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Why do people say PBN is safe?

Discussion in 'Black Hat SEO' started by wonsong82, Aug 27, 2014.

  1. wonsong82

    wonsong82 Registered Member

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    From my knowledge, it is safe. At least as of now.
    But there are many factors thats too artificial about it, unless I am mistaken.

    Even with aged domains, different IPs, different PRs, they dont seem natural to me and google will
    eventually catch up on it.

    1. domains: google can find out all the domains thats linking to you had been dropped or expired.
    2. links: although inbound links can be diversified by purchasing a good expired domain, they have very unnatural looking outbound links even if you diversifying it. Also, building automated T2 on these PBN look very unnatural.
    3. page: google probably has(or will have) a page snapshot tool that can compare and find out these domains have totally different snapshots. (site category, type, coding structure, etc).

    To me, it seems manual guest posting is the only way to get a good T1 backlinks (followed by T2, T3 spams).
    It is costy and time consuming (to contact the webmasters and ask for guest posting), but that is the only way to build a future proof natural looking links.

    I am seeing so many people are going for PBN, but they are as costy and ineffective.
    (Its going to be cheaper if you make 1000 sites for your PBN. And let these sites talk about anything about earth and use this network for multiple money sites. But it leaves too much footprint for future google updates)

    Sure you can go 100% future proof PBN but thats going to be really costy:
    Good PBN can only be used for sites that shares same niche category. And each sites should have many unique hand written contents and look like a real site.
    Size of the sites and design themes, CMSs must all vary, even coding structures, just to remove any type of the foot prints.

    Let say guest posting costs $50-$100 per link. But its like you are paying $50-$100 for a very well established natural looking page thats giving you additional traffic and juice.
    Building another Tier with tools is also effective on these, because the page and the domain already have many traffics, links and etc.
    Can you build and establish a real good site for $50-$100(A site in your PBN)?

    Dont you all think Manual Guest Posting is the better way than PBN? (longitivity, google updates, cost effectiveness)
    Please criticize and correct me if im wrong.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2014
  2. Reyone

    Reyone Elite Member

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    That's whats up, if you want a solid one, you are going to have to invest HEAVY, and not to get a lot of sites, but to get a few extremely HQ. This is something people chose to ignore and it is one of the most relevant factors when it comes to PBNs.

    Quality comes at a price...

    In regards of your 3 points, thats pretty much BS, as those can easily be disguised; again, you are going to want to have a few people hired and schedule everything to achieve a fully safe PBN.
     
  3. kacpros

    kacpros Newbie

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    You are right, but in my opinion it is the safiest way, not safe
     
  4. balotz

    balotz Junior Member

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    agree with Reyone. if you have pbn with even 10-20 websites on killer domains, you can bank hard.
    in case your website get a manual review, your chances are very small to not get caught (unless you have X,XXX to invest), no matter which way you choose to build your blinks.
     
  5. J-S-T

    J-S-T Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    You have gotta Point. Guest Posts Works Well too. Both PBN link and Guest Posts have shown Positive results to me. I tend to Reach out for people in my niche and Grab a Backlink from already published post that have high DA and PA. Getting Good Results.
     
  6. Reyone

    Reyone Elite Member

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    To me, the single most crucial element is not the ultra mega powerful domain or how awesome the content you added was. The most important element is how you MAINTAIN THEM!

    If you set them and forget about them, you will just hurt your PBN, you must keep adding content (of all kinds!); and if you REALLY want to go the extra mile, you will treat them as independent websites. Tough job, aint it? Well, thats what it takes if you want a fully safe PBN.
     
  7. Asif WILSON Khan

    Asif WILSON Khan Executive VIP Premium Member

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    90% of people who suggest PBN's as an answer to everything have never built one or ranked a site.
    Focus on quality. Everything still works if it is quality.
     
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  8. arganrecords

    arganrecords Elite Member

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    PBN it's really difficult to manage if you want it on work. It's simple have a spam PBN but quality PBN with really effective backlinks is another thing.

    If you can manage a PBN making it quality over quality you can rank well sites with backlinks.
    If you want to sell guest posts to crappy sites it's obvious that your PBN is destined to die and be 0% effective.
     
  9. hootsparta

    hootsparta Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    Create your own PBN. I am ready to provide you in best price. Because, you can own your own blogs to rank your website.
     
  10. LeanLow

    LeanLow Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    1 year ago i thought bhw was the shit, now when i'm here reading posts like this ...
     
  11. SEO Power

    SEO Power Elite Member

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    If Google wanted to detect and penalise all the blog networks in existence today, they would. They just don't want to bother themselves too much because they are not affecting the quality of their results on a massive scale.
     
  12. jon_xx_x

    jon_xx_x Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    No they couldn't, that's a stupid post. A good PBN will look identical to a normal site, so it would be 100% impossible for google to detect it.
    3/4 of the crap people here put together, yeah they probably could, but even that would be hard to do.
     
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  13. nglbh

    nglbh Registered Member

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    Google is finding a way to let good sites in and keep bad sites out. Now what you also must understand is that this is difficult as hell for them to do. 90% of the bazillion sites on the web are good sites (sorta). Basically their job is to do brain surgery with a machete. They have to find a way to filter out millions of sites, without touching the bazillion good sites that people actively search for. Can you imagine that? They have to find what a bad million sites all have in common, but DO NOT have in common with a bazillion other sites. If they overstep just a tiny fraction BOOM a zillion good sites get nuked, and their users flip shit.

    quote from Alex Becker
     
  14. wonsong82

    wonsong82 Registered Member

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    Thats my point. To make a good PBN it costs more than guest blog posting. To grow out a good PBN its more costy.

    Good guest post can be spammed in a certain degree(30-40 Quality web2s) without being suspicious at all.
     
  15. moonlighsunligh

    moonlighsunligh Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    No way that they have this kind of resources to research all that info for all the backlinks of a domain. Only in case of a manual review. Then it is easy to spot a private network, if it is a low quality one.

    But if you wanna build an authority site which earns a lot, i guess it isn't problem to invest something like $20 per month per PBN site for maintaining it, and hosting on a big cheaper independent hosting such as $2-$3 per month ones including highly popular ones such as hostgator.

    Of course with quality content you might even get more links do hide the PBN ones.
     
  16. wonsong82

    wonsong82 Registered Member

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    Well thats essentially what G has been doing with all the updates. Web2.0s, wikis, bookmarks etc, all the past things once was a bullet-proofed SEO tactics. They survive at that time, but lookin at it now, many of my sites used the services more than 5-6 years ago are all dead now.

    PBN works. I see that. but how long? wheras guest posting is never going to die. Sure its hard to filter out the millions of the sites, but surprisingly they ve been doing , and good at it.

    There are many commonality factors between sites in PBN. Check your competitor and you can easily see the one is using PBN. Most of them are wordpress themed blog sites with endless categories. The sites have no purpose in a business point of view(from the view of non-SEO person).

    If I were a G employee, to hunt down PBN, the first algo i could think is this.
    1. Collect sites that can't be categorize into single or few niches.(most of the low quality PBNs that talk about everything in the earth)
    2. If these sites are low in traffic low in inbound links, but high in outbound links, this could be more suspicious.
    3. If a site has a high rate on, x amount of links from these type of the site / y amount of links thats do follow,
    then the site is really suspicious.

    Sure, if you build PBN just for one site, and if you treat each sites in PBN as if you are building a money site, they are less likely filtered and they are very future proof. (Because they are real sites!!!) But It would cost as much as building a money site and thats going to cost more than whilte-hat-way of guest posting.

    Im not here to sell guest posts. I dont even have one to sell. And if you buy guest blog from SEO seller, thats not the guest blog im talking about.
     
  17. jon_xx_x

    jon_xx_x Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    I agree, but there is always a concern of the blog post site getting hit with some type of penalty. You have to be careful where you blog post and not just blog post anywhere.
    But with your PBN you also have the ability to link from front page. Shouldn't be done all the time, but it's good to have some.
    But I pay my writer $4 per article, and she's a well above average American writer. Create 5 pages, that's $20, domain cost $10, you're at $30 already with out creating any backlinks.
     
  18. Laubster

    Laubster Senior Member Premium Member

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    Agree. People think about SEO as if Google was a human. It's an algorithm. The difference between a legitimate editorial link (a natural one) and a high quality PBN link is razor thin. Google would completely fuck up the SERPs if they took away their reliance on PR/power metrics. And if you're not using duplicate content on your T1, it's extremely hard for their algo to decipher b/w a legit link and an SEO link. Obviously quality comes into the picture, but OP's assertions are just non-sense. Guest posts are NOT the only safe, good links. There's almost no diff b/w the two.
     
  19. moonlighsunligh

    moonlighsunligh Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    If you have a really good money site that will last for years and earn a lot (Alexa 10 000 or something) I guess it is worth keeping the network online.

    How many domain are actually needed to rank for something like 30K per month providing you done a good kw research? 20-30 PBN sites?

    It all comes down to conversion rate, if you have better earning per click you can afford larger and better PBN.:)
     
  20. JournoNick

    JournoNick Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    Quality vs Quantity. It's an ancient debate that still is relevant today.

    I've said it before and I'll continue saying it. Stop building shit PBNs and focus on quality! All the sites I run, whether they're for links or not have value. Why would Google burn something that gives the internet better search results and higher quality experience with top notch material? I think people become confused with the term Personal Blog Network, really you should think about making a kick ass blog, then making another kick ass blog, then if you have room make another kick ass blog. Get it?