Is this a potential scam technique used by ebay buyers?

I just realized something. Occasionally I'll have a buyer from an international location (outside the US) order from my ebay store and the shipment is sent out but later in tracking it shows that it is in customs clearance and delayed (meaning, the buyer needs to contact DHL Express to provide either more information or pay fees for customs clearance). Most of the time, they do, but sometimes the buyers never contact customs to claim their package or pay fees. They just ignore it for a month or two.

Then they will open up a 'item not received' case and say they did not receive the order as it has long past the expected delivery date.

They ask for a refund. Now, I would usually just give them the refund because I don't know what would happen if they escalated to ebay. Ebay would probably see the tracking information as item not delivered because it's stuck in customs clearance. I don't know if ebay sees that as the seller's fault or the buyer's fault. So usually I will just refund.

But let's say after I refund them, the buyer could then contact customs to clear their package and get the order! Would this potentially be a scam technique used by some buyers to basically get their money back AND get their package by delay claiming their package at customs?

It "could" be, however usually customs will detain the packages from 7 to 14 days, depending on the country. If you don't respond within that timeframe they do a return to sender.

oatmeal said:

I just realized something. Occasionally I'll have a buyer from an international location (outside the US) order from my ebay store and the shipment is sent out but later in tracking it shows that it is in customs clearance and delayed (meaning, the buyer needs to contact DHL Express to provide either more information or pay fees for customs clearance). Most of the time, they do, but sometimes the buyers never contact customs to claim their package or pay fees. They just ignore it for a month or two.

Then they will open up a 'item not received' case and say they did not receive the order as it has long past the expected delivery date.

They ask for a refund. Now, I would usually just give them the refund because I don't know what would happen if they escalated to ebay. Ebay would probably see the tracking information as item not delivered because it's stuck in customs clearance. I don't know if ebay sees that as the seller's fault or the buyer's fault. So usually I will just refund.

But let's say after I refund them, the buyer could then contact customs to clear their package and get the order! Would this potentially be a scam technique used by some buyers to basically get their money back AND get their package by delay claiming their package at customs?

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You need to add in the product description or in the shipping description that the price does not include customs fees and other taxes.
And if the buyer complains then Ebay will support your side.

Interesting point...gotta be careful!

TheWicker said:

It "could" be, however usually customs will detain the packages from 7 to 14 days, depending on the country. If you don't respond within that timeframe they do a return to sender.

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I'm sure it will vary depending on which shipping service you use. I only have experience with DHL Express. Most of the time, it is really good. Buyers are happy, shipping is fast. But in certain countries, it always gets stopped at customs for clearance issues (whether it be more documents required or fees to be paid). I've had it stay in customs for well over a 1 month and then be resolved and shipped to the buyer. Yes, it would be nice if they could just automatically return it if the buyer a) doesn't claim it or b) refuses it, but unfortunately, most of the time, it is not able to be returned (for reasons I don't know why....probably because someone has to pay for return shipping).

My ongoing case is going to be eligible for escalation in 3 days, and by that time if the buyer decides to escalate it right away, my shipment will still be in transit on the way to the buyer's address but only a few days away from final delivery as tracking will show it (as it is full tracking).

I'm not sure what ebay will decide because on the one hand, it's true, the buyer didn't receive the order (yet) but clearly tracking that I provide will show that it is on it's way and will arrive by a certain date they show on the tracking. The buyer just needs to wait a little longer despite already waiting a long time because the shipment was shipped out late due to being back ordered by my dropshipper.

This is the predicament I am in with these kinds of orders. I often will hold the order and wait in hopes the product that is back ordered becomes available within a few days to even a couple weeks (international orders), then ship it out. But if you wait too long, there's the chance that when you do ship it out, the buyer might decide to open a case as INR and then you are caught in this little gap where the shipment is on the way now and will make it to them (albeit late) but the open case is subject to review well before it arrives.

I'll let you guys know what happens. This is good to know for ebay sellers.

Awesome posts and replies guys! Does anyone have any more info on this? And/or some other threads that cover these type of "gray areas?"

Thanks in advance!

Usually items that are stuck in customs - the user have to pay a good price...I don;t see someone trying to scam for this

scudrock said:

Usually items that are stuck in customs - the user have to pay a good price...I don;t see someone trying to scam for this

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In some cases, true. In others, not true. For example, a buyer from bangladesh ordered a $15 item from me. It was shipped via DHL Express and got to his country in just a few days. But he said DHL contacted him saying he would have to pay $50 to have it released. So I just refunded him and took the loss of $15 on that order because nobody is going to pay $50 for a $15 item to have it or to ship it back to origin.

In other cases, fees might only be around $8. Someone could technically withhold paying it and then wait long enough to open a case saying they didn't receive their item. Then if ebay closes in their favor, after they get their money back, they can then go back to customs and pay the $8 to release it to them. Now they got the product and their refund money back and only had to pay $8.

So that's why I was asking, does ebay consider it the responsibility of the buyer or the shipper when an order is held at customs and awaiting for either payment or documentation.

The more I think about it, the more I'm starting to believe it might be the buyer's responsibility. I think as long as you state somewhere in your listing that any import/vat/tax fees are the responsibility of the buyer before purchasing, you might win the case.

I should have let it go to escalation just to see what would happen. Instead I refunded the buyer right away. I'll have to wait for this situation to arise again to try it out. The only reason why I would risk it is because I have 0 defects right now and I could afford to risk 1 for a good lesson learned.

Another way of looking it at or formulating the question would be:

Is it the seller's responsibility to be aware of all 180 countries customs laws, taxes, import laws, etc? Or is it the buyer's responsibility to simply know about their own country's import/taxes/custom laws?

It seems to me that it makes a lot more sense for the responsibility to lie with the buyer as they only have to know about their country, rather than expecting all sellers that ship internationally to somehow have 500 pages of documentation next to their computers citing all the import, taxes, custom laws, rules, regulations for each country.

In the past I had other cases where the buyer bought something edible from me and I shipped it out to them but later found out by customs it was held because it was not allowed in the country. The item was discarded. Who would win an open case in that situation?

I didn't bother to risk it because I already had 2 defects and one more would put me out. So I just refunded the buyer, took the loss, and made a personal note never to export this "ingredient" to that country. I'm just saying, it seems like as sellers, we'd have to be aware of tens of thousands of rules, what is allowed and not allowed, what is taxed, not taxed, and how much at what percentage, etc. Sometimes the dropshipper never knew about it either which is why they were able to ship it out. But later on they also make changes on their site so that if you tried to order a restricted item to that country, it would not even allow you to order it to that address.

be careful bro very very bad

There are plenty of ebay buyer scamers, some years ago i saw a forum explaning how to get free stuff from ebay, one of the method Was this one you explained and the other one i remember Was just replacing the new item receved with the same broken, so you dont pay to repair, for this i quit ebay dropshipping

alesiox94 said:

There are plenty of ebay buyer scamers, some years ago i saw a forum explaning how to get free stuff from ebay, one of the method Was this one you explained and the other one i remember Was just replacing the new item receved with the same broken, so you dont pay to repair, for this i quit ebay dropshipping

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True. I think if you are going to dropship, it's best to do products that aren't too expensive and low maintenance. I've had a lot of orders that I had to refund the buyer but I never got refunded by my dropshipper, so I lost 100% of the money but most items I sell are between $10-$30 so taking a loss isn't that bad, especially when you know you'll make it up within a couple days or so of more selling. If you are dropshipping hundreds of dollars worth of items like electronics/computers/video/photo stuffs, I can see where you can have major problems and losses.

The good news in my case is the item I shipped out late and had an open case as INR, arrived yesterday and tracking confirms delivered, so now I'm safe if the buyer decided to escalate it. Fortunately, the buyer didn't escalate it before it arrived because then I wouldn't be sure if I would win the case or not. A lost chance to learn something new but glad the shipment arrived. Now of course the buyer can still leave me a negative for late shipment and there would be nothing I can do about it.