How much to charge a lawyer for SEO
- Thread starter greggggg
- Start date
MintM
Newbie
- Nov 8, 2010
- 19
- 22
I have to agree with the general consensus here.
He is a LAWYER mate! Do you have any idea how much just one client is worth to him??? Do you?
If you do, and you still want to charge a paltry amount, get out of this business - it won't work for you if you want to make a decent living. Better still, JV with or hire a salesperson / Business development person WITH EXPERIENCE who can manage and charge out the business while you stay at your computer doing the science!
If you don't truly understand how much a client is worth to him, then you need to re think your approach to taking on your own clients. I won't go through my whole method here but put it this way - my initial meeting takes a client through a process that finds all sorts of problems / opportunities / solutions with their business. A big part of that is working out the lifetime value (LTV) of their typical client. Clue: Lawyer's clients have a very high LTV. That's not just one transaction, but all the transactions that they're liable to with the lawyer over time.
Just to give you an idea, my initial consultation, before I've even discussed solutions and services, takes about 2 hours. That's a lot of provoking and leading questions about their business from me, and even more listening carefully while they talk themselves into my services, I mean tell me all about the facts and figures of their business and it's marketing practices.
When you work this out, and then how many of these new clients you can bring a lawyer using whatever methods you use (SEO being one of them), then you - and most importantly he, will start to really see how much your service is worth. Further, your offering becomes a cost-neutral no-brainer for him as - if you can deliver X new clients per month that earn him $xxxxxx then as long as you service is still less than that, he's making a profit (I'm oversimplifying here, but hopefully you get the point).
In addition to this there's one other very important point about charging - it directly affects your positioning. Lawyers and many other professionals live in worlds where everything and everyone has high $$ prices. If you come in and allow them to nickle and dime you, or don't have the confidence to charge reasonable prices, then they will never take you seriously, nor truly value the work that you do. If you had a major court case and needed hard core legal representation, and some guy came in and said he's only charge you $25/hour, would you take him seriously? Didn't think so.
Hope some of this helps. Not meaning to put you down at all, just want to have you realize that you have a very valuable service that is worth a lot of money. (This is all based on the fact that you can actually deliver!)
He is a LAWYER mate! Do you have any idea how much just one client is worth to him??? Do you?
If you do, and you still want to charge a paltry amount, get out of this business - it won't work for you if you want to make a decent living. Better still, JV with or hire a salesperson / Business development person WITH EXPERIENCE who can manage and charge out the business while you stay at your computer doing the science!
If you don't truly understand how much a client is worth to him, then you need to re think your approach to taking on your own clients. I won't go through my whole method here but put it this way - my initial meeting takes a client through a process that finds all sorts of problems / opportunities / solutions with their business. A big part of that is working out the lifetime value (LTV) of their typical client. Clue: Lawyer's clients have a very high LTV. That's not just one transaction, but all the transactions that they're liable to with the lawyer over time.
Just to give you an idea, my initial consultation, before I've even discussed solutions and services, takes about 2 hours. That's a lot of provoking and leading questions about their business from me, and even more listening carefully while they talk themselves into my services, I mean tell me all about the facts and figures of their business and it's marketing practices.
When you work this out, and then how many of these new clients you can bring a lawyer using whatever methods you use (SEO being one of them), then you - and most importantly he, will start to really see how much your service is worth. Further, your offering becomes a cost-neutral no-brainer for him as - if you can deliver X new clients per month that earn him $xxxxxx then as long as you service is still less than that, he's making a profit (I'm oversimplifying here, but hopefully you get the point).
In addition to this there's one other very important point about charging - it directly affects your positioning. Lawyers and many other professionals live in worlds where everything and everyone has high $$ prices. If you come in and allow them to nickle and dime you, or don't have the confidence to charge reasonable prices, then they will never take you seriously, nor truly value the work that you do. If you had a major court case and needed hard core legal representation, and some guy came in and said he's only charge you $25/hour, would you take him seriously? Didn't think so.
Hope some of this helps. Not meaning to put you down at all, just want to have you realize that you have a very valuable service that is worth a lot of money. (This is all based on the fact that you can actually deliver!)
MintM
Newbie
- Nov 8, 2010
- 19
- 22
Reminds me of a good friend who does web design and programming. He has built several sites for big clients using virtual technoogy and one day we were talking and i mentioned the word 'seo' and he said what is that? Nearly fell off my chair
Haha!! Yeah - amazing isn't it?
unknownn
BANNED
- Dec 7, 2008
- 827
- 612
sorry to be so directly but after reading your thread i would NEVER use your service.
Your question is funny and the answer is like every of your customers.
Why do you care how much money he is going to make because of the rankings?Does he have a JV with you or is he just buying your service which you are offering to everyone?
I'm pretty sure he isnt looking for a JV but for a service.
Your question is funny and the answer is like every of your customers.
Why do you care how much money he is going to make because of the rankings?Does he have a JV with you or is he just buying your service which you are offering to everyone?
I'm pretty sure he isnt looking for a JV but for a service.
oyeah22
Power Member
- Nov 9, 2009
- 687
- 257
I agree with this dude right here. Sounds like it would be the best option. Only problem is that some leads would be worth more than others...so maybe u could set it up on the lead generation page how much they think the lawsuit will be worth or something. Or what kind of case it was... Just my 2 cents
citylightz
Registered Member
- Oct 13, 2010
- 88
- 20
I think that what MintM said is all exactly right. If you go in too cheap they won't respect you and will think that you don't know what you're doing.
Keep in mind that their return on investment (ROI) is potentially huge. If you bring them one new client, your services will have paid for themselves. Everything after that will be gravy (gross profit).
Do some consultative selling - find out what their specialties are and what they charge for their services. If they are using the Yellow Pages ask them how much is it costing them each month and has it been effective. Then show them their potential ROI and a lower cost per prospect than the Yellow Pages.
Go in there with confidence that you can make them money but make sure that you can deliver what you say.
Keep in mind that their return on investment (ROI) is potentially huge. If you bring them one new client, your services will have paid for themselves. Everything after that will be gravy (gross profit).
Do some consultative selling - find out what their specialties are and what they charge for their services. If they are using the Yellow Pages ask them how much is it costing them each month and has it been effective. Then show them their potential ROI and a lower cost per prospect than the Yellow Pages.
Go in there with confidence that you can make them money but make sure that you can deliver what you say.
GrizzlyAdams
Regular Member
- Feb 17, 2011
- 478
- 406
You and I are different though, you're selling SEO, you're selling a commodity. I'm selling leads, I'm selling him, MONEY. So sorry, I'm not going to take a small piece of the pie when I can tell how much business I've brought him, and how much it's worth. Sorry I have dignity I guess.
aStroke
Regular Member
- May 22, 2011
- 409
- 234
Like GrizzlyAdams said, there's a difference in business models. You are selling SEO, which is something cool if you're doing it on BHW or WF.
The other business model is selling a lead generation service. SEO is only a means to get those leads. If you know it will take the same effort to rank a dentist and a flower shop for top rankings for the same amount of traffic, will you charge them the same? Of course not. Because different businesses value leads differently than other businesses.
If you sell SEO to businesses that have clients with high lifetime values, you are getting the short end of the stick.
The other business model is selling a lead generation service. SEO is only a means to get those leads. If you know it will take the same effort to rank a dentist and a flower shop for top rankings for the same amount of traffic, will you charge them the same? Of course not. Because different businesses value leads differently than other businesses.
If you sell SEO to businesses that have clients with high lifetime values, you are getting the short end of the stick.
I agree with those who think 3 digits is crazy. 300 a month? To rank a lawyer?
Charge 1500 a month with no guarantees. I never understood why anyone would guarantee anything. In this case I would ask for 1.5k a month and another 1.5k in retainer for the 1st month. Use the 1st 1.5 on seo, citations and so forth. Tell the guy to be patient and you will hit the 7 pack, then work on getting more reviews then his competition.
A lawyer once asked me if I guarantee his site will hit the one spot. My answer was a question. Do you guarantee I will win my case if I get you on retainer?
I had the check later that day.
Now if I was working with a local plumber would I charge that? Of course not, but the same premise applies..charge them a set fee, get a 1st month retainer, spend that retainer on seo. Each month dedicate 10 or 20% of your fee towards maintenance.
For all those starting out...get a friend or collegue who you has a site you can rank. Do it for free. Then just tell them that if you rank them your fee is referrals . When I was starting in local I did this 4 for businesses. I ranked 3 of them.
Once that happens you will have a portfolio of sites to brag about
and when you talk to an attorney your balls will be big enough to ask for anything you want.
Charge 1500 a month with no guarantees. I never understood why anyone would guarantee anything. In this case I would ask for 1.5k a month and another 1.5k in retainer for the 1st month. Use the 1st 1.5 on seo, citations and so forth. Tell the guy to be patient and you will hit the 7 pack, then work on getting more reviews then his competition.
A lawyer once asked me if I guarantee his site will hit the one spot. My answer was a question. Do you guarantee I will win my case if I get you on retainer?
I had the check later that day.
Now if I was working with a local plumber would I charge that? Of course not, but the same premise applies..charge them a set fee, get a 1st month retainer, spend that retainer on seo. Each month dedicate 10 or 20% of your fee towards maintenance.
For all those starting out...get a friend or collegue who you has a site you can rank. Do it for free. Then just tell them that if you rank them your fee is referrals . When I was starting in local I did this 4 for businesses. I ranked 3 of them.
Once that happens you will have a portfolio of sites to brag about
and when you talk to an attorney your balls will be big enough to ask for anything you want.
Last edited:
wolfmanlv
Junior Member
- Dec 6, 2007
- 151
- 158
and I thought I was good with one liners.
DUDE, until today I've never read a post of yours. Today I read 2, this and one on video rankings... some rockin stuff bro!
BlueSteele
Regular Member
- Apr 10, 2010
- 281
- 138
This ^
b1step-ahead
Elite Member
- Nov 15, 2010
- 1,731
- 1,035
Make him a deal- charge 1500 a month- but tell him the start up cost are waived. Get his site ranked well, make sure he makes money and you have a lifer. After a year, raise your monthly to 1950 and etc....
aStroke
Regular Member
- May 22, 2011
- 409
- 234
Raising prices is hard to do. You will have to resell the client on why it's worth it to raise prices, which is harder than it sounds. People don't like change, and in order to change, they need a good justification on why they should.
Just my opinion.
Scripteen
Elite Member
- Sep 19, 2009
- 1,818
- 1,930
Simply because he needs maintenance to maintain the position and make the rank future proof.
It has been said in this thread before i think.
DO NOT UNDERVAULE YOUR SERVICE!
If you go in there with a measly $1500 month the lawyer is going
to have his doubts about you.
Why?
He gets call all day every day about ranking on the first page on Google
at 3X what you are chrging.
Best way to find out what a market will bare is shop other SEO firms.
A lot of these guys are chrging $1500 PER KEYWORD!
DO NOT UNDERVAULE YOUR SERVICE!
If you go in there with a measly $1500 month the lawyer is going
to have his doubts about you.
Why?
He gets call all day every day about ranking on the first page on Google
at 3X what you are chrging.
Best way to find out what a market will bare is shop other SEO firms.
A lot of these guys are chrging $1500 PER KEYWORD!
Johnnyfox
Regular Member
- Sep 6, 2010
- 381
- 335
I had an orthodontist flat out tell me that $1500 was too much for what I offered him. One customer will spend at least 3k on a full work up.
He has a website built by one of these "dental site building and SEO" services, he is not even listed in the top 100.
Despite my great sales pitch and very well put together presentation, he thinks he can do it on his own.
I walked away and never looked back, just as you should with these misinformed egotists.
These business owners who don't understand the value of a 7 box listing should be ignored, there are way to many fish to fry to mess with the ones that think they know something. But there is a twist here....
Just as a point of interest, I built 5 sites targeting specific orthodontist services and now I am on page one for 3 of them, with my optin form collecting leads. Not a lot of leads, but valuable leads.
These sites just started getting traffic a week or two ago.
Guess who I am gonna call and sell the leads to for a hefty sum?
That's right, mister I can do it myself.
Could of had unlimited leads for a fixed price, but he had to be a hard ass.
I am placing more resources into the lead gen model personally. I am sick of explaining the fact that I can literally triple their business, and have them look at me like I just asked for a loan.
Besides Its easier to rank a micro site that does not even need to be in the 7box to get leads. I don't need many, just a small amount every month will pay nicely.
and it should be mentioned that I don't like haggling and ass patting, If I wanted to deal with that shit I would have taken a corporate job kissing asses and grabbing starbucks.
With lead gen it is very simple....this lead just came in right now, pay me, call the lead now, not in ten minutes, thanks talk soon.
He has a website built by one of these "dental site building and SEO" services, he is not even listed in the top 100.
Despite my great sales pitch and very well put together presentation, he thinks he can do it on his own.
I walked away and never looked back, just as you should with these misinformed egotists.
These business owners who don't understand the value of a 7 box listing should be ignored, there are way to many fish to fry to mess with the ones that think they know something. But there is a twist here....
Just as a point of interest, I built 5 sites targeting specific orthodontist services and now I am on page one for 3 of them, with my optin form collecting leads. Not a lot of leads, but valuable leads.
These sites just started getting traffic a week or two ago.
Guess who I am gonna call and sell the leads to for a hefty sum?
That's right, mister I can do it myself.
Could of had unlimited leads for a fixed price, but he had to be a hard ass.
I am placing more resources into the lead gen model personally. I am sick of explaining the fact that I can literally triple their business, and have them look at me like I just asked for a loan.
Besides Its easier to rank a micro site that does not even need to be in the 7box to get leads. I don't need many, just a small amount every month will pay nicely.
and it should be mentioned that I don't like haggling and ass patting, If I wanted to deal with that shit I would have taken a corporate job kissing asses and grabbing starbucks.
With lead gen it is very simple....this lead just came in right now, pay me, call the lead now, not in ten minutes, thanks talk soon.