Discussion in 'BlackHat Lounge' started by ShadeDream, Feb 23, 2013.
Peter Joseph's "Where are we going?"
Well worth the watch!
Glad u joined the movement SD....As jacque put it..."This shits got to go!"
I keep an open mind in general. If it wasn't for your post, I wouldn't have found the channel in the first place.
I stopped at the first minute when he said that before agriculture the hunter gatherers were living in an egalitarian society :fail:
He never really said it in that way. Nevertheless it is still well worth the watch and it's something from which you can make your own conclusions. It's an interesting concept and it makes you think. These are some of the other videos that are worth the watch, they're all from the same channel:
I wouldn't agree with everything, but at the same time I wouldn't disagree, I'm keeping an open mind.
English is not my first language, but I don't see what other way he might have said it.
Too many interesting concepts to watch them all!
Well, it's not mine either.
You've said the following:
The speaker in the video said:
So he never really said that "before agriculture the hunter gatherers were living in an egalitarian society". He stated "egalitarian societies consisting of hunters and gatherers". These societies progressed into "an agricultural revolution". And when it comes to History I don't want to debate on that because History of something that happened thousands of years ago is more of a theory of the past. No one has the definite answer, only assumptions based on various "evidence".
That said, it does not mean that hunters and gatherers could not have lived in egalitarian societies. There's no true evidence and anyone that argues in regards to this matter, must have a lot of free time. Nevertheless here's a little extract from an article:
Lastly, you should watch this (at least the first few minutes):
I 'm sorry, I don't get your point. If the egalitarian societies consisted (were made of) of hunters and gatherers, the hunters and gatherers obviously lived in those egalitarian societies themselves.
I think it 's self evident.
An egalitarian society means two things:
All people be treated as equals and have the same rights and the removal of economic inequalities between individuals as well as groups of people.
The hunter gathers had no extra resources, find food or die. Which is more or less the same as herds of animals. Regarding the "treaded as equals", since we can observe how animal herds are not egalitarian (there 's a chief and the lesser males etc etc), it doesn't require a big leap of faith to assume it was the same for the hunter gatherers. Regarding the economical inequalities, I will grant that they were indeed equal - they all had nothing (except perhaps the chief and priest )
Tbh, I got curious from your posts and skimmed through the first video. What I gathered o) is that their solution to the scarcity problem is to assume they will simply create superabundance - so, no need of trade and division of labor and property - you want some wine? Here you go sir
To be honest I'm no longer sure as to what your point is/was.
Animals or not, emotions/mindset can be much stronger than hunger.
Nevertheless not watching something because of something that you don't agree with in the first few minutes (almost seconds in this case) of a video is like not watching a video that you wanted to watch because YT decided that you can't skip an ad, and because you don't like ads you won't bother waiting to watch the video.
It 's a matter of scarcity and here in particular, scarcity of time, so one has to make choices - and from what I see about the Venus project, they are not very keen on the idea of having their sheep making any decisions; the enlightened city managers will do it for them
Scarcity is the thing the Venus project aims to address - well sure. If you can sleep all day and have some robot servants bring to you anything you need - no need for money! That 's what superabundance is. Let 's see them do it
I'm not too keen on all aspects of the idea myself but the concept makes sense and it's something that most definitely could improve things for the better future of humanity. I was quite interested in the first part of the video which makes a lot of sense. Not everyone really realizes that the world is powered by problems which if solved would mean disaster to the current economy.
When it comes to implementation of such a concept, well, I'm sure I won't see anything like it in my life time.
Speaking of "scarcity of time", when I just think about the time I've wasted, the time I will never get back, the time I keep wasting, and all the things I need to do to catch up or to be at a level where I can be somewhat proud with myself, puts me into depression. So I do see what you mean.
Can you give us the crib notes version?
If everything was run by computers what would the vast majority of people do?
Not everyone has the skills to be a manager and maintain the system, and there would not be a need for billions of managers.... only a couple of thousands at best (if the system was as efficient as he wanted to portray it in the clip). I guess the vast majority of people would not do shit all
I think there is 1 common denominator between the haves and the have nots!
That is education. The people that have things in this life are those that have educated themselves outside the public schooling system. That means the public education system needs to be re-structured to the point where Rich people would feel comfortable enough to let their kids learn in non private schools, and until that problem gets sorted there will always be a huge gap between the rich and the poor. Because the rich will put their kids in the best schools and their kids will get the best education and best jobs positions in life.
I've not looked into the system fully, I mainly liked the idea of it, and I think the main objective here is to get people thinking of other possibilities vs what we have now.
The whole concept is based on a new way of thinking. It does mention education too. I'm not going to go into a full on debate because honestly I can't be bothered, I posted the video to inform rather than to persuade, but the whole point is to create a new way of living, a new united culture vs the current backgrounds people are born with which influence humanity in all sorts of ways.
There's more to education then just re-structuring the current system.
If you want to get some more ideas just watch some of the videos by Jacque Fresco.
Obviously make your own conclusions and don't take everything literally.
I'm not really sure what you mean? I don't think there's a transcript available.
There is a one little,tiny,itsy bitsy problem with these ideas and that is that in order to be all equals, someone will have to explain Mr. Abramovich that I will use his yacht for one week in July. I am exaggerating, but I know you all get what I am trying to say.
All the guys bashing SD....offer a possible alternative!This is the problem with ppl in this fu*#d up society...instead of offering a possible alternative they just go on arguing and explaining shortcomings of the possible alternative at hand.Reminds me of Jacque saying how ppl were asked if they think man will ever go to the moon and they were all like naaaah not in a thousand years.Some may argue its constructive critisism but i realy dont think so coz there really not helping out by starting pointless arguments. Jacque clearly states this is not a utopia if u did ur due diligence and watched more of hes videos and read hes books instead of making your own conclusions.Ever since i farmilirised myself with hes way of thinking and hes value system u can clearly see how most if not all ppl are realy fu$*d up by society and culture.Anyway, we have two choices really,paradise or oblivion,the choice lies within us!
If you really wanna dig deeeeeeeeep check out sott.net
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