Why I find University pointless....

[Deleted member 84902]

yeah most people that go to college only get their bachelor's though...

edit: and plus you're over exagerating. you wont make 3x more unless pigs fly over the moon..

Australian psychs can make about $300,000 a year, working part time.

 

[Autumn]

Put language, grammar and other stuff aside, Autumn, you just got 0wn3d. wned:

No offense intended.

Are you saying I got owned? I think joe managed to own himself pretty well.

The point that joe and many other posters seem to be missing is that you don't go to university to get a job. You go to university to expand your mind and learn formal, rigorous ways of thinking in an academic environment, which is something that joe's little incoherent rant shows he is sadly lacking. If you want to learn a vocation, you go to technical institution; if you want to learn how to think, you go to a good university.

Also, in many scientific and engineering fields there is literally no way to learn to a high level by yourself - you need the resources that a university provides.

People always point out Zuckerberg, Steve Jobs et al as proof that you don't need to go to university to make money. I fully agree, but at the same time, statistics clearly show that people with degrees generally out-earn their non degree holding counterparts by an order of magnitude. Yes there are obvious exceptions, but anyone with a basic knowledge of statistics knows that the outliers don't disprove the general rule.

I will quite happily compare my stats to anyone on this board (I have never had a proper job since I was at university and I've been a webmaster for 10 years - I have posted proof of my entrepreneurial success many times before and am not about to do it again here), but there is much more to life than making money!

Joe talks a good game about education not being necessary, but his focus solely on making money is the ultimate in narrow mindedness. As an aside, I am fluent or semi-fluent in several European languages and they all use paragraphs just like we do in English, so I assume that joe is barely literate in his mother tongue as well as in English.

 

[Deleted member 84902]

You can NEVER, earn more money then 'i make'online by a job. Even if you go and prostutute;

Your way of thinking is middleclass.

You get payed IF you work. WE get payed cause we were smart and we build an asset. We don't need a retirement plan. We don't need to think about what IF i'm sick?

it's like you live in 1930. I don't even understand what u doingon blackhatworld 'LOL'.

And this is about the part where I started to lol my ass off and stopped reading
.

Why do you feel the need to defend your self and your work so heavily? Your post wreaks of insecurity.

 

[Monrox]

Dude, learn to write short and concise texts. It's easier to have discussions this way.

I see you are refering to me young boy. (with your two years)

I was referring to the OP but it seems most dropouts quit after the first 2 years.
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Did u ever read the Bible? Cause you are talking about it's the BIBLE, but u never read the Bible. I can see that because of your Comment.

You did not read the bible, and u are comparing something u don't know yourself and u are still comparing too.

Which one do you mean exactly? Certainly you can't expect me to read the 1000+ versions each sect thinks is the right one.
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What u saying is, That facebook, is created by a stupid guy, a college drop out, and still u use it everyday.

The appel, and windows u use, is also created by college dropouts,...

and u use it everyday. So what u say Is, They couldn't graduate that's why they changed the world? lol

I agree that you don't need a degree to come up with a hugely successful idea but if you are already over 23 and still not a millionaire... well, there goes poof your Gates & Zuckerberg dream. They were not disappointed btw, they were not like "fvck it, I am going to come up with a way to make billions". Nope, they put college on hold to get the time they needed. Afterwards it was just not needed anymore.
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If you can create your own job and buy your house in CASH without any loan, then u can graduate ANY university.

If you knew a thing about economics, you'd also know that loans are a great money making vehicle. Like buying a house with a loan and renting it for more then using the proceeds to secure a larger loan and so on. Today, when you buy stuff with your own cash, the only one profiting is the seller. And if you are in the USA and bought a house in the last 3-4 years, you lost money. Stuff was immensly overpriced, that's what started the bank crisis.

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If i didn't left university i would graduate 2years ago. My friend graduated 2 years ago.

He is genius in what he does. And he works for me as i pay him twice as what he would get to work with a big company. guess what, he is my best asset, he makes me 17 times more money then i pay him.

He doesn't even ask about it, his mindset is so narrow like yours.

Ah, you'll get no argument from me here. There are those that work very hard to get the best marks possible. What this means to an employer is that they will be 3 times better than the others for the same pay. But if you think my mind is as narrow as your friend's, why don't you hire me, make me do what he does, pay me 10x less or even nothing and see what happens in a month
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I have websites in over 18 langues, and i understand none of them.. All of them Exact match domains, and are ranked in top 3. I dont even know about what they are. All i know is they are generating money with adsense very single month.

And this is where you are actually missing the point. Adsense is run by college graduates and Adsense is making way more money from you that you are making from your friend. Same goes for the advertisers. So yeah, keep believing you are an apex predator, on top of the food chain etc. etc. and keep toiling for the higher-ups.

'I can buy a house in cash', what a joke. My grandparents think houses are the most important thing, you seem to as well. And telling me I am programmed.

 

[ShadeDream]

Are you saying I got owned? I think joe managed to own himself pretty well.

The point that joe and many other posters seem to be missing is that you don't go to university to get a job. You go to university to expand your mind and learn formal, rigorous ways of thinking in an academic environment, which is something that joe's little incoherent rant shows he is sadly lacking. If you want to learn a vocation, you go to technical institution; if you want to learn how to think, you go to a good university.

-Snip-

Yeah I know, I was just joking.

I totally agree with you, I just haven't really read the thread because I'm too tired to do so. But as I've said in my previous post, I'm not surprised why the OP has had such an experience, after all he went to one of the shittiest Universities in the country.

 

[daveguy]

Go to college for the girls if nothing else. It's the only time in your life that thousands of beautiful women your age will be in such a close proximity. I graduate in December with a major in Advertising, but if I could do it all again I'd do business. If you're going to run your own shit it'd help to know accounting, economics...

 

[joaquin112]

Well, there are two sides to everything. Sure, uni might be a waste of money, but it's a good thing to fall on if times get rough. As history has taught us, IM is neither easy nor secure. One day you might be making thousands and the next your website might get hacked, google might slap you, your jealous competitor might DDOS your site, someone might steal your customer's data, your server might crash... and the list goes on....

Additionally, we have no idea what the web will be like 2, 5 10 years from now. Maybe websites as we know them will not exist anymore. Then what? If you rely on e-mail advertisement, maybe there will be huge changes to that as well.

It's too unreliable, but as everyone else says, this is BHW and I'm in for the ride

 

[w84it]

I'm in College just to get that piece of paper as a backup but i fully agree that you can teach yourself newer and better things just by reading stuff on the internet.

Go to college for the girls if nothing else. It's the only time in your life that thousands of beautiful women your age will be in such a close proximity. I graduate in December with a major in Advertising, but if I could do it all again I'd do business. If you're going to run your own shit it'd help to know accounting, economics...

lol not if you are in IT / Engineering

 

[makii]

I think everyone should read what Autumn has written....twice!

I have a masters degree and been doing IM since 2002. One of the problems of people who go university is not understanding why they are there in the first place.

If your only reason for going to college is to get money, then I would seriously suggest that you stop now. At the same time, if your sole purpose of existence is to make money, then you have very big problems. What kind of life is it when all you want to do is to make money?

It is true that you may probably make a lot of money quickly through IM. It is also true that the biggest challenge in life is not making money but being a better person. I know of IM'ers who make a lot of money and go drink it over the weekend. I believe that's a shallow life.

I want to make money, but really enjoy what good things there are on this planet.

College helps you achieve so much of that. Forget the classroom, what about your life outside the classroom. Did you know that some of the clients you will be looking for are now in college? Or do you think networking and getting big business deals is about Twitter? Do you understand the importance of entering a room of total strangers and making yourself heard and respected? Or do you think that you will be famous just by doing SEO?

There is more in life than making money and IM. Some of us have realised that and we are all the better for it. My opinion is that the problem is not college, the problem is the student.

College is supposed to groom your mind to think outside the box. Not to make money.

 

[ShadeDream]

lol not if you are in IT / Engineering

So true...

 

[Mises]

It really depends on the person, what you want to study, and what you want to do.

 

[IamNRE]

You can NEVER, earn more money then 'i make'online by a job. Even if you go and prostutute;

Your way of thinking is middleclass.

You get payed IF you work. WE get payed cause we were smart and we build an asset. We don't need a retirement plan. We don't need to think about what IF i'm sick?

it's like you live in 1930. I don't even understand what u doingon blackhatworld 'LOL'.

Here is the thing: If you do succed ONLINE 'i don't mean making 2k -10k monthly, I mean to make those daily without any effort and enjoy your life, cause that's the internet life style.

Then you GOT a degree CALLED: I CAN GET EVERYTHING

I'm not talking about money, i'm talking about the mindset u need to succed.

Your degree is useless as a toilet paper, If you die tomorrow, you can't sell it, you can't pass it to your children you can't gift to your children.

Only thing u can do is be proud of it as an idiot.

I can sell my business, and i can pass it on to my family and they can live their lives wealthy and happily without a problem.

Now Why would u advice someone to put his 5 YEARS or more into getting a degree? If the only thing you would get out of is a A JOB?

Putting 5 years into something that u can't sell , pass on to someone? Smart?

and you are on blackhatworld?

Now, sorry i got this anger in me, but i get really pissed, to see something like this on a IM forum, i wouldn't say anything if it was on your university forum.

When you compare yourself to someone who earns online and say u can make TRIPLE without knowing that perosn, tell me alot about you.

How can you say that if you don't know me, or other marketers here.

People you hang out think like you, and i bet their bank account is also in the thousands,.


Let me goo deeper,


A degree is something that does'nt exist. People Made it up and gave a social statute. There is a reason why most SELF made millionairs and wealthy people don't have a degree.


First you need to understand WEALTH!

Wealth is not YOUR INCOME, wealth is this: If you and your wife stop working today, how long can you live on the money you have saved up or coming in?

Now YOU can't live a damn month/year with your triple degree, cause when u stop working your money is cut off. That's what we call a job = just over broke !

Now If I stop working, i can survive easy 60 years! EASY! SO my wealth is 60 years. IF i raise my income standard i can get up to 25-30 years.

back to topic.

A degree is like Fashion. It's made up. You have to read history books, i have read over 1000 books in the last 5 year. And i puted all of them in action.

And what u will discover if u do the same., a degree is made up and it's to control people and motivate them to "get educated". It's like fashion, everyday brands create new stuff, so the illusion get's THE FEAR: If i don't have the latest i'm outdated!

Big guys that u don't even know they exist, genius motherfuckers created those ideas.


Degree is based on fear, of 'not getting the high class statut of 'hey this guy is smart, he is educated, he even got 2 degrees".

Or the fear of being poor, people study to not be poor.

We work to be rich and wealthy.

It's a mindset that u don't have.

A degree is not a piece of paper, a degree is your Key to "slavery".

Look arround you.


Your degree in software engineer is "ZERO" as ur wasting your time into psychology.

EVERY DAY we are progressing, and technology and software progress the fastest.

What u invest today, tomorrow it's outdated.

NOW you can't put the SAME hours into software engineering and studing psychology.

SO your SOFTWARE degree is awarage and your skills are AVARAGE nothing compared to a SELF tought, who REPEATS and WORKS HARD everyday inh is small room, and your psychology is also ZERO because all u know is

THEORIE.

I have studied 2 years psychology, It's useless if you don't practise it.

It's all theories !

So your knowlegde like is said is just knowlegde.

You are like my sister, she has 3 degrees, 'masters in managenet", LAW" and now she is studing for marketing.

Think 10 times before you post something. Never talk to someone who u don't know and talk about his earnings and compare it to yours.

Btw, don't get in discussion with me, cause i don't have a degree, and i'm stupid.

Check and Mate.... Now King him!

 

[BreakAllTheClocks]

Sergey Brin and Larry Page only met because they were assigned the same dorm room at Stanford.

Bill Gates and Steve Ballmer only met because their dorm rooms were on the same hallway at Harvard.

Mark Zuckerberg only met Dustin Moskovitz because they were roommates at Harvard.

None of these meetings would have taken place if these people were working alone in their basements.

You should use your university years to surround yourself with and learn from brilliant peers and professors. If you are spending years learning HTML For Dummies you are indeed wasting your time.

 

[ardley216]

Well, that says a lot, don't be surprised then.

I am pretty sure that your experience would have been different if you went to a better University. Then again if you're doing a web design degree ... you'd need to definitely look out of London to find a good University for that.

Greenwich is comparable to Middlesex/Westminster and they are both shit.

But indeed the area is definitely beautiful.

Well, I was a total slacker before Uni, But I was by no means stupid. One of those kids who the teachers said.. "you're very bright but you're lazy".. anyway I only wanted to go to uni to have fun, so i totally lied to get onto a course. I did not get the course I wanted so I had to study business, and for the first time in my life, I was getting 75%, in fact for that year that was my LOWEST grade. I even redesigned the whole uni's website (which some help). But this was at a partner college. Greenwich Uni is very low ranked, because over 20% of the students first language is not English, and they stick to themselves. Then I got on this web design course, which has NO meaning to me.

The uni offers stuff to students all the time, but it's like 500 fishermen, fishing 2 small fish. BHW is like 2 fishermen fishing an ocean of MASSIVE fish!

I feel I am going to get a lot of stick for saying I slacked and it was my fault!

PS, anyone visiting London, visit Greenwich!

Sergey Brin and Larry Page only met because they were assigned the same dorm room at Stanford.

Bill Gates and Steve Ballmer only met because their dorm rooms were on the same hallway at Harvard.

Mark Zuckerberg only met Dustin Moskovitz because they were roommates at Harvard.

None of these meetings would have taken place if these people were working alone in their basements.

You should use your university years to surround yourself with and learn from brilliant peers and professors. If you are spending years learning HTML For Dummies you are indeed wasting your time.

Yep totally agree, all the greats met in the top Universities. I mean look at the pythons! Graham Chapman, Eric Idle, Terry Jones, John Cleese, Michael Palin...

But let me clarify, I am sticking it to the end. I will not waste my money, but i am wasting my time. I agree that education is important, but do not study something you already know. I probably will never use this degree, other than in conversations with my grandparents...

 

[joefresh]

Let's end this conversation as brothers. I think op got what he was looking for, different opinions from different people with different experience.

The people i met at my university were the lowest class narrow minded people always talking about their lessons, courses, lectures, professor that suck, that it's borring that they partied all night ect ect.

I always wanted to get into IT and programming, but i never did and i don't know why. I'm sure i would finished that one.

But the problem with university is not the quality of the courses alone, it's the mindset that u get.

Did u ever noticed that if u had to do something for someone else, u end up doing it on time, but if u planned to do something for your self, u always delay it?

Like ' u talk , u say thing, but u never get it done", but if u have to work for someone u will go to work like a nice really sissi girl and u will be perfect on time. But your own stuff u don't do it.

So that's one of the reasons that people just get a job. and Once u get a job u have to work hard to not get fired, to earn more, and to some people to pay their univesity debts.

So they don't have time to make their dreams come true. Next thing u know they buy a house with a bank loan, then a car= and now They are tracked in the rat race.

Cause If they stop working, they will lose the house, the car and even their wife.

I'm talking about people who really wants to make their dreams come true, and be self employed and enjoy life.

The taxes in america is nothing if u compare to europe here. (I mean no i don't have any tax, but i mean if i had graduated and got a job 40% of my income was gone every single month).

back to topic, if you are gruadated, next thing u do is get a job. Because all those years u didn't had any normal income, You are WAITING for that day to graudate to start eanring money, to spend it, buy cars, ect ect ect.

So the guy who chooses university , his first steps to debt starts right after he gets his degree.

Now people who don't go to university , to get a job to work = those are stupid people.

I'm talking about people who know what they want but don't have the balls to go for it. They want to become a millionair.

I don't have a million dollar (yet) but if i sell all my business it's worth more. It's not about the money it's about freedom, happyness.

Because if u don't have money problems, u can think more creativly.

I said once to my ex Gf parrents " The minimal thing a humain being has to acomplisch in her or his life is to get a university degree". Even if u don't use it.

That's what i have said. So i have been in that mindset before.

You see we don't get out of university because we cant study, we get out of it cause we dont give a shit and we know we can use those years to get what we want instead of to get what others thing is right.

All what i'm saying is, This era we are living 2012 soon, it's smarter to go your own way and make your dreams come true then before.

Ofcourse if u want to be an engineer, you need a degree, But as we are here in blackhat world, i would think that most people are like me with the same interest.

One more thing: With Virtual Real estate = websites , Houses don't represent anything to this business.

When i got good income i wanted to buy a house. (it was arround 260k euros). It was not a villa but it was a decent house. (and in europe they say best thing u can do is buy a house, the price always increases, and people keep buying).

Now after some calculation, the house was the shitest decicion u can ever make. Even if u was going to rent. If i rent a 260k house, the MAX out of it i could get 1200euros monthly for it.

I took the money and build, 6 Giant Article wbesites, like ezine articles, for european countries.

We have a system like ehow, Our research theme researches keywords, and adds to the list, the writers chooose their title,s and click accept to start writing on it, then we have a review theme.

First year I made only 70k proffit (as i was a noob and did alot of stuff wrong, hired wrong people ect) But second year we made a proffit nett of 240 or 214 (i don't remember).

If i had bought the house and rented, i would got about 14k the first year and 14k the second, and keep in mind, I had the chance to buy it with Cash = no bank loans, no interest nothing. If i had to go to bank loan i would pay in 25 years :400k for the house of 260k.

and as you know, you first pay banks interest then u pay your house, what i mean is, you will first pay the EXTRA % over the 260 then once u have payed it in 8-10 years, u start to pay your own house.

Now if u got a job, and u got sick after 10 years and cant work and want to sell the house, ALOT of people think it's their house but they do'nt understand if u sell it after 10 years, u will get nothing from it. Bank will sell it take their intreset .

At the end u was living and RENTING your own house yourself and payed a 1200 euro for it. SO it was not an asset.

Now What univesity tought me in the first two years, that a house was well an asset. lol

You are just lucky to be born in this era, why don't u take advantage of it ?

Let's close this disccusion and help op out.

OP u just have to choose what u want and go after it. Like i said u need big balls to not fear and never regret and make your decision to be the right.

Leaving university is only GOOD if you become what u want to be. If you know u can, then u don't have to waste time in your university.

If you are confused and don't really know what to do, Then you are wasting your time by not studing your lessons and courses and are reading this forum.

I made that mistake. I did both, and none of them had any result. Once i stoped one (my case was university) 6 months later i was there.

Once u know what u really want, life will lead you the right direction. If you don't know what u want the highest u can get is a misserable life.

 

[joefresh]

Why do you feel the need to defend your self and your work so heavily? Your post wreaks of insecurity.

And this is because you are reading a lounge thread instead of working, and EVEN THAT you can't do WELL and finish it.

And this is why your life is an unfinished mess, "cause u tought u were smart enuogh and did not read".

And that's why you will always miss any oppurnity cause you are "too smart to see it".

I don't defend my income, I defend my mindset. I can give away all the money i have and start all over with 100 dollars, in 6 months, what about you??

It's the mindset, not the income. and as u can see u were blind to see what i was defending.

You have to defend in what u believe.

 

[joefresh]

Dude, learn to write short and concise texts. It's easier to have discussions this way.

I was referring to the OP but it seems most dropouts quit after the first 2 years.
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Which one do you mean exactly? Certainly you can't expect me to read the 1000+ versions each sect thinks is the right one.
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I agree that you don't need a degree to come up with a hugely successful idea but if you are already over 23 and still not a millionaire... well, there goes poof your Gates & Zuckerberg dream. They were not disappointed btw, they were not like "fvck it, I am going to come up with a way to make billions". Nope, they put college on hold to get the time they needed. Afterwards it was just not needed anymore.
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If you knew a thing about economics, you'd also know that loans are a great money making vehicle. Like buying a house with a loan and renting it for more then using the proceeds to secure a larger loan and so on. Today, when you buy stuff with your own cash, the only one profiting is the seller. And if you are in the USA and bought a house in the last 3-4 years, you lost money. Stuff was immensly overpriced, that's what started the bank crisis.

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Ah, you'll get no argument from me here. There are those that work very hard to get the best marks possible. What this means to an employer is that they will be 3 times better than the others for the same pay. But if you think my mind is as narrow as your friend's, why don't you hire me, make me do what he does, pay me 10x less or even nothing and see what happens in a month
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And this is where you are actually missing the point. Adsense is run by college graduates and Adsense is making way more money from you that you are making from your friend. Same goes for the advertisers. So yeah, keep believing you are an apex predator, on top of the food chain etc. etc. and keep toiling for the higher-ups.

'I can buy a house in cash', what a joke. My grandparents think houses are the most important thing, you seem to as well. And telling me I am programmed.

Boy, get a degree. be happy, don't waste your time. You are wasting your time, i don't see how this is going to help you to get your degree.

And when i said 'i can buy a house in cash' I meant Nobody can do that with a job, but u can do that in IM.

And as u can read my other reply, buying a house now, takes the oppurnity to invest in Virtual real estate = websites) which can generate more money and they can grow and grow and grow. A house does'nt grow. It's an unsecure purchase, like u said the prices can go up and down.

You got your point of view, i got mine and i see we are both happy with our lifes and our choices. I hope you really are. I'm. So there is no reason to attack each other without really knowing each other.

Let's keep it elegant.

 

[Abstroose]

I have always loved learning and if I hd my time again I would put knowledge
over money.

Completely agree here. That's the reason I'm doing two degrees part-time: in quantum physics and mathematics. I don't want a job in a lab.. in fact, I don't want any job that isn't from home, or a beach in Phuket. I just want the knowledge.

Only reason I'll make my kids work real hard at school and college is to acquire knowledge and learn discipline.

 

[purewealthinc]

I wish I'd gone to Uni, networking, got the contacts, got the links,
I don't think it would've changed me from who I am.
I could give my daughter a high paying full time job in IM but I tell
her to to major in Gothic English literature yeh it's weird because I can't
see the point but she kills me at scrabble. her brain works in way mine don't.
I have always loved learning and if I hd my time again I would put knowledge
over money.

101% this is what i am about to say.. University is really worth even if you already know the basic one.. I learned a lot through IM but i did not understimated the worth of Universities even they are started from the basic knowledge. If i had given a chance and enough time, i really love to go in college even i already knows the basic steps

 

[Dj Co2]

University=fun!

No seriously you need to go to a college to not end up illiterate/dumb.. Now I bet we all have such examples around us