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PageRank isn't dead!

Discussion in 'Black Hat SEO' started by The Mentalist, Apr 17, 2016.

  1. The Mentalist

    The Mentalist Power Member

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    I've seen so many posts about PageRank recently, I feel obligated to clear up some confusion.

    PageRank goes back to the algorithm Brin and Page developed nearly 20 years ago at the start of Google. It still represents the algorithm that is used today, Google has obviously changed the PageRank algorithm, but in the end it is still an algorithm that ranks pages (hence the name PageRank).

    The problem is, though, that a universal ranking of websites isn't very helpful in creating a search engine. It also depends on the query (what you type into Google) and other information. So technically, PageRank has always been the ranking score of a website (or website's page) for a given query instance.

    The PageRank metric SEOers have used over the last years was just that, a metric. The thing is we never even really knew what the PageRank metric was, we just hoped it represented some output of the actual PageRank algorithm. There was nothing inherently magical about PageRank. PageRank itself never contributed to any website's rankings.

    PageRank was simply a metric we blindly trusted to be valuable. In the last 5 years we've seen people getting their hands dirtier, and actually dissecting the link profiles of domains to better understand their SEO value, we should have been doing this all along (not saying that people never did this, but a majority weren't). Of course PageRank seemed to have some sort of correlation with a website's rankings, so we used it as a metric. But now that every website's PageRank is 0, nothing's changed, we simply don't have a metric to use that we shouldn't have been using in the first place!

    So no, PageRank isn't gone, I'm sure the core PageRank algorithm (which is publicly available) has changed (well we know it has, obviously). It actually is very useful in ranking vertices in a graph based on in/out degree, and is commonly used in information retrieval today (I've implemented the algorithm a few times myself). I won't bore you with graph theory, but the dilemma it solves is actually fairly simple.

    If you go to calculate the SEO value of all websites, you have to start with one. So you pick the first one, but wait, that website's SEO value depends on the SEO value of other websites linking to it, and the other websites it links to, so how is it possible to calculate the first website's SEO value when you haven't calculated the other websites' SEO value?

    The answer is Gaussian elimination, but that takes too long to calculate given the entire web graph, so Google came up with an algorithm that calculates it faster, anyway read about the Random Surfer model if you get bored sometime, the proofs aren't too bad.

    Anyway...

    PageRank isn't dead, Google simply isn't giving us the useless metric anymore.
     
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    Last edited: Apr 17, 2016
  2. craigc0302

    craigc0302 Registered Member

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    So Pagerank is still dead then as most people will know of pagerank as the figure given on the toolbar or a pagerank checker, that is no longer updated. So that is dead.

    Ranking websites and any metrics that are used within Googles Algorithm are clearly not dead !
     
  3. Venturi

    Venturi Newbie

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    I agree that pagerank is not dead but i have a few questions (that no one can answer)

    As we all know google introduced pagerank as a metric of how good (in their opinion) a site was.

    Google then stopped releasing pageranks for all sites so anything after 2014 (i think) had a pagerank of 0.

    Google in the past week has removed all ranking and now all sites are of pagerank 0.

    Pagerank is still part of the algorithm google uses to determine a sites ranking but they no longer publish it to the public.

    Google+ has been a flop for google (mainly used by businesses imo) yet they still keep it going when they wanted it to be the new FB.

    Since all sites now have a pagerank of 0 and google are introducing Penguin 4.0 which is said to be a automatic up to date algorithm rather than previous manual updates.

    What are the chances that pagerank will come back as a public metric when Penguin 4.0 is launched?

    Reset all website to pagerank 0 launch Penguin 4.0 and then release a new ever changing (up to date) pagerank score
     
  4. MrBeastsOnToast

    MrBeastsOnToast Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    You typed a lot of words, but didn't actually say anything.
     
  5. The Mentalist

    The Mentalist Power Member

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    I doubt it will ever come back as a public metric. The public metric is not the same PageRank score google calculates. PageRank is technically a probability (it was originally, at least), so it is less than 1. The PageRank Google released was a tier system (1-10) that was calculated in some way we don't know.

    Yes, that's the point, I was explaining how people have been saying lots of words that didn't mean anything for the last 15 years.
     
  6. blackbeans

    blackbeans Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    I agree but the problem is that Google hasn't been updating its page rank.

    As everybody knows, Google is doing this intentionally because page rank has been its Achilles heel for the longest time.

    With that said, there are services like Moz rank that somehow approximate page rank.

    I would take Moz rank with a big block of salt though.

    These third-party services can only guess the relative value of the link sources you're working with.

    Still, it is better than nothing.

    The other approach would be to simply get branded links.

    What I mean by this is to get links only from established niche leaders in your industry.
     
  7. starki

    starki Power Member

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    It never was Google's Archilles heel, it was just some metric everybody gloryfied because it was one simple value, easy to understand, communicate, advertise. No complicated research required, install a toolbar and you are set. There was never a causation between pagerank and ranking, it always was just a correlation.

    I'm really happy that it's gone, because it forces everybody to dig deeper and concentrate on the things that actually matter.
     
  8. Worldnoobestseo

    Worldnoobestseo Newbie

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    so whats the point dude??i feel confused now.
     
  9. Ambassy

    Ambassy BANNED BANNED

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    Whether it's dead or simply not displayed publicly makes zero difference to anyone.

    I honestly don't get the point of this thread - what you are basically stating is that PR is still a valid metric even though it remains hidden to everyone but those who administer it. So what's the point?

    That's like if I stated that YouTube is using some algorithm named VideoRank that is displayed to nobody but their internal system - completely pointless information.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2016
  10. CallmeReaz

    CallmeReaz Junior Member

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    Page Rank is a throwback to when Google was trying to be a helpful company.

    The ultimate goal of Google now is to drive small businesses into the Adwords model. The fewer bits of information (And the more useless and diversionary) they provide the easier this business model will work and the happier investors will be.

    Simple really.....

    The tactics of SEO have changed somewhat, yet it's exactly the same process in the end.

    Amount of "power" (PR, Link Juice, whatever they call it this week) pumped into a site without tripping any filters = High ranking.....
     
  11. Ambitious12

    Ambitious12 Elite Member

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    Do you really think PR can make your website on the top,if yes then dude you need to read,why PR is dead.