My Web 2.0 sites keep getting delisted on google!!

tbootz · Mar 12, 2009

I've been implementing Howie's tactics of Web 2.0 marketing and a few weeks ago I made my first hubpages, started pinging it, bookmarking it, linking to it and was on the front page of google within hours. 3 days later I was de-listed.

I came to the conclusion that the problem was that all my anchor text was the same which set off red flags at google. I was also using a single pinging service for all my properties so that may have raised flags as well and thirdly I did a lot of linking in one day and not much thereafter which wasn't smart.

So I corrected those mistakes 3 or so days ago. I made a new hubpage and began the linking strategy all over. Here are my steps in bullet points, if you find the fault that is causing me to be de-indexed I'd appreciate if you'd point it out.

1. Created Hubpages. Original content and a pitch at the end with an affiliate link to the clickbank product page.

2. I ping the url and the rss feed on pingomatic. I create a new Digg account and digg it. I ping the digg as well on another pinging service. I twitter the hubpage on a new twitter account. I bookmark it on a new delicious account and ping that on another ping service as well. I did that in the span of 2-3 days.

3. I create a Squidoo lens, original content. I link back to hubpages and also a link to a wetpaint account I will make later. I digg it (on the above account) and ping rss and url.

4. I make a wetpaint account, new content, links to hubpages. Ping rss and url. Delicious (same account) and a bookmark on new propeller account. I ping the propeller rss and url.

I did no reciprocal linking. I altered my anchor text each time while still trying to maintain my keywords. The content was different on each property. And I did a little each day rather than doing everything on a single day.

So what is getting me de-listed? I have a lot of competitors and they are all using web 2.0 properties to rank. The first 4 pages on google are almost nothing but web 2.0 including squidoo and hubpages. So it is not a penalty for the properties that's causing my problems. My content was decent, more so than most other pages for the keyword. Not only is my hubpages delisted but every single property of mine including digg pages, etc are not showing up.

I was on the third page in a matter of hours and now I won't show up on google even for an allintitle.

I used a single email account to sign up to all these properties but slightly altered keyword rich usernames. However I don't think that is the problem. I also don't change IP's, but I don't think google compares the IP of every link and penalizes based on that.

Any idea's?? What is Howie and my competitors doing right that I am failing to notice?

DaveNL · Mar 12, 2009

How many bookmarks do you use and what other kind of backlinks do you use, do you update your hub frequently with new content, how much content are you using?

Do you also ad some images and video on your hubs? and sometimes your page gets sandboxed but after a while the pages get back in again, especially when you keep updating them.

You dont need a lot of content to keep them updated, but i start with 2 articles and ad another article after a view days, bookmark it gain ping it again, blog comment again.

tbootz · Mar 12, 2009

DaveNL said:
How many bookmarks do you use and what other kind of backlinks do you use, do you update your hub frequently with new content, how much content are you using?

Do you also ad some images and video on your hubs? and sometimes your page gets sandboxed but after a while the pages get back in again, especially when you keep updating them.

You dont need a lot of content to keep them updated, but i start with 2 articles and ad another article after a view days, bookmark it gain ping it again, blog comment again.

Hey thanks for the reply! I'm so frustrated right now, I'm really glad BHW members are so helpful.

I'll break your questions down and reply to them one by one.

How many bookmarks do you use and what other kind of backlinks do you use
Since my pages are only 3 or so days old I haven't used many bookmarks yet. My main money site (hubpages) with the aff link has a digg and delicious. Squidoo has one digg and wetpaint has a delicious and propeller.

do you update your hub frequently with new content, how much content are you using?
All my properties are are over 200 words long, my hubpages is over 720 words long. I haven't updated my hub at all. I'm not sure how I would do that other than just making the page even longer since it's not a blog format where I can add new entries. Or do you mean creating new hubs? I do however have some news rss widget on it, so that new feeds show up on the bottom as fresh content but otherwise I don't touch it after I've published it.

Do you also ad some images and video on your hubs?
Yes, I have a related youtube video embedded and a picture of the product I'm pitching. My other properties have images linking to other properties of mine as well as my hubpages. (non reciprocal though)

and sometimes your page gets sandboxed but after a while the pages get back in again, especially when you keep updating them.
Can it be sandboxed even after showing up on google? Is there any particular reason for the sanbox effect, like a sort of penalty for something?

You dont need a lot of content to keep them updated, but i start with 2 articles and ad another article after a view days, bookmark it gain ping it again, blog comment again.
By multiple articles do you mean multiple hubs/lenses from one account? Or you actually keep adding information to your one hub?

Also, I'm a little confused about the pinging. Once you ping your site and rss on a pinging service (pingomatic and pingoat being my favorites) do they keep track of your site and automatically re-ping it when it's updated or do you go back and ping it manually again? If you have a new blog post for example do you ping the main page and rss AND the url and rss of your post as well or is that too much pinging?

pingomatic has been acting up for me, because each time I ping a newly created property it tells me that I just pinged it a few minutes ago when the site just went live seconds ago... I'm not sure if there's some sort of error with pingomatic pinging my sites multiple times per click that is causing me to be flagged.

Thanks for reply!

tbootz · Mar 12, 2009

Also I put in site:mysite.com command into google and my hubpage didn't come up. Does this mean I've been delisted from google op is it to soon since the page is only a few days old?

Yukinari84 · Mar 12, 2009

If there is alot of competition and most of them are using web 2.o to rank, than they probably have a lot more backlinks than you and are thus outranking you.

Since your site is new, Google will index it initially, but if the market you are going after has a lot of activity, than the guys with more backlinks, domain age, etc will outrank you.

Also, pinging to often, getting backlinks too fast, and not using a proxy can get your sites flagged by Google pretty quick.

Google is updating constantly every day. You have to make sure that you are covering your ass and don't appear to Google like you are trying to manipulate them.

Here are some things that help me:

1. Setup your battle plan before taking any action. Decided on your pages and your linking plan before hand. This give you a very clear idea of what needs to be done and when.

2. Create your content first. I always create my pages first before any type of pinging or bookmarking. If you create a site and then ping/bookmark it instantly, Google might take this as a red flag.

3. Use proxies and different accounts. An absolute must when bookmarking and getting links to your sites.

4. Bookmark other people's content to make your accounts seem legit. This doesn't have to be done daily, but Google and the sites where you are hosting your content will pick up on you if you are just bookmarking all the same content even if it is from different accounts.

5. Spread out your backlinking campaign. Don't just try to grab a bunch of links in a few hours.

6. Get a variety of backlinks; not just bookmarks. Video, images, articles, PAD submissions, press releases...The are tons of ways to do it. Variety makes a big difference.

If I come up with anything else I will let everyone know. But these are some of things that work for me.

Hope it helps.

tbootz · Mar 12, 2009

@Yukinari84

Hey, Thanks! Lot of great information here. There are some points you made that I didn't know about so I just want follow up on them.

3. Use proxies and different accounts. An absolute must when bookmarking and getting links to your sites.
I haven't done this. I don't know much (well, hardly anything) about how google's algorithm works so this question may be naive. But does google also track the IP addresses that the backlinks are coming from? Say if I set up a Squidoo lens, a wetpaint and a digg account and they all point to my hubpages will google know that each one was set up by me (from my home IP) and penalize me for it?

5. Spread out your backlinking campaign. Don't just try to grab a bunch of links in a few hours.
One thing I haven't thought about but just entered my mind.. I create all of my backlinks during the same 4 hour period of the day (between 11-3pm). Would that be a red flag for google? I have spread out my backlinks throughout the days of the week, but not throughout the hours of the day... Is this part of the things that google looks for?

Also, as I said in a post above, eventhough my site showed up on google within 1 day of going live, now when I type in the site:mysite.com command into google nothing comes up. Does this make it 100% that I have been de-listed and I should move on?

Thanks!

Yukinari84 · Mar 12, 2009

tbootz -

Although I'm not 100% sure as Google doesn't disclose this type of info to us, I think that Google can see where your links are coming from at a IP level. Google can definitely tell when someone is trying to manipulate their algorithms and will most likely penalize you for it. It all comes down to covering your ass. As far as I am concerned, if I'm gonna spend my time going after something, I will do everything in my power to make it worth my while.

Doing your backlinks in the same 4 hour period everyday is another "footprint' in my honest opinion. I spread my submissions across many accounts across all hours of the day. If you don't randomize and give variety, I think Google will eventually pick up on this.

Now as far as your sites go, they may not be 100% de-listed. Sometimes hey get indexed initially, then as Google updates, they will eventually place your site where they believe is appropriate to your targeted keyphrase.

It just may be that your site has not been cached yet.

The best thing you can do is keep adding fresh content and links and watch to see what happens.

blackzeus · Mar 13, 2009

When I first created my Hubpages about two weeks ago, it was immediately picked up G and rank 5 or 6. then started to fall. I started to build backlinks and updated it for few days and it rised up again. now it is at no. 1 for about a week. So the web 2.0 can be de-listed but if you keep updating, it will rise up.

About the content, My way of doing it is that every 2 days I find 5-6 articles somewhere and scrap them to 1 original article. And add the article to your pages to make them updated. and submit that article to article directory also.

Also, Howie's video is quite old for today situation. Those web 2.0 he mentioned is less favorable, esp Squidoo. My squidoo lens now never appear on G even tho I keep updating it. A lot of bookmarking services also ban squidoo. So we need to keep an eye on new properties.

tbootz · Mar 13, 2009

blackzeus said:
When I first created my Hubpages about two weeks ago, it was immediately picked up G and rank 5 or 6. then started to fall. I started to build backlinks and updated it for few days and it rised up again. now it is at no. 1 for about a week. So the web 2.0 can be de-listed but if you keep updating, it will rise up.

About the content, My way of doing it is that every 2 days I find 5-6 articles somewhere and scrap them to 1 original article. And add the article to your pages to make them updated. and submit that article to article directory also.

Also, Howie's video is quite old for today situation. Those web 2.0 he mentioned is less favorable, esp Squidoo. My squidoo lens now never appear on G even tho I keep updating it. A lot of bookmarking services also ban squidoo. So we need to keep an eye on new properties.

Yeah, I heard, the squidoo slap. Are Howie's tactics still feasible in principle though? Like the same strategy applies but the web 2.0 properties we use keep changing?

@Yukinari84
Yeah, after doing some additional research I came to the conclusion that I'm most likely just sand-boxed at the moment and when I reappear again I'm going to take more caution at covering my ass. Proxy's I have a lot of trouble with, because most of them are excruciatingly slow and work only 10% of the time. Though I've heard people talk about "private" proxies on here so I'm going to look into that. Even Tor is slow as hell for me.

tbootz · Mar 13, 2009

updated: As a matter of fact I just decided to type in my "old" keyword that I used a few weeks ago for the hub that I thought got delisted. I found the hub on the 11th page of google, so apparently it was most likely just sandboxed. I also wrote an ezine article back then and just noticed that it had been published and is sitting in the top 5 results of google with not a single backlink pointing to it... Ironically my hubpages has about 10 or so backlinks and is 10 pages behind. I wonder if it was penalized or if hubpages just doesn't have the authority that ezine has?

davioli · Mar 13, 2009

This is interesting...
Ezine articles has more authority and your article will most likely stay on top for a long time. If you have linked it to your hubpage then that should rise too.

Web 2.0 is very very interesting...You should not be focusing on only a few of them. Have a varied approach and aim to build about 2 or 3 web 2.0 properties pointing to your main money page every day. Gradually slow it down to just one new page per day. This will make it look natural.

Use variations in your backlinks TO web 2.0 properties. As yukinari has stated..don't be predictable or use a singular approach. For some properties use blog commenting for backlinks..for some use bookmarking...and so on.

Deal in niches that are going to be sustainable for a long time and aim to have a top level domain to which all the web 2.0 properties link to rather than a hubpage.

DaveNL · Mar 13, 2009

tbootz said:
Hey thanks for the reply! I'm so frustrated right now, I'm really glad BHW members are so helpful.

I'll break your questions down and reply to them one by one.

How many bookmarks do you use and what other kind of backlinks do you use
Since my pages are only 3 or so days old I haven't used many bookmarks yet. My main money site (hubpages) with the aff link has a digg and delicious. Squidoo has one digg and wetpaint has a delicious and propeller.

Only 3 bookmarks??

that is not enough not by far lol, you must get 50 bookmarks at least, also try commenting blogs and other peoples hub, Google needs to have the idea that your site (in your case hubpage) is talked about)

do you update your hub frequently with new content, how much content are you using?
All my properties are are over 200 words long, my hubpages is over 720 words long. I haven't updated my hub at all. I'm not sure how I would do that other than just making the page even longer since it's not a blog format where I can add new entries. Or do you mean creating new hubs? I do however have some news rss widget on it, so that new feeds show up on the bottom as fresh content but otherwise I don't touch it after I've published it.

No i don't maen create new hubs i mean fresh content, what i do is when my lenses (because i prever squidoo over hubpages) are falling is i change the content around or ad a new text module with a post of 200 words, look at google news for my niche and make a blur about that, it doesnt have to be major updates every day but show Google your lens/hub isnt a spam lens/hub, by keeping her fresh.

Do you also ad some images and video on your hubs?
Yes, I have a related youtube video embedded and a picture of the product I'm pitching. My other properties have images linking to other properties of mine as well as my hubpages. (non reciprocal though)

That is ok, it is important to make your hub ar none spammy as posible.

and sometimes your page gets sandboxed but after a while the pages get back in again, especially when you keep updating them.
Can it be sandboxed even after showing up on google? Is there any particular reason for the sanbox effect, like a sort of penalty for something?

What is the sandbox, nobody really knows but from my expirence in SEO this is what happens, you have a new page on a site with a lot of authority (Squidoo, Hubpages, Wetpain whatever) Google loves fresh new stuff so you get your new property up in the ranking really fast because your content is fresh.

After a view days Google takes you of the index and start looking closer to your page and reranks you in the place they think you belong, if that is the first page you will notice that your second placement is more firm and consistant then the first time arround.

That is my theory on how Google is handeling web 2.0 take it for what it is worth.

You dont need a lot of content to keep them updated, but i start with 2 articles and ad another article after a view days, bookmark it gain ping it again, blog comment again.
By multiple articles do you mean multiple hubs/lenses from one account? Or you actually keep adding information to your one hub?

Yes untill you have a firmer position in the SE like i discribed before in my theory.

Also, I'm a little confused about the pinging. Once you ping your site and rss on a pinging service (pingomatic and pingoat being my favorites) do they keep track of your site and automatically re-ping it when it's updated or do you go back and ping it manually again? If you have a new blog post for example do you ping the main page and rss AND the url and rss of your post as well or is that too much pinging?

pingomatic has been acting up for me, because each time I ping a newly created property it tells me that I just pinged it a few minutes ago when the site just went live seconds ago... I'm not sure if there's some sort of error with pingomatic pinging my sites multiple times per click that is causing me to be flagged.

You need to ping hubpages yourself there is no atomated system in hubpages that does that for you.

Ad thise code in a bookmark in FF you dont have to go to pingomatic everythime you update, the code is from here and is not mine but it works great, use it everytime you update and you'll be fine

Code:

javascript:location.href='http://pingomatic.com/ping/?title='+encodeURIComponent(document.title)+'&blogurl='+encodeURIComponent(location.href)+'&chk_weblogscom=on&chk_blogs=on&chk_technorati=on&chk_feedburner=on&chk_syndic8=on&chk_newsgator=on&chk_myyahoo=on&chk_pubsubcom=on&chk_blogdigger=on&chk_blogrolling=on&chk_blogstreet=on&chk_moreover=on&chk_weblogalot=on&chk_icerocket=on&chk_newsisfree=on&chk_topicexchange=on&chk_google=on&chk_tailrank=on&chk_bloglines=on&chk_aiderss=on&chk_skygrid=on&chk_audioweblogs=on&chk_rubhub=on&chk_geourl=on&chk_a2b=on&chk_blogshares=on'

Thanks for reply!

You welcome

PS sorry for the typo's, spelling check isnt working

tbootz · Mar 13, 2009

DaveNL said:

Code:

javascript:location.href='http://pingomatic.com/ping/?title='+encodeURIComponent(document.title)+'&blogurl='+encodeURIComponent(location.href)+'&chk_weblogscom=on&chk_blogs=on&chk_technorati=on&chk_feedburner=on&chk_syndic8=on&chk_newsgator=on&chk_myyahoo=on&chk_pubsubcom=on&chk_blogdigger=on&chk_blogrolling=on&chk_blogstreet=on&chk_moreover=on&chk_weblogalot=on&chk_icerocket=on&chk_newsisfree=on&chk_topicexchange=on&chk_google=on&chk_tailrank=on&chk_bloglines=on&chk_aiderss=on&chk_skygrid=on&chk_audioweblogs=on&chk_rubhub=on&chk_geourl=on&chk_a2b=on&chk_blogshares=on'

Lol, holy crap some code.

Do I need to edit anything in that code for it to know what I'm trying to ping (like insert my url somewhere)? Or do I just put this in my FF bookmarks and I click on it off the site that I'm trying to ping? What does this code do anyway?

Oh, and one thing I'm still confused about -If you have a new blog post for example do you ping the main page and rss AND the url and rss of your post as well or is that the equivalent of spamming?

BTW I just tried pinging something again, pingomatic keeps telling me to slow down and that I pinged just a few minutes ago when I haven't pinged anything in days. Is pingomatic screwing with me or is this a nice way of letting me know that I've been banned, and to get lost? I'm going to try pinging off a different IP and see what happens...

DaveNL · Mar 13, 2009

Stop spamming pingomatic then

To use the code you do this, bookmark pingomatic, right click on the bookmark and go to properties (i believe it is called that way) and replace the link with this code.

Also you can get a free pinger here

Code:

http://www.bloggergenerator.com/

for your email, you can use it in conjunction with TOR.

Dave

iamsgf · Mar 13, 2009

Alot of talk about rankings all over this forum, yet alot of you miss a very valuable point!

Google presents revelant and up to date content. With one of their key focuses being UPTO DATE!! This is one of the main reasons you can create a new page (notice I said page and not SITE) and it will rank very quickly but for a short amount of time.

Now the main thing is that most of you guys do that initial bit to get the ranking then site back and smile at yourselft, pat yourself on the back and say job done! But then wonder a couple of days later why it has dissappeared......

Well it is simple... you did not follow up your actions. Google love new relevant content, so unless it see the graduale continuation of links each and every day then it will just drop of the serps very quickly, cos it is quickly considered old and irrelevant cos there are no new links to the object.

Going back to where I mentioned 'Page' not 'Site', this is because you are using web 2.0 sites that you are piggy backing off of. With a new site it is a totally different kettle of fish.

Anyway to answer your question: You are doing the right thing, but dont stop doing it. I would suggest that you create your web2 properties as you are doing, back it up with bulk article submissions and the such like, and then on a daily basis ping a selection of the article submissions and blog posts (this works as these can take longer to be organically found by SE's as they dissappear into the depths of article sites and blog sites within hours of being submitted. So it is like planting the seeds ready for daily watering

)

Yukinari84 · Mar 14, 2009

blackzeus said:
Also, Howie's video is quite old for today situation. Those web 2.0 he mentioned is less favorable, esp Squidoo. My squidoo lens now never appear on G even tho I keep updating it. A lot of bookmarking services also ban squidoo. So we need to keep an eye on new properties.

I have great results with Squidoo.

The Squidoo "slap" had not affected me at all.

But yes, new properties are always a must. They will get you so much more love from Google.

My Web 2.0 sites keep getting delisted on google!!

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