work and failing is not an option. Yet, you call this a load of c.rap.

Also, why is it that the majority of things I try have to Not work? You say this like it is a requirement. I know there are some good people out there who are willing to help someone else in exchange for making more money. I don't have to try to reinvent the damn wheel. Some people work alone. Others take on more people because it works for them and they can have other people working who make them additional money. Then you have people who offer their services for a fee to teach and train. Some of these people don't do what they "teach". but there are others who do.

I have the time and I have some funds available. Somebody is going to see a mutually beneficial opportunity here. I know I've assisted others many times in the offline world when things were going well for me. I liked doing it and it made me some more money. You may not be like this, but that doesn't mean everyone is like you.

So, slam away if it makes you feel better.

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