You do not need to pay taxes!

[sippick]

if you read the whole paragraph (and not just the first line), maybe (i hope) maybe you would understand what i was trying to say.

how can one be so ignorant? for fuck sakes man! wake up!

 

[mack]

Nobody takes these arguments seriously...

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_protester :

Beginning in the mid-1970s, U.S. Federal courts began using the term "tax protester" in still another, more narrow sense — to describe persons who raised frivolous arguments about the legality of Federal taxes, particularly income taxes

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frivolous_litigation :

When a judge calls an argument "ridiculous" or "frivolous," it is absolutely the worst thing the judge could say.

It means that the person arguing the position has absolutely no idea of what he is doing, and has completely wasted everyone's time.

It doesn't mean that the case wasn't well argued, or that judge simply decided for the other side, it means that there was no other side.

The argument was absolutely, positively incompetent.

The judge is not telling you that you were "wrong." The judge is telling you that you are out of your mind.

Maybe this video can put it in terms you can understand:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKjxFJfcrcA

 

[davidson]

You can read all the tax protest materials you want. These people make great sounding arguments about the legality of the income tax. They can tell you that the 16th amendment was never ratified. They can even insult you by saying you are uninformed and unenlightened. They will do ANYTHING TO MAKE YOU BELIEVE THEIR ARGUMENTS SO THEY CAN SELL YOU THEIR PRODUCT. The tax protest movement is nothing more than a marketing campaign aimed and moving product. Unfortunately, like many scams, they don't care who they hurt or the consequences.

The sad thing is that people WANT to believe this crap. When they search the internet, the look for articles and information that prove the point of view they so desperately want to believe. When they come across truth they dismiss it as a conspiracy by the government.

Tax protesters end up in jail (Wesley Snipes) or have all of their assets taken to satisfy their tax obligation while the people who promote these schemes get rich (and pay taxes on their income) without having to get messy.

My advice is to stay far away from the entire tax protest movement. Figure out how to work within the system that exists. You might get away with something for a short time, but it will eventually come back to haunt you.

 

[misterajc]

OK, here's the deal on these "you don't need to pay income tax" fantasies. If you believe in them, if you really truly believe in them (just like Tinkerbell) they might just keep you out of jail for fraud when the IRS comes after you. Of course, you will still have to pay your back taxes and penalties, but fraud requires intent, and if you really didn't believe you had to pay, and can convince a jury of that, then they can't put you in jail.

There are lots of legal ways to reduce your tax burden, though, including shifting as much of your expenditure as possible to business expenses, moving to a tax shelter or starting a religion (it worked for L. Ron Hubbard!) so why take the risk of going to jail based on something as unlikely as Tinkerbell?

 

[xhpdx]

if the income tax is not a fraud, what about the Federal Reserve?

 

[java]

if the income tax is not a fraud, what about the Federal Reserve?

What about it? What's your point?

From a practical point, it's irrelevant as to if taxes are "legal", ratified, voluntary, etc. All that matters is what the courts and police do. The courts will rule against your non-payment, and the police will seize your ass(ets). That's all you need to know about the un-tax movement. Alternatively you can joint Snipes or Irwin Schiff (one of the biggest tax protesters of all time) in jail.

 

[Freddie]

Monaco, Seychelles, Cayman Islands and Anguilla have no income taxes.

And a variety of other places.

The best way to avoid paying income tax is to use a battery of sophisticated but legal techniques to circumvent it. Such as corporations and loopholes. Rich people do it all the time. Heck, that's why they're rich!

Hmmm....

Chances are that battery of sophisticated but legal techniques will be sold to you by a crowd of people with a fondness of sending you huge bills.

This is a VERY dangerous field with mines in it. There is also a good chance that the people selling you advice don't know enough and too little knowledge when attempting this kind of stuff can be VERY dangerous with disastrous, stressful and extremely expensive consequences.

There IS a way around all this (and I am NOT selling ANYTHING in this "niche") but I am pretty sure that particularly Americans will be appalled by the solution and they will most likely not be able to cope psychologically with that solution.

Oh, before I forget, it doesn't involve any "income tax is illegal" arguments.


I fully agree with other posters that it doesn't matter what the law says. It depends 100% on what those who have the guns and like to use them think and do.

 

[java]

There IS a way around all this (and I am NOT selling ANYTHING in this "niche") but I am pretty sure that particularly Americans will be appalled by the solution and they will most likely not be able to cope psychologically with that solution.

Right, it's call renouncing your citizenship.

Alternatively, if you are a U.S. citizen and you live outside the U.S. and earn income overseas, you can use the Foreign Earned Income Exclusion to avoid taxes on the first $80,000 of income.

 

[bargain]

well here is one theory:

1. tell the affiliate program you sign up with that you are from overseas.
2. have them pay to an overseas bank account- jersey, isle of man, cayman etc
3. pay not tax, fill out no USA tax forms etc

is it really so hard? just be prepared to go to jail if/when you need to get the money back into the country

 

[stinky_boy]

that last tidbit of information(going to jail) for some odd reason, spoils the plan for me.

 

[Freddie]

Right, it's call renouncing your citizenship.

Java, that would only be part of it.

Do this incorrectly and you are STILL going to be taxed.

I meant in making this statement that it is also possible to not pay taxes for people with other nationalities. Most of those people will not have to renounce their citizenship. People from some countries however will be faced with other specific difficulties.

 

[Freddie]

well here is one theory:

1. tell the affiliate program you sign up with that you are from overseas.
2. have them pay to an overseas bank account- jersey, isle of man, cayman etc
3. pay not tax, fill out no USA tax forms etc

hmm....

is it really so hard?

To do it legally OR to get away with it is a lot more difficult/complicated than that.

just be prepared to go to jail if/when you need to get the money back into the country

The above theory is a good example of too little knowledge being dangerous.

You may also end up still paying tax through withholding tax if you do it that way and you may also end up in jail without ever getting the money back into the country.

From the IRS:

A qualified intermediary (QI) is any foreign intermediary (or foreign branch of a U.S. intermediary) that has entered into a qualified intermediary withholding agreement with the IRS.

Foreign financial institutions and foreign branches of U.S. financial institutions can enter into an agreement with the IRS to be a qualified intermediary. A QI is entitled to certain simplified withholding and reporting rules.

The "can" from the above quote is obviously a euphemism as those who entered into this agreement have no doubt been coerced into it.

For an explanation on this issue I suggest reading the article at this link:

[url]http://baumanblog.sovereignsociety.com/2008/07/qualified-inter.html[/url]

Maybe I should start a new thread and give some pointers on where to start if this is your objective.

 

[marcuskona]

I am 39 years young and have never paid taxes in my life. Nor have I ever been contacted by the IRS, truth is if youi never paid taxes before you dont ever have to pay taxes ever, but once you file a tax form then your locked in to pay taxes for the rest of your life.
once you file its a contract that you agree to file every year or risk penalties,jail etc..
I am walking proof that you can stick it to uncle sam if you never filed before.

 

[Freddie]

Dear 39 year old,

I'm sure the IRS would disagree with you. For your sake I hope that your user name is not your real name!!

 

[pussyback]

cold hard fact is if you don't pay taxs you will go to jail

 

[workingwhileworking]

doesn't change the fact that Ron Paul is Da Man.... I pushed for Change... and Obama won? WTF is that about!?

 

[plouyd]

I'm gonna live in a cave with 2 cups on a string for internet.. they'll still find me, I hear they pick up on vibrations.

 

[workingwhileworking]

I'm gonna live in a cave with 2 cups on a string for internet.. they'll still find me, I hear they pick up on vibrations.

no, there's no bath in cave. they track you by BO.

 

[virtualgeorge]

I think I am just going to conveniently forgot to mention a large portion of my earnings. You know like Timothy Geithner, the CEO & Pres of the Federal Reserve who is responsible for a lot of the tax code. He has been dodging taxes for years but he said it was an honest mistake so Obama has appointed him to Sec of the Treasury.

I am just going to make an honest mistake as well, wonder where they will appoint me to. Probably buba's cell mate

 

[MiLiTARYiV]

HUMMM
How exactly does the IRS catch you for not filing tax returns? I mean how do they know u even made money. I know some people that own ecommerce websites or even sell on Ebay using Paypal who was never paid nor filed a tax return ever since they started biz online.