PayPal refunds

Talebano · Oct 9, 2019

Good evening guys,
I'm experiencing bad customers asking for refunds also if they got what they paid for.
How do you deal with this?
I use PayPal for my e-commerce website where I sell digital goods.
In particular, I sell views for youtube and plays for spotify and as you surely know this means I don't have any real proof of my work..I can't show anything to PayPal hence I can't answer the dispute.
How do you guys deal with this?
Cryptocurrencies?
Does the invoice method work?

Icey Dan · Oct 9, 2019

You should clearly state your refund policy on your website somewhere. Make it known that if you deliver what you say you will - no refunds will be accepted. Customers should not be able to buy until they agree to these terms.

This way if they try to make a Paypal dispute, you just need to provide proof that you delivered the product and that they agreed to your terms. As long as you hold up your end of the bargain and provide the products as advertised to your clients, you should win every time. The key is keeping your paperwork organized.

clark123 · Oct 9, 2019

Paypal pretty much don't care sellers so don't use paypal for expensive items to collect money if you are a seller.

tubeboost · Oct 9, 2019

Icey Dan said:
You should clearly state your refund policy on your website somewhere. Make it known that if you deliver what you say you will - no refunds will be accepted. Customers should not be able to buy until they agree to these terms.

This way if they try to make a Paypal dispute, you just need to provide proof that you delivered the product and that they agreed to your terms. As long as you hold up your end of the bargain and provide the products as advertised to your clients, you should win every time. The key is keeping your paperwork organized.

It's risky to tell PayPal about selling YT views. They can ban PP accounts.
Have a look at 2checkout as a payment processor.

Talebano · Oct 9, 2019

Icey Dan said:
You should clearly state your refund policy on your website somewhere. Make it known that if you deliver what you say you will - no refunds will be accepted. Customers should not be able to buy until they agree to these terms.

This way if they try to make a Paypal dispute, you just need to provide proof that you delivered the product and that they agreed to your terms. As long as you hold up your end of the bargain and provide the products as advertised to your clients, you should win every time. The key is keeping your paperwork organized.

Thanks for your answer, but how can I show to PayPal that I've sent 1000 views to x channel on youtube?

Talebano · Oct 9, 2019

tubeboost said:
It's risky to tell PayPal about selling YT views. They can ban PP accounts.
Have a look at 2checkout as a payment processor.

I didn't think paypal would ban SMM-related accounts..are you sure?
To be honest I use lots of ad networks to provide my plays / views but still this isn't a proof good enough for paypal I think
I'll have a lookat 2checkout though.
Did you try it?Can you vouch for it?

Dung Nguyen · Oct 9, 2019

Talebano said:
Thanks for your answer, but how can I show to PayPal that I've sent 1000 views to x channel on youtube?

if you do so they will shut down your whole account as its violent their term about social marketing service. They don't accept that

Talebano · Oct 9, 2019

Dung Nguyen said:
if you do so they will shut down your whole account as its violent their term about social marketing service. They don't accept that

Thanks.
I didn't know this was against paypal rules

Dung Nguyen · Oct 9, 2019

Talebano said:
Thanks.
I didn't know this was against paypal rules

it was why many SMM panels stop accepting Paypal as they easily get ripped off by customers who order and chargeback.

tubeboost · Oct 9, 2019

Talebano said:
I didn't think paypal would ban SMM-related accounts..are you sure?
To be honest I use lots of ad networks to provide my plays / views but still this isn't a proof good enough for paypal I think
I'll have a lookat 2checkout though.
Did you try it?Can you vouch for it?

I use it for my software products since avangate. When it was avangate they fought for each order. Don't know how they handle it now.

Talebano · Oct 9, 2019

tubeboost said:
I use it for my software products since avangate. When it was avangate they fought for each order. Don't know how they handle it now.

Thanks for your reply.
What happens if customers pay with paypal? I mean PayPal --> 2checkout --> your wallet or whatever
Did you manage to sell also views or plays or something SMM-related?
How many disputes do you get and how many do you win?
And how do you handle disputes?
It's still pretty difficult to prove that you've sent 1000 views to a certain song on a certain platform

tubeboost · Oct 9, 2019

Talebano said:
Thanks for your reply.
What happens if customers pay with paypal? I mean PayPal --> 2checkout --> your wallet or whatever
Did you manage to sell also views or plays or something SMM-related?

If a customer pays with paypal, his funds move to their paypal (your 2checkout account).
I don't use 2checkout for SMM yet but it's allowed. https://www.2checkout.com/legal/acceptance/
Actually, I don't have any disputes with my software products and 2checkout. They are very expensive and buyers need support.

Rajorib · Oct 9, 2019

thats why me prefer btc as a payment where seller is safe but most of buyers ask for paypal option

Icey Dan · Oct 9, 2019

Yeah sorry guys. I was under the understanding he was selling digital products in general, I completely missed the line where he specifically said he was selling YT views.

Talebano · Oct 10, 2019

Icey Dan said:
Yeah sorry guys. I was under the understanding he was selling digital products in general, I completely missed the line where he specifically said he was selling YT views.

Do they ban merchants who sell social signals?

Frenzied · Oct 10, 2019

I used to offer extensive proof to argue against my customers and about 50% of the time I won against malicious chargebacks.

PayPal sucks really. Nothing you can do.

PremiumPen · Oct 10, 2019

Sometimes PayPal is worst, specially their CC unit.

Talebano · Oct 10, 2019

Frenzied said:
I used to offer extensive proof to argue against my customers and about 50% of the time I won against malicious chargebacks.

PayPal sucks really. Nothing you can do.

May I ask you how did you solve?
Stripe is probably the only serious alternative to PayPal, but they don't allow anything social-media related..

Frenzied · Oct 10, 2019

Talebano said:
May I ask you how did you solve?
Stripe is probably the only serious alternative to PayPal, but they don't allow anything social-media related..

Neither Stripe or PayPal accept social media services. Your best bet is to look for high risk payment processors or accept bitcoin. I am talking to a few payment processors to see if I'm willing to work with them. The only drawback is that they ask for a LOT of information about your business and yourself.

Talebano · Oct 10, 2019

I thought I could write some detailed ToS for my website to prevent people scamming me; in the ToS I described all the workflow in order to prevent people frauding me for unauthorized transactions.
Did anyone else have any luck using a ToS?
Actually, I don't sell bot views/plays..my business is a bit more legitimate than that.
I really offer promotion to my customers using playlists, exchange websites and similar methods.
I'd like to talk with paypal support to know if my new ToS can help me to win some chargebacks but I fear that they will suspend my account if they know that I "sell plays"...which isn't true at all, since I really use ad networks and other methods to gather plays for my customers.

PayPal refunds

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