linkwheels + spun articles = fu(k3d

SENuke is a tricky beast. I've been using it for a few months now, spinning the hell out of articles following the advanced spinning strategies outlined in the SENuke blog post linked to above, and only a few of the articles I've submitted out of about 100 have been indexed by Google.

It's tough to say if the problem is that I'm not spinning the articles enough, SENuke is leaving a footprint, if I need to be building more backlinks to the content, or what, but that part of the program does not seem to be producing the results I want.

The other parts of the program (bookmarker, rss submitter, social media profile creator, etc) work better, but is that worth $127?

Well my SEnuke properties where getting indexed (I used another technique to make sure they got indexed) and I still wasn't getting the results I get from doing the exact same thing without SEnuke.

I'm not saying don't use SEnuke at all, but I wouldn't use it for this purpose any more.

If Senuke is leaving a footprint as some of you suggest, why not do a "view source" on the pages that you publish and see what it is. You could probably mask that somehow with content around it so it didn't show itself so strongly to google.

I think the footprint isnt in what it dumps, but in the way it access certain sites. I.e some sites can tell that an account has been made using SEnuke and that in turn may or may not raise a flag, which in turn may or may not be made obvious to google somehow.

Tend to agree with aftershock, the issue isn't the linkwheel, it's the easily detectable spun content. Manual rewrites are the way to go. Those having problems should just construct a test LW with human rewritten content plus a few comments as above suggested. The result should be a structure whose ranking holds up.

I confirm the fact that manually is better than with Senuke. I'm not happy with it or I don't use it properly, but when I was doing everything manually I was ranking a lot higher.

^^ i dont think that's true.

i know lots of people using senuke and owning google as well.

it's all about being unique and random like the above poster said.

Senuke is still an effective program, that many of my friends and clients use religiously to promote their site properties. However, the issue is all about the content you are promoting through it. The tool itself isn't the problem, it is the user and what the user is pushing through it.

I personally don't use it, as I don't agree with the limitations that it has on seo. In the end, the software will only do what it is written to do and can not be blamed for the outcome of the user.

Bottomline for this should be that people need to produce unique content.

As for the splinter topic for randomness, I submit on a daily schedule and NEVER have any problems due to having them in ' windows ' of time and it comes down to what is on the list first for that given day as the site that goes in what sequencial order. Randomness is a give and take thing and isn't as black and white as people seem to take it as.

The posting window is a set time frame for each and every day that I do it. The randomness of the process shows up in the postings never happens to be at precisely the same time. People have structured lives and google knows that and depends on their regular posters for all of their content, as they are a search engine and build none of their own. To assume that you have to completely 100% random all the time, overthinking if your post is going to be lost in the shuffle due to when you post it is a mistake, as long as you are not article or post stuffing, which is web 2.0 spam.

That is the issue google is paying attention for. If you load 20 articles per the same cycled day though, they aren't going to have an issue with that.

Paper-Boy said:

^^ i dont think that's true.

i know lots of people using senuke and owning google as well.

it's all about being unique and random like the above poster said.

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I haven't tried them yet, but there are some up and coming apps like Link Builder Pro and Serp Assist. Will be interesting to see if they give SE Nuke a run for their money.
I will say that Best Spinner is one of the top dogs. Spinning the html and word count is essential as well. It lets you do some deep spinning. Just using spinning synonyms is index suicide.

It isnt in the linkwheel or the structure or anything else. It is in the article. If you can not find the article in first 10 or so pages of google search then it is just flushed down and forgotten. You really have to write compelliing original articles to ezine or hubpages and have them rank to get a valid backlinked. I got one article on ezine that gets like 100 reads a day. You bet I get a valid backlink and about 20% clickthrough rate to boot.

troybh said:

It isnt in the linkwheel or the structure or anything else. It is in the article. If you can not find the article in first 10 or so pages of google search then it is just flushed down and forgotten. You really have to write compelliing original articles to ezine or hubpages and have them rank to get a valid backlinked. I got one article on ezine that gets like 100 reads a day. You bet I get a valid backlink and about 20% clickthrough rate to boot.

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Yep. That's the glue that holds your wheel together. For instance, I will have my outsource writer write 10 completely different articles just to be safe. Then, I'll tweak them to my liking. You stick to that basic plan, and you can make some cash.

BassTrackerBoats said:

I have her doing some things but she is well behind the learning curve. We are a little older than most in IM, (we are in our 50's) and picking up new things are a little harder for us.

Fortunately I like to write and can pound out unique content all day long to generate backlinks for our websites.

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And good on you for sticking to it Bass!!! It's not how fast you get there, but more the fact that you don't stop moving along.

silvertroll said:

Just curious, what is that a --> c + d, b --> d +e pattern ?

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It's the typical structure like from Lemonarian's ebook:



To take the top left section of this picture as a very simplified example, let's relabel the web 2.0 sites as letters.

Let Quizilla be "a",
let's then label Blogsome as "c",
and Focus Hub can be "d"

With that switch, do you NOW see how a links to c + d?

@aftershock - once again you've given a really good analysis and some recomendations. Alwasy a pleasure to read your posts.

@spla - the pdf that BassTrackerBoats posted isn't bashing linkwheels. Linkwheels are a good concept, the original structure was just so smple that it didn't resemble a natural occurance. What basstrackboats has dubbed Link Push is just the name he's using for the same concept, just extended out far enough to resemble something natural.

@BassTrackerBoats - I really liked your ebook. You've extended the linkwheel concept into a structure that should be able to help a lot of people get better listings. I've been saying for awhile that the linkwheel needs to simulate more randomness. The blueprint you've mapped out can help people achieve that without having to design it from scratch. Thanks for the share, it looks like a really good technique.

BedokBlau said:

It's the typical structure like from Lemonarian's ebook:

To take the top left section of this picture as a very simplified example, let's relabel the web 2.0 sites as letters.

Let Quizilla be "a",
let's then label Blogsome as "c",
and Focus Hub can be "d"

With that switch, do you NOW see how a links to c + d?

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Interesting, but isn't it just a closed linkwheel? I thought that using a closed linkwheel is dangerous since google can easily spot these, am I wrong?

silvertroll said:

Interesting, but isn't it just a closed linkwheel? I thought that using a closed linkwheel is dangerous since google can easily spot these, am I wrong?

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That's exactly what Micallef said: This used to work, then Google changed and made it ineffective.

So just to recap the linkwheel is dead, spun articles are dead and links are not as important?? So did Blackhat SEO just disappear from the face of the earth??

data84 said:

So just to recap the linkwheel is dead, spun articles are dead and links are not as important?? So did Blackhat SEO just disappear from the face of the earth??

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None of it's really dead. You just have to be better at it now.

Linkwheels need to be a little more complex.
Spun articles need to produce a little more quality content
Links need to more relevant.

Blackhat SEO isn't dead, it's just a little more work now.
:beerchug:

GreyWolf said:

Blackhat SEO isn't dead, it's just a little more work now.
:beerchug:

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The whole concept of ranking high in the search engines is always going to be work and the harder you work the better your rankings will be if you operate properly.

Linus (Lemonarian) had a great concept when he first produced his link wheel idea and it worked well for a lot of us. I was kicking it really good with some very aggressive keywords back then but after a while I got nothing from my efforts.

As in life, things have evolved and a simple linkwheel with spun content/duplicate content is no longer so effective to take you to the top.

Backlinks to your site will always be important... it's just how they point to your site that will be forever evolving.

The one thing that will never change if you want a long term profitable site is that it is going to take work.

Any of you that have owned a brick and mortar business understands that concept and making a living online is no different than a brick and mortar business with the brick and mortar replaced by a laptop and content and your inventory or service replaced with adsense/CPA/Etc.