I agree, I don't see the problem with allowing the BST providers to pick who they give their reviews to, provided it's not the same person reviewing their services every time. Actually, come to think about it, if the reviews are verifiable (they PM a staff member with SERP rankings) then there is no need for the time requirement. It was mainly to stop a supplier always using the same 'reviewers' for their BSTs (I've seen this in the past, not naming names but pretty damn suspicious when the same person is always the first to respond posting a glowing review...) - but if it's verifiable then this doesn't really matter.
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I agree, I don't see the problem with allowing the BST providers to pick who they give their reviews to, provided it's not the same person reviewing their services every time. Actually, come to think about it, if the reviews are verifiable (they PM a staff member with SERP rankings) then there is no need for the time requirement. It was mainly to stop a supplier always using the same 'reviewers' for their BSTs (I've seen this in the past, not naming names but pretty damn suspicious when the same person is always the first to respond posting a glowing review...) - but if it's verifiable then this doesn't really matter.
RAYRAY7
Regular Member
- Nov 17, 2007
- 403
- 299
Here we go again! We humans have a need to eliminate the ladder of success once we've climbed it. First lets consider some of your valid points:
1 -Deceptive Sales heading: Agreed some clear guidelines are in order, but total policing of creativity is uncalled for. You cannot effectively police subliminal selling, and most sales thread are geared towards that. I would suggest they implement subtle headline changes, but wholesale policing would not solve any problem. Backlinking, including press releases that generate links is frowned upon by UNCLE GOOGLE.
2 - Raise market place prices: Why even suggest that, when people are just trying to find stable income. Just looking at raw numbers, this forum generates millions of dollars in revenue. Those $30 and $97 yearly fees do add up quickly. You forget to mention the free services provided by the thread creator to moderators, that in itself is worth hundreds of thousands of dollars yearly. Based on my experience, it is the so called lower class people that create rich people. The bottom always feed the rich, if you look closely at the metrics. Substantially raising the prices will neuter the budding enthusiasm that has developed in this forum. Higher thread prices will mean higher backlinking prices, which will eventually result in less traffic and lower yearly sales figures for the owner. You toss price increases around without looking at the actual countries where members come from. The price increase like you suggested is a bad idea, and might just be the death nail for the robust sales thread. Substantial revenue is also generated from the STICKY post headlines. The forum ADS are based on user metrics, and based on what I see the spaces are always sold out.
3 - Implement security deposit. That again is a bad idea. Every engagement with any sales thread involves some type of risk. People already have paypal to dispute charges, and I am sure the administrators do not want to get involved in the murky world of disputed charges. Actually, most crooks here do it with all the legitimacy of purchased rank. I was duped by a reputable member for over $2000 and it was not initiated through a sales thread. You cannot regulate common sense, neither can you try to legislate it. Human beings must wake up and take responsibility for how and who they interact with. At present, this is probably the only forum that requires providers supply same services they're selling to a moderator. A good suggestion would be for the moderators to more forthcoming in their initial review. In my opinion, the system works perfectly for everyone, and any problems are minor and better handled by the payment processing companies. In fact, buyer reviews does a good job of weeding out the poor performers eventually.
4 - I have no issues with the freelancer section, as it's not a huge traffic generator anyway. Personally, I have only visited that section only once or twice, and it has no regular activity to be actively monetized.
5 - Drop-shipping/wholesaling - Not a huge traffic generator and I could care less what happens to it. It does not fit into the cliche of this forum anyway.
In conclusion:
I urge the administrators to move carefully, before implementing any huge increase in thread prices. This forum is a virtual online space and you do not want to make it too expensive for people to visit. While the OP has good intentions with his suggestions, his call for substantial price increases might just be the death nail to erase the enthusiasm that took many years to build-up. Many people visit here for so many reasons, and majority of them are from so called "third world" countries. When you look closely at the synergies involved, BLACKHATWORLD is a great place to buy sometimes high quality links, and it would be a shame to see that completely destroyed with a price increase.
1 -Deceptive Sales heading: Agreed some clear guidelines are in order, but total policing of creativity is uncalled for. You cannot effectively police subliminal selling, and most sales thread are geared towards that. I would suggest they implement subtle headline changes, but wholesale policing would not solve any problem. Backlinking, including press releases that generate links is frowned upon by UNCLE GOOGLE.
2 - Raise market place prices: Why even suggest that, when people are just trying to find stable income. Just looking at raw numbers, this forum generates millions of dollars in revenue. Those $30 and $97 yearly fees do add up quickly. You forget to mention the free services provided by the thread creator to moderators, that in itself is worth hundreds of thousands of dollars yearly. Based on my experience, it is the so called lower class people that create rich people. The bottom always feed the rich, if you look closely at the metrics. Substantially raising the prices will neuter the budding enthusiasm that has developed in this forum. Higher thread prices will mean higher backlinking prices, which will eventually result in less traffic and lower yearly sales figures for the owner. You toss price increases around without looking at the actual countries where members come from. The price increase like you suggested is a bad idea, and might just be the death nail for the robust sales thread. Substantial revenue is also generated from the STICKY post headlines. The forum ADS are based on user metrics, and based on what I see the spaces are always sold out.
3 - Implement security deposit. That again is a bad idea. Every engagement with any sales thread involves some type of risk. People already have paypal to dispute charges, and I am sure the administrators do not want to get involved in the murky world of disputed charges. Actually, most crooks here do it with all the legitimacy of purchased rank. I was duped by a reputable member for over $2000 and it was not initiated through a sales thread. You cannot regulate common sense, neither can you try to legislate it. Human beings must wake up and take responsibility for how and who they interact with. At present, this is probably the only forum that requires providers supply same services they're selling to a moderator. A good suggestion would be for the moderators to more forthcoming in their initial review. In my opinion, the system works perfectly for everyone, and any problems are minor and better handled by the payment processing companies. In fact, buyer reviews does a good job of weeding out the poor performers eventually.
4 - I have no issues with the freelancer section, as it's not a huge traffic generator anyway. Personally, I have only visited that section only once or twice, and it has no regular activity to be actively monetized.
5 - Drop-shipping/wholesaling - Not a huge traffic generator and I could care less what happens to it. It does not fit into the cliche of this forum anyway.
In conclusion:
I urge the administrators to move carefully, before implementing any huge increase in thread prices. This forum is a virtual online space and you do not want to make it too expensive for people to visit. While the OP has good intentions with his suggestions, his call for substantial price increases might just be the death nail to erase the enthusiasm that took many years to build-up. Many people visit here for so many reasons, and majority of them are from so called "third world" countries. When you look closely at the synergies involved, BLACKHATWORLD is a great place to buy sometimes high quality links, and it would be a shame to see that completely destroyed with a price increase.
netmoney1
Elite Member
- Feb 21, 2012
- 3,429
- 11,101
This has nothing to do with policing "creativity" - hell, I encourage creativity. It has to do with policing of pure utter bullsh#t and lies. Go through the market place and see how many sales thread claim "100% Google safe" and "Penguin, Panda, Hummingbird Safe" - as you mentioned, UNCLE GOOGLE doesn't like backlinking...so how can these claims be made? Nowhere did I mention creativity...simply just eliminating lies and BS. Simple as that. All about improving quality.
But hey, this is just discussion. I appreciate your reply and views.
Alpha.
Power Member
- May 11, 2013
- 506
- 238
I love your ideas!
I've got an addition to make though, how about some sort of "sales" counter(or unique sales, one per account kind of thing)? We all know how to promote a BST using fake accounts or pals etc... How on earth am I supposed to know which review is legit and which one is fake? It would at least filter it down slightly.
Plus, close those BST's that are offline!
I've got an addition to make though, how about some sort of "sales" counter(or unique sales, one per account kind of thing)? We all know how to promote a BST using fake accounts or pals etc... How on earth am I supposed to know which review is legit and which one is fake? It would at least filter it down slightly.
Plus, close those BST's that are offline!
Unfortunately, without rolling out a BHW Payment Processor and forcing people to use that (this won't happen for many, many reasons),there is no way to track legitimate sales other than what the supplier claims.
netmoney1
Elite Member
- Feb 21, 2012
- 3,429
- 11,101
Not sure what you mean by sales counter...lots of sales occur from people that aren't BHW members. When reading reviews just use common sense. If it is a brand new account with 1 post claiming they are ranking #1 for "Viagra" you obviously discount that.
RAYRAY7
Regular Member
- Nov 17, 2007
- 403
- 299
I understand, but one mans bullsh#t is another mans pay dirt. My point is that, writing sales copy involves some liberties with the truth and it's up to the buyer to figure it out. Have you seen the ads on Google, Yahoo and other huge networks, with questionable claims. A sales thread is meant to convey what you hope will happen, and if that is not the case, a bad review will teach you a good lesson.
Just look at our great country AMERICA today, much govt regulations of wall street and bankers, and crooked bankers still get away with murder. Regulations cannot replace common-sense from the buyer. The thread headlines have some exaggerations, but so is life. It's a selling job and policing the line between legitimate and exaggeration will not help anyone achieve rankings.
Alpha.
Power Member
- May 11, 2013
- 506
- 238
I was thinking more along the line of a "how many times has this product been sold" counter. But true, I didn't think about those buyers not using a BHW membership.
Sure, you can check through all the pages on a BST, but pretty much all of them have some negative feedback (or someone shouting scam) somewhere!
netmoney1
Elite Member
- Feb 21, 2012
- 3,429
- 11,101
Yeah, would be completely impossible to track sales...different mechant providers, sales coming from all over...plus no seller would want their sales numbers/income public for privacy reasons
Wilson Grant Fisk
Elite Member
- Nov 10, 2012
- 15,677
- 46,847
I don't know where you learnt copywriting but that is far from the truth.
It is exactly the type of thing some of us would like to see the back of.
Some sellers state exactly what they offer (yes they may SELL it, but they do so in an honest way) others post total bullshit with outlandish claims and lie through their teeth, this creates an unfair Marketplace where legitimate sellers lose sales to the unscrupulous.
Having tough regulations on what claims may be made by sellers, will create a fair marketplace where the very best providers will flourish.
I have purchased many services but there are many providers that I have NOT tried but I know they are reputable because of their reputation and the recommendations of others. I would like those providers to continue to grow.
When The Marketplace is only filled with the very best, it will actually become more competitive.
Providers will try to compete on price but the winners will compete on excellence.
In fact once the excess has been trimmed then the best providers will actually offer MORE services.
I can only see the forum being a better place. Providers will have a level playing field, buyers will receive a better service.
This in turn will attract more users to the forum and other professionals to the Marketplace.
Andrew Scherer
Supreme Member
- Oct 10, 2009
- 1,313
- 576
Ahhh, the familiar increased-pricing-makes-for-better-services fallacy. I know that one.
I am part of a forum that was once free BST and now threads are $XXX. What was once a flourishing marketplace now doesn't have enough open threads in BST to make it past page 1.
You're heading down a slippery slope with that suggestion, friend. I think it's fine how it is.
Last edited:
Schvamp
Power Member
- Feb 13, 2012
- 684
- 553
Don't see why $500 for a BST would be to much, as stated in many posts. But may be costy for someone having many of them. $500 for the first thread and only X for any additional thread.
All are great ideas imo.
Another feature I would like to be added is a shortcode which could only be seen by jrvips and above.
Where we can post contact details and link we don't want to be seen in public and by newbies.
For example
All are great ideas imo.
Another feature I would like to be added is a shortcode which could only be seen by jrvips and above.
Where we can post contact details and link we don't want to be seen in public and by newbies.
For example
Code:
My skype is [jrvip]ThatAwesomeGuy[/jrvip]
Last edited:
- Nov 29, 2012
- 45,890
- 13,822
After reading this thread i felt i needed to join this conversation as everyday i am working towards improving the Marketplace. I can see that it may look like we approve anything into the marketplace, but we don't, a lot gets rejected. Every seller must run their service against a site of our choosing, providing the top level of service listed and then deliver a report for approval and each report is checked properly. I agree that some sellers may work extra hard for the approval and then deliver lower quality for other buyers but this is very hard to regulate. If you feel this has happened, in the first instance contact the seller via PM on BHW and let them know that they have not delivered what they have listed and give them the chance to complete their task. If they don't reply to this, contact me directly. I will review both sides and provide a solution.
I think you have made a valid point that raising the listing fee to $500 from $30 would weed out the scammers and this is definitely something to consider. However if your decision making process revolves purely around who has paid the most for a thread click on the "Please Read" services. These are highly sort after positions, but I believe this would be a mistake as purely basing your decision making on this alone would mean you could miss out on many fantastic products on our marketplace.
In regards to the unbelievable titles like the example you have given, i admit a slight over sight on my part and i hold my hand up to that, i will be requesting title changes as and when i come across them. If members would like to PM be links to threads they believe have a misleading title that would be much appreciated.
I would like to hear other suggestions on how the marketplace could be improved other than raising the listing fee?
I think you have made a valid point that raising the listing fee to $500 from $30 would weed out the scammers and this is definitely something to consider. However if your decision making process revolves purely around who has paid the most for a thread click on the "Please Read" services. These are highly sort after positions, but I believe this would be a mistake as purely basing your decision making on this alone would mean you could miss out on many fantastic products on our marketplace.
In regards to the unbelievable titles like the example you have given, i admit a slight over sight on my part and i hold my hand up to that, i will be requesting title changes as and when i come across them. If members would like to PM be links to threads they believe have a misleading title that would be much appreciated.
I would like to hear other suggestions on how the marketplace could be improved other than raising the listing fee?
