Link building question

Ranking is per document.
Thus not for the whole domain.
But if you have a good internal structure of pagerank flow, the root domain is the one you could best link to.
Unless your trying to get the page high up in the ranking.

I made a post ones about internal linking. Maybe it can be of help;
http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackh...ce-drawn-external-links-only.html#post1732613

Good luck,

Hey M.A.D, thanks for your post and explanation in the other thread. While i'm in the same boat as the last poster (i don't get the image), your explanations make sense and are straight forward.

Where do navigational links come in? Like, tabs accross the top of your site. Would you no-follow those like you mentioned doing to a sidebar? I thought i heard someone say once that google is smart enough nowadays to recognize navigational links as such and not consider them part of your internal linking... is this true?

Thanks again,

Chocko
 
Again I think it's about natural linking patterns. I would therefore suggest that you build links both to your homepage and to some of your internal pages.
 
You cleared up so much with that post... thanks so much. I've read content on silo structures plenty of times, but this is the first time it actually made sense in a way that i feel i can reproduce it on my own site.

You are the man.


The only thing i find myself wondering about is where the best place to put the links is. On your home page: Do you put the links to the categories in the top bar/side bar, or do you put them in content? Same question for the category pages...

I don't draw as well :(

Examp1.JPG

or
Examp2.JPG


I've heard linking in content is more powerful... would picture 2 be the best way to do it?
 
when i post on different blogs for link building purpose should i use only the main url www.xxx.com or all pages like www.xxx.com/xxx ?
does it make any difference ?
I always believed in interlinking content and then building links for each page of the blog. I usually provide any new post a anchor link from recent two posts. ( No doubt all my blogs target one specific niche only) then I leave comment or go for ezine submission with new article's link. The key is I build backlinks for new page as well as twice for home-page.
I hate to target only single of them.
 
I wouldn't know if it is true. But don't expect that it is.
Make sure your internal structure in order.

The simplest way i can explain is as follows.
Keep it clean, try to have everything organized with the least amount of links.
An example;
Binary-tree-structure.png


Imagine the image is a website structure.
In the image you see the links from the homepage flow down into a category and the category down into your pages.
home-->category-->pages.
Perfect structure, but you would also like people to go back to the home page, and/or category page ones they have reached the bottom of the tree.
The following example, represent a website with a top bar.
The top bar contains a home button and a pull down category button.
This way you can access every page and go back to every page.
24vvcpu.jpg

Now this is the best structure, the least amount of links.
And all the links are equally divided, meaning not one page gets more pr then the other.
I will referrer to this as the base structure.

Now say i would add a block in my sidebar with some of the latest posts.
Handy for the users, but not for the search engines.
What happens is you link to some pages double, and it becomes one big blur.
2yzeqdz.jpg

This is just with two pages, imagin if you had a hundred.
Also some pages are way heavier on pr then others.

It used to be that search engines would stop crawling when they were confronted by double pages.
They'd say we've been here before lets move on.
You'd think why. Simply money. Crawling costs bandwidth and bandwidth costs money.
For you it might be a couple pages, but if it's on every website a search engine starts loosing money.
This also the reason why google couldn't crawl javascript in the old days, although it was more a cpu power thing.
One of the reasons sitemaps became so popular. It has that tree structure.
Which is easier for search engines to crawl.
This is what i tried to make clear in the original posts with the image that wasn't exactly clear to you.

So what do you do to resolve it. You use nofollow links on internal links not vital to your base structure.
This includes login tabs/widgets/pages, submit forms, adds and the latest post widget example i gave you.
Also notable is that a lot of top bars use javascipt.
This can cause errors in the crawling. Make sure that if they are interactive, they consist 100% of css1,css2 or css3. (NO JAVASCRIPT!)
So normal Href links with css styling, or just standard href links.

WordPress has solved this problem really well.
In there standard Kubrick theme they don't have a topbar.
They arrange everything from the sidebar.
Although not perfect, it just needs slight modifying.
I'll just give you a quick example.

5zg2d.jpg


Also from default wordpress has your ten latest posts on the homepage.
You should change that to just displaying your latest and one sticky "about your website" for example, so it doesn't look empty.
Hope that clears some stuff up for you.

Cheers

Thanks, this clears everything. I think the homepage is important and should be linked more, because it is on top of the hierarchy.
:rolleyes:
 
Linking from content for a internal structure is useless.
I attached three image to give you a basic idea.

Image 1 ; homepage, content and a category block.
You click on the category culture which leads you to a page with the posts that belong to "culture" category, this is Image 2.
When you click on one the post titles you go to the post content page being image 3.
This is perfect for search engines, however slightly less useful for normal visitors.
Image 4, a revised home page. Adding a nofollow latest post widget to make your users happy.

Very crude but in a nutshell thats it.

I couldn't have asked for more out of your crude nutshell :) Thanks again M.A.D, I think I finally get it!

You should really consolidate these few posts you made to help me and make a new thread or something... 'cause this info is great and i haven't seen it explained this well before anywhere...

MAD props :)
 
@Mad:-
Thanks for your posts on this, it now seems so simple and obvious, I have a lot of fixing up to do on my sites. For some reason I had always thought that cross linking even hyperlinking words in articles to other articles internally in the sites was a good thing. Clearly not.
 
I have no shame in bumping this thread because of it's badass content.

I got my site structure mapped out the way shown above, but while working on design a question popped up.

Regarding the links for navigation:

Obviously image links (like header navigation with rollover images) can't have anchor text. They can have title and alt tags (and a couple more if you want to spliff, haha thanks ipopbb), but do these measure up?

Is a link with keyword anchor text better than image links for site navigation? ...or is it all the same?
 
Yeah should be fine;

HTML:
<a href="http://www.example.com"><img src="image.jpg" alt="my image"></a>
Although i'm not big fan image links.
Each image you add is another http request.
So the connection kind of goes like this;

first http request is for your code.
then the browser sees you use images and it has to do requests for each individual image.
Say you got five button images, thats five more http connection.
If use javascript, for something like google analytics then thats another http request.


This is very annoying when someone is on wifi, shared networks or iphone.
If i were you i would look into styling your <a href" "></a> with css.
There loads of tutorials out there on how to buttons from simple links using css.
It's less size, less http connection and easier to crawl for search-engines.

Cool man, thanks. Unfortunately i just got some bad news involving the project i'm working on (updating an old site), so i won't actually get to do this right now, but i'll remember this for my next site.

My boss decided that his budget is too thin to spend on new design, which ultimately means that all of the header links will be displayed in flash, which is how they are right now.

These links don't even show up in the search engines. wtf am i supposed to do with flash links?

Maybe i will end up having to stick to content bound links from the home page.
 
Google can read flash too.
They can click a link, follow it,run it, and thus index it.

I've read that they were implementing this kinda stuff in 2008, but google doesn't seem to pick any of these links up in webmaster tools. They have a lot of random flash content indexed, but they're missing a couple pages which are linked to via flash. Other pages which are linked to via flash ARE indeed in the index, but that doesn't add up to what webmaster tools is saying... unless itself is outdated.

What could be going on here? Is it possible that the people who wrote the flash content did it in an outdated way...?

but i don't know the first thing about flash, so my ignorance is probably shining through lol
 
Man, there is some really good information, explanation and visuals in this thread. Should def. be stickied.

I'll try to go through and thank everybody. You just put something togethor for me I've been trying to understand for a while. Thanks! :)
 
Maybe because it isn't a actual hypertext link.
Actionscript is based on ECMAScript, same as jscript and javascript.
It is object oriented. In this case the button is the object and not a hypertext link, so there is no hypertext for google to index.
Rather then being a link, a event is attached to the button. In this case it's the onclick() event.
When the onclick event is dispatched, by a click on the button, a function is executed.
In this case a new page is loaded.

Now google can follow the actionscript code, but there is no actual hypertext google can index.
You can go to the webmaster help forum on google and ask the question.
Maybe they have a answer to resolve. And else they will probably add it to the bug queue.

But still........ flash can be read by google.
Not other search engines.
Thats why css is so awesome.
You don't need a player like flash. Every browser supports it out of the box.
Seriously, you can learn this within a hour;
http://www.w3schools.com/css/css_intro.asp

Thanks for the answer, I'm posting over there about webmaster tools and will update this thread with what i find.

So, even while webmaster tools may not be able to index the links, the content is indeed visible... so does that mean a flash navigation would work just fine passing link juice to the various categories on my site? or... are these like invisible user-only navigation (which brings up the question, can you no.fol.low links in flash?)

I actually just took a couple weeks and read a Head First book on XHTML/CSS. Good stuff, but i don't feel anywhere near confident enough to be replacing this company's flash header... while i have the general knowledge to pull something like this off, i only want to go there if this flash navigation can't be worked with.
 
Ooph that shit is even more above my head lol If i do any changes, it will definitely be with html/css.

While searching around for information on flash navigation workarounds and such, is stumbled across this: http://www.seomoz.org/blog/google-s...ulpt-pagerank-no-you-cant-do-it-with-nofollow

Looks like it is somewhat old news, but yet relevant to what we were discussing a few posts back... Have you seen this? is this more Gxxgle BS?
 
No, it's not bullshit. You can definitely get a penalty for pagerank sculpting.
If you do pagerank sculpting, you are trying to flow the pagerank of all pages and concentrate into one.
For instance you got navbar links, comment and content links on multiple pages. But you only leave homepage links doflow and the rest noflow.
All the pr will concentrate on that page.
Using noflow to get a better site structure is not something you have to worry about, if you use it to improve your structure.

Thanks for helping me put 2 and 2 together.
 
Bumpin a year-old thread... because my project finally got approved by management!!!

Anyway, two quick questions:

1. Has anything new evolved in this methodology which needs amending?

2. I am seeing lots of sites which include Nav-bar navigation as well as breadcrumb navigation... what's the rule of thumb here? Do you leave both of these as follow?

Cheers all!

Edit: just read a shit ton of stuff... lots has changed as it always does. I found some posts by M.A.D in response to another post, unlike the OP and the person the OP was disputing with, M.A.D actually includes information, and links to resources to back up his findings/opinions. As such, i spent awhile looking at the Youtube channel for Gxxgle.

This video specifically pertains to the discussion here, i'm wondering if this "n0f0llow" stuff has been widely abandoned? http://www.youtube.com/user/GoogleWebmasterHelp#p/u/13/bVOOB_Q0MZY
 
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