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NOWHERE - A Scammer By Proxy?

Discussion in 'The Shit List' started by ScrapeBoss, Feb 11, 2011.

  1. ScrapeBoss

    ScrapeBoss Elite Member Premium Member

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    Maybe there is something I am missing out here. This scam resulted in a total loss of $600. A scam, probably by proxy. The member involved is NOWHERE. His profile can be found here:

    http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackhat-seo/members/936-nowhere.html

    The thread in which he made request for backlinking job is here:

    http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackh...-wtb-search-engine-optimization-services.html

    So as to understand who is who in the screenshots, these are the email names/skype usernames:

    1. That is NOWHERE, a member here who requested for the job

    2. AR Network - This is the "partner" of NOWHERE. May be a fictitious or real human being

    3. Daniel - This is my email name

    4. Femmy - This is my skype name

    THE PROJECT

    The project was to build backlinks to his 18 of his sites in the auto insurance niche. This was the email with respect to that:

    [​IMG]

    In order to acertain my competence, he asked for a sample which was to do backlinking task on just a site.

    He asked for the sample and I did everything as requested. This was the mail he sent after doing it:

    [​IMG]

    I was paid $150 for the job done. Because the job was done as requested, he had to add 2 more sites to work on, making 3. This was the mail he sent with respect to that:

    [​IMG]


    THE "PARTNER"

    The whole thing started getting complicated after finishing the first site and was about to start the 3 sites, NOWHERE called me through skype and said he would like to introduce his "partner" to me. He said they were both very impressed with the first job I did. I was just hearing the other guy speaking underground.

    In that first conversation through skype, he offered me another job to write 100 articles for the auto insurance niche. The cost of the articles was $300 at the rate of $3 per article. This was the mail to support that:

    [​IMG]

    The above image shows that NOWHERE was the real person in charge of the whole project. He used the word "I", meaning that he was the one responsible for the whole job and not the "partner".

    From the introduction of the "partner", communication about the project with NOWHERE was no longer regular. Then one day, he sent me a mail that the "partner" would like to chat with me through skype. I did not know if that "partner" was the same NOWHERE himself. I noticed that NOWHERE was becoming less involved in terms of communication concerning the backlinking project. The "partner" seemed to be the person taking the decisions as to what he wanted to be done. There was no way of knowing whether NOWHERE and the "partner" were the same person.

    This was the communication we exchanged concerning the article writing job in addition to backlink building. This showed he was satisfied with the articles.

    [​IMG]

    This was the mail he sent to me, officially "bringing" the "partner" to the whole scene:

    [​IMG]

    I used to deliver the articles in batches of 20 articles per batch. This was the mail sent to me requesting for the last batch of the articles, showing he had been satisfied with the 80 articles I had written so far:

    [​IMG]


    REPORT SENT ($600 due)

    As agreed, I sent the report for the first 2 weeks for the backlinking project and the article writing, making the sum of $600 due to me. This was the mail I sent:

    [​IMG]


    INDEXING

    It would be noticed that agreement was to create backlinks. It was not part of the deal for me to ensure that those links were indexed by the search engines like Google. NOWHERE sent me a mail that his "partner" wanted to know what I was doing to ensure that the links I was creating were indexed. However, he (NOWHERE) did not dispute that I had done a high quality job. He even requested in a mail that I should send an invoice ($600 due) for the 2-week job. This was the mail he sent:

    [​IMG]

    This was my response to him with respect to the indexing issue:

    [​IMG]

    This was the invoice I sent:

    [​IMG]

    FROM JANUARY 7, 2011, NOWHERE STARTED TELLING STORIES ON THE $600 PAYMENT

    NOWHERE started telling all sorts of stories on the $600 payment. This was what we exchanged through mails:

    [​IMG]

    A lot of stories are now being told. NOWHERE is now pushing me to go directly to his "partner" for the $600 payment. This was what we exchanged through mails:

    [​IMG]


    NOWHERE AND HIS "PARTNER" STOPPED RESPONDING TO MY MAILS TO BE PAID THE $600

    NOWHERE later stopped responding to my mails for the $600 payment. I did not have any business with his "partner". The "partner" did not initiate the deal with me but he was neither responding to my skype call for chat. This was the mail I sent to NOWHERE. He did not reply me.

    [​IMG]

    18 SITES OFFERED BEFORE THE BREAK IN COMMUNICATION

    After I sent the report of the backlink building for the 3 sites, his "partner" gave me additional 15 sites to work with. This was before both of them were no longer answering my mails and skype chat. This was the skype chat we had:

    [​IMG]

    "PARTNER" COMPLAINED THE HIGH PR PROFILE LINKS COULD NOT BE ACCESSED

    The "partner" complained that most of the high profile links I created could not be accessed except one signed in. The links concerned were about 40 out of 120 high profile links manually created. I created the links manually with images of cars (the sites being promoted were on car insurance) and personal profile like date of birth, occupation, hobbies, etc. He later offered to pay $400, complaining that the $600 was too much. This was our chat through skype:

    [​IMG]

    OTHER SKYPE CHAT WITH "PARTNER"

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    LAST MAIL TO NOWHERE. NO RESPONSE UP TILL NOW

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    WHAT NOWHERE OR "PARTNER" HAVE FAILED TO PAY THE $600 FOR:

    1. Writing 100 articles for the car insurance niche

    2. A total of 120 high PR profile links

    3. Social bookmarks on popular sites

    4. A total of 55 article submission

    5. A total of 24 web 2.0 sites with content

    6. A total of 60 manual commenting links



    CONCLUSION

    Well, $600 is gone. However, the questions that come to my mind are:

    1. Was NOWHERE the same as "partner"? Have I being dealing with the same person for close to two months and thinking that I was dealing with 2 different people? SCAMMING BY PROXY?

    2. If NOWHERE was different from "partner", did he know about the actions of his "partner"?

    3. If NOWHERE was not part of this scam and different from "partner", why has he failed to respond to my emails and skype chat?

    This was my experience with NOWHERE. Probably members of this community with more wisdom would be able to point out what is amiss.
     
  2. popcrdom29

    popcrdom29 Senior Member

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    Sorry you are out of $600 and I must say that I'm impressed with the proof that you have shown. Nice job of posting screen shots of communications between you two. I'm sure the MOD's, probably BIGBUDDY will get to the bottom of it.

    Hopefully it was just a misunderstanding and you'll get paid soon.
     
  3. wannabie

    wannabie Elite Member

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    I'm guessing you must be pretty pissed but I reckon you will get sOme work from this thread mate!

    That's some organisation skills and professional conduct going on there indeed
     
  4. BigBuddy

    BigBuddy BANNED BANNED

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    Pm ed him and let us wait for his reply.
     
  5. NoWhErE

    NoWhErE BANNED BANNED

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    Hi Dan,

    Sorry to say there isnt much I can do or say right now to fix this. ArNetwork left for the weekend. Murphy's Law I suppose.

    Anyways, as for the allegations. There is something you need to understand. This project is both an ArNetwork (my partner) and I's project. I'm in charge of getting things done and he's in charge of financing the entire thing as well as making final decisions. He has the bigger part of our deal and is essentially the boss.

    In december, I was asked to find and recruit someone to whom we could outsource a massive backlinking job too. I couldn't handle all the work myself. I found you and interviewed you. Once I felt you were a suitable candidate for the job, I passed you on to ArNetwork as he wanted to manage anyone we hired (as its his money financing the project).

    To be honest, thats where my part ended. You would contact me when my partner didn't respond although I was making it quite clear that he was in charge of the project. When it came to payment, that really was between you and him as well. He wasn't satisfied with your work apparently. I was, but he wasn't.

    From what I am told, he asked you to fix things as alot of links you submitted weren't either working and a vast majority of them weren't getting indexed.

    Is ArNetwork a real person? Yes. You talked to us both at the same time. He sat beside me when we Skype conferenced during your initial interview process. You talked to him directly at the same time as I we talked. So you know very well that yes there is another person involved.

    Also, if all of this really was a scam, you wouldn't have been paid for the previous work you did.

    So bottom line is, this is out of my hands. I've talked to my partner and he seemed unhappy with results. There's nothing else I can do. Its really up to you and him to work it out. I have many people I have done personal business with on this board and have all been paid on time, no questions asked.

    Also, one last thing. Please immediately remove my real name from this thread. That is uncalled for and against Shit List rules. Want to call me out? fine. But don't drag my name in the mud without this being concluded.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2011
  6. The Captain

    The Captain Regular Member

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    you contracted him to do the job before pasing the buck to someone else... it is far from out of your hands
     
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  7. popcrdom29

    popcrdom29 Senior Member

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    Yeah I agree with The Captain. You are the one who initially dealt with ScrapeBoss and made an agreement to do the work. It's not fair that you pass the buck on to someone else when it comes to payment. Personally I think it's your responsibility to make sure that he's paid.

    After doing all of that work and your partner wasn't happy with 100% of it, ScrapeBoss should be paid something. Some type of final agreement should have been made instead of not paying him what he's owed.
     
  8. NoWhErE

    NoWhErE BANNED BANNED

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    Actually, ArNetwork told me he offered half of the money as compensation for the articles he wrote, apparently Dan refused. I dunno if thats true since Im not the one dealing with this. ArNetwork will have to come in and confirm.

    Anyways, as for responbility and agreement, I had made it perfectly clear with him that I was only in charge of finding the contractor and that ArNetwork would handle the rest. We even told him so on Skype chat.

    Like I said, there's not much I can say or do right now. Arnetwork is out of town for the weekend... this sucks I know.
     
  9. srb888

    srb888 Elite Member

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    I agree with The Captain.

    The "project" nowhere states that you are 2 persons, it states that you've so many sites, that you'll provide more sites... that "if you're pleased...". :). You asked for "manual" work only... in the 2nd mail you said you're happy and the jobs are "perfect", ... and most important "clause"" there is this: "You will be compensated for the work you are doing right now... but it must be entirely to my liking" ... still the partner is nowhere in the picture!!! The 3rd email --> the "partner" now creeps in :)... but you still say there that "we'll pay you on a ..." :: here also you are still a paying segment in the word "we"...

    Top Quality stuff for $3 each?:) It beats me on the definition of top quality... I hope you defined the meaning to the OP. I have no objection to this part though... but...

    ... in the next email, the OP's job is still "Excellent"!!! So I hope the OP had fulfilled the necessity of the word "top quality" completely.

    all the while there are no complaints from your "paying only" partner, and on the other hand, you seem to be very happy with the OP's work (even at this time, you say "... wasn't satisfied with your work apparently. I was, but he wasn't."). So as a person who started the Project, interviewed the OP, gave him the assurance that he will get paid on the basis that "... you are satisfied...; 'we will pay'; etc." etc. etc. etc.

    It is easy to bring in a third party by the actual project creator at a later stage and push up arms skywards on the payment issues... not fair IMHO. After 80 articles have been received by you that too in batches of 20's,... shows that you had ample time to judge the OP's work for quality, etc.

    Comments / Back-links indexing issue cannot be judged in a small time frame. IMHO, if they are written well, or accomplished duly, on the sites mentioned by OP, then that's fair enough... Indexing the back-link efforts is another issue which even the big bro "G" cannot predict as to when they will be done, so....

    Now please pay the OP and that's a personal request to you, my dear friend. :)
     
  10. Sanitarium

    Sanitarium Regular Member

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    reminds me of the old ewhoring days... sending the black chick to the guy you already sent a white one...having to claim you just changed colors... it's normal...
     
  11. ScrapeBoss

    ScrapeBoss Elite Member Premium Member

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    WAOW!!! This is the first time you would be speaking concerning this issue after many weeks. The screenshot no. 27 and screenshot no. 28 serve as evidence that you did not want to have anything to do with the payment.

    You said ArNetwork told you I refused half of the money as compensation for the articles I wrote. Well, though I have many screenshots of the deals, if you had gone through them you would have noticed I attached a screenshot indicating I was willing to accept the offer of $400 for the whole job. Perhaps you were not able to identify the screenshots, I am posting them here again:

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  12. BigBuddy

    BigBuddy BANNED BANNED

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    nowhere, I hope you remember that this job has been discussed with me previously before given to scrapeboss. I would have taken upfront payment, before taking this job, but scrapeboss done the job without upfront.

    Initially you said, his job was good and articles are great. I wonder now how you people judge the service and quality of links are poor. Results of every link building services will be show up later , atleast 2 to 3weeks time, as Indexing is not in the hands of service providers.

    When you say, AR network is your partner and even though financial decisions will be made by your partner, it does nt mean that you can ignore scrapeboss by not making the payment. Scrapeboss knows your partner because of you and still there is no proof saying you and ARnetwork are different people.

    The amount which you sent already was for the first job and you have not made the payment for the other work. So I insist you to make the agreed payment of $400 in 3 days to scrapeboss.
     
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  13. NoWhErE

    NoWhErE BANNED BANNED

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    Please read what I said :
    I honestly can't do ANYTHING right now. ArNetwork is out of town and I only setup the original deal. What happened afterwards I was unaware of and was out of my control. I can't solve anything until Sunday/Monday when he gets back.

    You sent me ONE email a few days ago asking me about payment. I contacted ArNetwork about it and he said he would deal with it. I'm not ignoring you, I'm just really busy dealing with other things when it was made very clear : I told you to deal with Ar as he is in charge of everything. Whats so friggin' hard to understand?

    You're calling me out saying that I'm trying to scam by Proxy? You KNOW Ar exists. You talked to him yourself. I have a thick french canadian accent and he has a perfect American accent. We talked side by side to you. If you could hear me perfectly, you could hear him. Your accusation is a bullshit tactic to garner sympathy for your cause.

    If I truly wanted to scam you for a few links and articles, WHY would Ar have paid you the first round of backlinks? Why scam you for a little bit of work? Why would I use my real name the entire time? I would be the dumbest scammer alive now wouldn't I?

    If you still choose to keep accusing me of having a double identity, I invite any mod to teamviewer onto my computer and he can look through pages and pages of chat logs between ArNetwork and I, or if they can figure of any other way to test me, then I'm all ears.
     
  14. CyrusVirus

    CyrusVirus BANNED BANNED Premium Member

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    not trying to interfer with the situation or anything.
    but, i like the documentation that you have done as far as screenshots and all.

    Directed to BigBuddy:

    Great job, one mod that is always on top of things.


    CyrusVirus
     
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  15. NoWhErE

    NoWhErE BANNED BANNED

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    Actually, ExtraWinner refferred you to me on a completely unrelated project. It was for a personnal site of mine in a completely different niche. ExtraWinner can confirm this as well as how easy it was for both of us to negociate.

    I didn't hire you for that job because I decided to spend that money differently for my site.

    We never talked concerning the auto insurance project.

    I never said I didn't like his work. That was never in doubt. My partner, the guy in charge of the project and paying him DIDN'T like the work. Whats going on here is I was asked to find someone to do a job.

    I did, I found Dan. Then I relayed Dan to ArNetwork. I was the interim.

    Things between Dan and ArNetwork didn't go so well, so now Dan makes up this bullshit story about ArNetwork and I being the same person and attacks me personally so as to try and get money from me.

    Now you're giving me 3 days to solve this when I've said from the start : The dude is out of town. I can't contact him. I can't do anything. I've told Dan this deal is between them, not me.

    If you want me to prove that he and I are completely different people, contact me via PM and I'll arrange it no problem. I have nothing to hide.

    I've done plenty of business on this board and have never had a problem. Dan even offered me a partnership for his scrapebox commenting services and I politely tried to help him out with him. If I really wanted to scam this guy, man I could have done it over and over and over again.

    One thing I DON'T appreciate, is my real name being posted on the board without my prior consent, even though I've politely asked for it to be removed. If you want to drag my name in the mud, then at least wait until I'm actually proven guilty.
     
  16. BigBuddy

    BigBuddy BANNED BANNED

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    nowhere, main concern here is not whether you and Arnetwork are different person or same. My concern is payment should be made, if job is done. There could be some misunderstanding, if you read my post you can see I have not mentioned that you have scammed, but you have to take responsibility for the payment, whereas it was dealt by your partner and moreover he was referred by you.

    If you and your partner feel that job done is low of quality, forward the report to me and will check the quality of the report as myself seo service provider.

    We don't want to view chat logs between you and your partner.


    But extrawinner referred me for your project stating the same amount of fee and number of websites. So I assume it could be the same job. Anyway its also same backlinks job. yes, you can settle this amicably after speaking with your partner and try to make the payment asap. I removed your personal name in the original post.
     
  17. NoWhErE

    NoWhErE BANNED BANNED

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    Thats fine, but I can't do it in 3 days. I don't have the money available and Ar is away. He said he was leaving for the weekend and I figure he'll be back Sunday night or Monday morning. Once he is back, I will talk to him and get this straightened out.

    As for my feelings about the job, its out there. I found it ok. But the job wasnt for me. So what I think doesn't matter. Ar will have to talk to you about that.

    Thank you for removing my name. I would appreciate if Dan would remove them from the pictures though. I am not posting personnal info about him, I would like the same respect shown towards me.

    And you're right about ExtraWinner. I had forgotten I had asked him to quote me on the project after we had finished with the previous one. Thats my bad. Its 3am over here. I'm tired and pissed off.
     
  18. BigBuddy

    BigBuddy BANNED BANNED

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    nowhere - No probs, carry on and take your time to settle this amicably , when your partner returns.

    scrapeboss - cover the real name of the nowhere in the image and repost it.
     
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  19. ScrapeBoss

    ScrapeBoss Elite Member Premium Member

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    I have covered the real name of nowhere in the images and made a repost. Thanks

     
  20. atlclientservice

    atlclientservice BANNED BANNED

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    scrapeboss dan whatever your name is this is ar network.
    you obviously have 2 much time on your hands... instead of
    spending the time bullshitting on here you should have skyped me or ask to talk to me on the phone. Your conversations with me have been very limited and you never have asked to speak to me on the phone. You rather sit behind a computer and complain and not know what your talking about.

    I have always been open minded to settling payment although I personally think you did a crap job and I have several teams that do what you do for a hell of a lot less...

    If anyone almost got scammed it was us!

    I don't have time to go back and forth on here as I am busy making money with people who actually know how to do what we ask them to do --- unlike you wasting time complaining trying to drum up business by being a bullshitter.

    Your service is a waste of money but I do appreciate you trying. Part of getting traffic online is finding the right people to work with an for seo you are an amateur as shown with your posts and also your work.

    However I am sure there is plenty of people starting out that could use your services and see value where I could not..

    Regardless of all this I am still willing to pay you so contact me for payment but I need a phone number. I am glad to conference in nowhere and resolve this as we are spending more time on this than it is even worth right now.

    I will however want to know how you intend to pay my associate Nowhere back for slandering his name when he is a good person and never intended to "scam" you for your "wanna be" services...

    Ps. If you continue with your rant and don't contact me with a phone number I am not going to respond anymore as I don't have time to sit on here and go back and forth. This is my one time response. Thank you.