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What would you choose? ... 2 Jobs

Discussion in 'BlackHat Lounge' started by neutralhatter, Mar 27, 2015.

  1. neutralhatter

    neutralhatter Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Hi,

    almost 2 years ago I posted this thread: http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackh...-do-i-have-2-job-offers-please-advise-me.html

    I got some good advice there from people like jazzc and several others. I went for job offer 1 and was right to do so, company of job offer 2 went bankrupt only half a year after that decision.

    Thanks again or the good advice....

    Now, I'm facing another dilemma and need your help again BHW !!
    ----------------

    Here is the summary for people who don't really like reading:

    Current job: software developer: I have value - but stressfull and not appreciated (I often feel like this guy to say the least: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg) - there are some difficulties between business and myself because of limited insight - this may or may not get worse over time. Okey salary and flexible hours -> (reasonable hours and keeps family happy - easy to stay home should someone get sick or something)

    New job: university teacher: Something I think that I will like. there is risk in being able to secure the job since there are extra requirements to be met during my employement. Okey salary but no flexible hours and will be an hour later home each day (family would have liked me to be home at the same time as current job and it's more difficult to stay home if someone is sick or something since I'll have to be replaced) , though I have 50% more vacation each year.


    What would you do????

    -------------

    The bit longer story:

    I recently went to talk to a university/college in good standing and they want me to become a full teacher in Software Development. I still have 1 more talk left but things are looking really good.
    Now, I like teaching (I have already tought before but not in a university) and it has been an ambition of mine to teach people part-time next to working on my own projects.

    Though, I feel reluctant to quit my current job. and this for the following reasons:

    - my current job is relatively close to home, 35 minute drive and flexible hours. as a university teacher flexibility will be less and the distance is greater so I expect to be home an hour later then I am now. obviously my family likes me to be home at the time I arrive now....
    - I invested a lot of time in to my current job and projects and my boss has let me know on regular basis that he is really happy with me.
    - There are thousands of employees using the software that I maintain and there is barely any documentation(I had to work my butt off to figure things out in the existing software - it has about half a million lines of code), so it's going to be costly to replace me, so they probably will think twice before firing me.

    On the other hand, I get a lot of stress of my current job for the following reasons:

    - The competency level of the organisation I work for is low... I made a mistake in thinking that this would give me less work... It has given me more work ... for example, the software solutions are a mess ... other developers at the company don't really see it... The business people have no insight in what I do and I often get mails where it appears the if something isn't working as they expect, that it is all my fault...

    - I have almost zero human contact, only when people need something or want to complain. The main client treats me as if I'm an imbicil and since the main client has a 'secret' relationship with another 'older' developer - they usually team up, even if their reasoning makes no sence. In the beginning I could deal with this ... but the longer it lasts, the more often I feel like jumping out of the window (sorta speak).


    Other things I'm thinking about
    - family life: as a university teacher I have less flexibility...am home an hour later.. and it's more difficult to react to emergencies (if someone is sick or something)
    - the university wants me to get a real teachers degree (Since I a actually have a degree in computer science and not teaching...but are willing to give me an education in it during work hours). They say that almost everyone that gets this education also gets the degree... But should the event occur that I don't make it, then I'll loose the job.... I don't want my family to bear the consequences...
    - Employers usually don't like seeing a resume with multiple jobs - they may think I'm a job hopper - that's a reason for not changing jobs.... On the other hand - being able to say that I am or have been a university teacher is quite nice.

    So what would you do??
     
  2. lord1027

    lord1027 Elite Member

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    I always thought University Teacher means less work hours than a regular job. After reading both job descriptions, I would stay at job offer 1 and look for alternatives in the future.
    There's no point in changing your job if you can't get a better one.
     
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  3. nobodyelsein

    nobodyelsein Regular Member

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    Jobs are SO 2001...
     
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  4. neutralhatter

    neutralhatter Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Thanks for your input.

    hours of teaching is limited to 40% but they require you to stay at school to help students in projects and just pretty much be available for them.
     
  5. Approachable

    Approachable Junior Member

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    It seems you really dont like your job. So why not go and take the second one. More work hours per day but more leave to.Spend those time with your family.Your new job is going to be less stressful, happy(kids right). Work smart at this new job(Use technology), work a lot on side projects(Whenever you have time) take everything slowly!
     
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  6. AstralCowboy

    AstralCowboy Newbie

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    Before you snap and start going postal, its better to take the 2nd job. We don't want to hear about you in the evening news.
     
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  7. lord1027

    lord1027 Elite Member

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    That doesn't sound so bad, maybe you can take care of your IM projects in that time. I doubt you'll be busy with students all that time.
     
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  8. Trepanated

    Trepanated Supreme Member

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    First of all, forgetting the pros and cons of each job, what would you rather be - a teacher or a developer?

    Once you know the answer to that, it'll be easier to make a decision.

    And depending on the answer, your decision may be that neither option is right.

    For example, if you would rather be a developer, then perhaps the only reason you are considering the teaching job is because you hate your current role. So you either need to find a new developer job, or negotiate some changes in the current job.

    And if you would rather be a teacher, then you are in the wrong career right now and you do need to make the move. In that case, look at the new role as a convenient and timely stepping stone into that new career.

    But the first question is the key - what career would you be happier with?
     
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  9. WebTG

    WebTG Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    I think you are really stress with your current job so there is no point of talking about that in the second job i see only one problem and that is "Degree" if you will not make it you have too leave job that's a big problem. if you are confident enough then go for second job otherwise stay with current job and look for other opportunity.
     
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  10. cnick79

    cnick79 Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Do what you love and you'll never work a day in your life.
     
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  11. RuthSam

    RuthSam Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    My dream was always to work for Mc Donalds and Burger King. When I off the one place I go to the next making burgers all day long.
     
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  12. Aatrox

    Aatrox Supreme Member

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    The fact that you're thinking about that other job is probably a sign that you could use a change (or maybe you're not truly happy with your current job).

    I say, go for it. Try it out, if it's not something you love to do, I'm sure you'll be able to find a different job. Good luck man, let us know what you decided :)
     
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  13. MrKhiem

    MrKhiem Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    I think you shouldn't really focus on which offer you're having right now. Your problem is which job would you like. You prefer to be talking about computer science, or actually doing it as a software developer.

    If you're a teacher, I doubt there are any flexible-hours job for you, as students have a time schedule too.

    If you're a software developer, you might work as a freelancer, or have another flexible-hours job.

    But the most important thing you have to consider is, which job you feel more comfortable to work everyday, PLUS having the time to care for your family.
     
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  14. neutralhatter

    neutralhatter Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Thanks, Current job has some good (fexibility, hours.. etc...), some bad (business does not understand what I do and this leads to stress and other problems).... there are worse jobs... I've been in a situation where I went from bad to worse, that's why I am reluctant in this decision.

    Thanks, I'm not planning to go postal

    It actually doesn't sound bad at all ... maybe I'm being overdramatic...

    Thank you for your extensive answer. I wish it was clear to me... I mostly want to work on my own projects (large portion is development) and then help others by teaching them... maybe my projects will keep failing and I will want to do something else, but I have a hard time seeing beyond that point.... also, I need to eat ....so as long as my projects aren't providing enough income for me to live from I'll need a job.

    i know you are joking but working at mcdonalds would be a nice change for a while.

    Thanks, You are right, I could use a change and I think I can find another job - Though not sure if I should throw away my investment I have in the specifics of my current job that makes me costly to replace.
     
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  15. Trepanated

    Trepanated Supreme Member

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    Another question for you. The tool at your current company that's used by 3000 employees - did you develop that yourself?

    If so, why not use that as a basis for a side project of your own? Could you not design something similar that you could then sell to other companies in the same industry?

    It sounds like it's a useful tool and if 3000 people use it in one company, there could be a wider market for it.

    On a subscription basis for example, if it was $10 per user per month, that's $360K per year revenue if you sold it to just one similarly sized organisation.

    I don't know what the tool is, what industry your company is in, or the size of the industry in general - but if there's one company with at least 3000 employees, it's clearly not a small industry.
     
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  16. neutralhatter

    neutralhatter Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    It's very nice of you to give these extensive replies.

    Yes, there is a large market. Getting in to that market is a different story. Since it is healthcare related, there are laws and requirements for the software and these are very extensive and require insight from healthcare workers. The company's that do enter this market though, can get a lot of profit, since the healthcare workers who would purchase it, get a full refund of the government. So, actually they are giving away the software but getting paid by the government. All it takes is convincing the healthcare organisations/freelancers to work with your software really... and you wouldn't be charing 10$ but more like 70$ a month. profitable yes but requires investment of more than 1 person.

    EDIT: PS. I inherited the software from previous developers/consultancy firm and have been extending it ever since.





     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2015
  17. Trepanated

    Trepanated Supreme Member

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    You're very welcome :)

    $70 per user per month makes it even more worthwhile giving it some thought. Just one customer with a tenth the workforce of your current company is a quarter of a million revenue per year.

    Without knowing a little more about the product it's hard to give any more insight or input and it's understandable if you'd prefer not to divulge anything further. I'd be happy to discuss it over Skype if you'd prefer not to mention too much in public. And I can assure you I'm not looking for ideas - I've got far too many of those to handle as it is.

    A couple of further thoughts though:

    Is the software something that could easily transfer to an app? Healthcare apps are going to be one of the most lucrative industries in the next decade, especially with the advent of wearables.

    Everybody is looking at wearables as a small phone on the wrist, but they are completely missing the point and the potential. The thing people should be looking at in the wearables sector is the sensors and what you can do with them. And not just the current sensors, but the ones that are on the way.

    And the industry that most of these sensors fits perfectly is healthcare. Sensors and healthcare are a match made in heaven - and a license to print money!

    It sounds like you have some useful insight into the healthcare sector from your current job, so maybe you could use that knowledge to do something in the wearables market?

    As I said, without knowing more, I may be barking up completely the wrong tree. But it sounds like you have some useful skills that you could use to your advantage if you put some thought into it.
     
  18. Leroyxxx

    Leroyxxx Junior Member

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    I, personally, wouldn't choose teaching. You say that the incompetence of your coworkers bother you, but students may also be incompetent. They may don't care about what you have to teach. They may be not capable to understand what you want to teach them. Of course that may be not true, but there is one fact - you depend on them and you will not be able to get satisfaction from your job if they won't cooperate.


    Also, what would be your career path after that? At some point you will stuck and teach the same things over and over again with no self-development at all.


    That doesn't mean you must stay in your current position. You can negotiate better term in your current job, you can try to get better communication with others. You can even find other, better job or start something on your own (or at least some side project while staying in your current job).
     
  19. Conor

    Conor Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    This. Don't fix what ain't broke.