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2015 EU VAT TAX nonsense

Discussion in 'BlackHat Lounge' started by tronox, Jun 22, 2015.

  1. tronox

    tronox Power Member

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    I know that I'm a little late for this since I'm already kinda fucked because law is already implemented.

    What if I sold only 2 pieces of item through my website totaling 14$ in sales. Do I still need to travel to France and Spain, register for VAT, run with the bulls, pay 2.8$ in taxes, and spend thousands of dollars on lawyers, accountants and financial advisors?

    Is this law just another way to say FUCK YOU!?
     
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    Last edited: Jun 22, 2015
  2. tronox

    tronox Power Member

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    Does this also apply if I sell website on Flippa and buyer pays through paypal ?
     
  3. Spawnie

    Spawnie Power Member

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    Read more......
     
  4. tronox

    tronox Power Member

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    Been reading for like 7 hours on this. All I know that I basically can't sell anything directly to customers from EU countries using paypal. I need to collect IP, Street Address, Name, Last Name, Urine Sample, their grandma's ashes, dog's middle name, and basically all the private information about that person.

    Then I need to keep it for TEN YEARS! THE FUCK! 9/11. Illuminati. George Orwell. 1984. Jet fuel can't melt steel beams.

    I believe that I will only be able to monetize stuff through ads and receive payment from big guys like Adsense, amazon, and everyone who already complies with rules and regulations.

    If I click buy now button on Flippa I see that I must pay to the seller only the amount that's stated as buy now price without taxes. And, I think, it means that I'll have to deal with taxes myself...
     
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  5. Nut-Nights

    Nut-Nights Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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  6. Capo Dei Capi

    Capo Dei Capi BANNED BANNED

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    You don't have to abide by EU rules if your not there and just selling to them.
     
  7. tronox

    tronox Power Member

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    Well, unfortunately, I am THERE. And, I have to abide from Jan 01 2015.

    Here you go sir:

    From 1 January 2015, EU VAT will be charged in the country where products are bought (where your customer lives) as opposed to the country where they are sold (where you live). The legislation applies to electronically supplied services.
     
  8. Capo Dei Capi

    Capo Dei Capi BANNED BANNED

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    Setup a company not in the EU, so you can get around the VAT.
     
  9. tronox

    tronox Power Member

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    FUCK THE SYSTEM!

    DEFINITION: "‘Electronically supplied services' shall include services which are delivered over the Internet or an electronic network and the nature of which renders their supply essentially automated and involving minimal human intervention, and impossible to ensure in the absence of information technology."

    TRANSLATION: Where there is automated delivery following the sale, it's a e-service.

    • Basically, it all depends on whether the seller is manually involved or not at some level of delivery and confirmation after sale
    • POTENTIAL WORKAROUND: If you MANUALLY email and MANUALLY ATTACH CONTENT then it may not be considered an e-service. HMRC stated this in an online discussion on Nov 27, 2014. YOU MUST HAVE A PERSON MANUALLY ATTACH AND EMAIL CONTENT TO CUSTOMERS IN EU (This could change)
    • NOTE: E-books, courses and downloads that automatically send to customer and email them automatically ARE CONSIDERED ELECTRONICALLY SUPPLIED SERVICES. CDs, floppy disks, potentially USBs are NOT... this may be a work around - ship your content in another way than auto-download.

    And this one:

    When does the "human intervention" exceed "minimal"

    This is where the amount of manual process involved in the sale means that the service ceases to be an e-service. In these cases the website functions as a "shop window" for the sale rather than also providing the mechanism by which the sale is made - for example

    a customer clicks "Buy Now" button on website and is added to a list. At end of day the vendor takes list, manually completes an e-mail with each customer's details, attaches the relevant content and hits "Send"; or
    a customer emails vendor with details of the products they wish to purchase. Vendor manually replies to email and attaches the content.



    I will just sell stuff that costs more than 7$ and email it myself. Ahh, FUCK YEAH!
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2015
  10. thedifference

    thedifference Registered Member

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    This is a complete - I don't care you little dicks... Just go fuck yourself... And of course if you are in UK you are OK if you have an average dick...
     
  11. Duffers5000

    Duffers5000 Elite Member

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    Are you vat registered in your own country ? your vat liabilty is with your own vat authorities not with the ones overseas. Legislation may have changed in jan 15' but its been this way for years, vat gets charged at the final place of sale. If you are not vat registered and you are not invoicing out vat then I dont see how it affects you.
     
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  12. Asif WILSON Khan

    Asif WILSON Khan Executive VIP Jr. VIP

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  13. archon10

    archon10 BANNED BANNED

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    Another reason it's awesome to be in the US.

    OP, I've read others complaining bout this. I definitely empathize. It's not like you can fuck around with taxes without having huge headaches but they fucked you guys with this bs.
     
  14. Capo Dei Capi

    Capo Dei Capi BANNED BANNED

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    States are starting to pass laws making companies pay instead of the people reporting it.
     
  15. archon10

    archon10 BANNED BANNED

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    Yeah I'm sure we could be next but I'll worry about it when it happens.
     
  16. Capo Dei Capi

    Capo Dei Capi BANNED BANNED

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    VAT is pretty much optional on digital products and services in the EU, if the company is based overseas.
     
  17. rees9

    rees9 Junior Member

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    Bump. Wondering if anybody here actually complies with this stupid law?

    Btw, in 2017 a threshold is planned to be introduced below which businesses will be exempt of this law.
     
  18. AlphaWarrior

    AlphaWarrior Newbie

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    Yes EU VAT this too mush difficulty.
     
  19. pepeneo

    pepeneo Registered Member

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    u can bypass this with some 3rd party sites, if the site is outside of eu u dont need to worrie about it
    Basically find some sites where they allow u to sell ur stuff and u will have to pay a commition like 5%
    Its still better than paying 20% of ur revenue for VAT + the the eventual fuckup where u have to deal with lawyers and fines.

    I hate how some old fuks make laws in businesses they cant even comprehend, they r probably having a hard time using the remote controll... Its like internet marketers make a law in aviation, like pilots completing survey offer before they can stop the autopilot...
     
  20. rees9

    rees9 Junior Member

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    There's many problems with what you said:

    1. The customer is paying VAT, not the seller, although in reality higher overall price = fewer customers.
    2. Ok, let's all stop selling on our websites and move on to platforms. A genius way to solve the issue.
    3. From the law's pov it doesn't matter where you live, EU or Zimbabwe, it only matters where your customer lives. A different matter is whether you should worry about the law. Probably it has more to do with the size of your business, not where you live. If you make pennies based in EU, no one is going to care, if you make millions in US you may well get busted.

    Otherwise, yeah, the old fuckers don't know what internet is and how it works (apparently they thought all small/home business MUST sell on big platforms like Amazon!), but dare to tell us how we should go about it.