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How important is it to know python?

Discussion in 'General Programming Chat' started by SEOMemj, Aug 27, 2016.

  1. SEOMemj

    SEOMemj Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Harvard recently dropped PHP to add in Python. Is this a hint to a growing demand in Python programming? More importantly, is this a hint that more applications will run on Python? My understanding is that it's used in a lot of open-source projects and by a lot of tech startups.

    Right now I have a couple languages under my belt (most for front-end dev) but I do plan on getting into the security sector years from now.

    I've been studying JS pretty hardcore for the path 4-5 months and was planning on learning some backend/database languages afterward but should I pause that to learn Python?
     
  2. Malcolm Max

    Malcolm Max Regular Member

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    I don't know much about Python but I don't think I can live without PHP
     
  3. amoon

    amoon Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    there is a huge demand for python, read a lot if article about it, and I plan to learn it in near future
     
  4. Finn

    Finn Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Some automated bot system which has cost me over 3k was written in python.

    Works like a charm so I can vouch for python pretty much. :)
     
  5. Bleght

    Bleght BANNED BANNED

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    Don't stop what you've started because of something like that. If you selected JS, it couldn't really be useless. I think they are moving towards python because it's a bit more versatile and it is gaining popularity. But php is not going anywhere any time soon, there are just too many things running on php already for it to go out in a flash and there are is a lot of open source php code to be utilized out there.

    Don't vouch for python, vouch for the dev/devs who wrote it ;) Awesome stuff can be written in a wide variety of way and while some languages might have some advantages, a dev skilled at their "weapon of choice" is likely to achieve many tasks well even if there are supposed to be "better languages" for that.
     
  6. judaculla

    judaculla Regular Member

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    I'm only speaking from a novice amount of experience, but Python was super easy to learn, has a tremendous support base (stackoverflow, edx, youtube, vimeo, etc...) and is used by so many people, for so many things, that there is usually a library available for what you're trying to do. It's my understanding that Python + Django are very effective as a web/web app platform, and are actually much faster than php. When I first started learning, I spend months in C with a high degree of frustration. A week into Python and I was getting sh*t done.
     
  7. BigTroll

    BigTroll Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    I used python only once...kinda dissapointed.
     
  8. tasburrfoot

    tasburrfoot Regular Member

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    I've only used Python commercially once - outside of that it's all been RoR or PHP. I find when people are doing project evaluations, they skip Python for two reasons
    1) It's over kill - simple websites, don't need Python deployment, and PHP is much easier to plug and play than Python.
    2) It's still not C++/JAVA. Once projects are looking to be of a certain scale, they just go straight to C++ or JAVA for their large developments.

    When you look at their https://wiki.python.org/moin/OrganizationsUsingPython page, you'll see that it's typically used as a framework or a scripting resource as opposed to full scale program deployment. When I used it on the singular project I was involved with, everything was JAVA. They only needed one implementation of python, which was actually just a re-write of an already existing JAVA method about 1,500 lines in total.

    In short - I think that YES, python is something you should know if you're doing any sort of professional development, as you're going to run into it(it's the new PERL) probably have to do SOMETHING with it at some point. Is it quintessential? No, your time would be better spent focusing on JAVA, C(in all flavors, #, ++, or objective), SCALA, and PHP in my opinion.

    http://tech.co/9-demand-programming-languages-learn-2016-06
     
  9. SEOMemj

    SEOMemj Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Right now my focus is JavaScript for front-end and then some JS back-end.

    I've done some work in C#, mostly in Unity. I used Objective-C for a bit but a lot of dev's told me it's an outdated language so i stopped learning it.
     
  10. tasburrfoot

    tasburrfoot Regular Member

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    Objective C is still pretty widely used and is still one of the highest paying out there, mainly because of the iOS market and the fact that SWIFT/Obj C are the only ways to go about it. I'd say outside of the Mobile market, Obj C isn't used too much, it would be more C++ or C# - when I was attending conferences such as DEFCON, some of the larger recruiters were looking for C#/PERL.

    Ultimately, no matter what you learn - you can apply it and get paid. Don't worry about "which one is popular", remember people are still using, and paying well for PASAL, VB, and DELPHI developers.

    Searching the job market where you live will definitely turn up a massive array of opportunities. Around me, it's currently mostly ADA(hmmm), RoR, and PHP.

    If it's $$$ you want, most of the job-shop websites will post their yearly averages from the previous year for the positions that were posted.

    See: http://www.c-sharpcorner.com/article/highest-paying-programming-language-of-2016/

    Ruby, while being one of the least popular of the larger languages currently, is the highest paying(and has been for about 5/6 years since the Twitter explosion) prior to that it was JAVA .

    The TIOBE index(http://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/) is interesting, as they track the popularity of every Language, and it's annual rise/falls.


    TL;DR find what you're comfortable with, what you find is the most efficient for your work flow/needs, and master that. Someone, somewhere, will pay you regardless.

    Cheers.
     
  11. The Flame

    The Flame BANNED BANNED

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    Yes, C is incredibly outdated
     
  12. amoon

    amoon Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    JAVA is in the 1st position of all time, wow, well ANDROID use that language but I heard that google will change it with SWIFT in near future,
     
  13. tasburrfoot

    tasburrfoot Regular Member

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    I think it would be highly unlikely for Android to be moved to SWIFT, for a few reasons

    1) The portability is a bitch. They would have to rewrite essentially everything.
    2) It's an apple product. I don't think they would like to support their main competitor in that way.

    I could be wrong, but KOTLIN makes more sense(I've heard a lot of buzz about it, never seen it used, or even seen it period tbh) in theory and has been discussed by Google as well.

    One way or another, I think we will definitely see a strong shift from JAVA over the next few years, especially if larger tech companies such as google drop it
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2016
  14. eXtremeXYR

    eXtremeXYR Newbie

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    OP, as someone who is 4 finals away from graduating from Computer Science university I can tell you that Python is good, but the reason why you see it a lot is mostly because it's really easy to get started, hence lot of universities use it for teaching. Its syntax is nice and it's interpreted so you can quickly get up and running. That being said, Python isn't really something magical at all. The main benefit of using Python is ease of use and you can quickly write something up.

    Your decision to get involved with JS is sound I think. While many people think of JS as of an ugly, quickly written programming language back in the day, it has gained a lot of popularity and many, many updates (ES6/ES7) since. Google's V8 engine is a solid proof of that. Let's not also forget that you can use Node.js (express.js/hapi.js/meteor.js/koa.js) for backend with JS and due to it being of async nature, you can have an amazing performance (well for a single-threaded platform anyway). For example, Walmart servers are running hapi.js (that's based on node.js) and they handle the black friday traffic with ease!

    I honestly can't see why you'd want to drop JS for Python if you plan to use it for web dev. No context switching (JS on front-end, JS on back-end) is great benefit, and I don't really think you can get better performance with Python (maybe in some cases, and vice-versa). If you really want to learn something future-proof that not a ton of devs are already comfortable with, learn Golang. I bet it will pay off big time. Many companies are switching to using Golang since it's build from ground up with multi-core processors in mind and there's a lot less Golang programmers than there are Java/.NET/Python/JS ones.

    That all being said, whether you're good in Java or C# or Python or JS or Golang, you'll be good. The key here is to focus on mastering the task of problem solving, you can easily learn another language if some particular job/project requires it, but don't go on and jump on too many different things as the languages aren't important that much.
     
  15. uches12

    uches12 Regular Member

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    Python programming language is really gaining lots of attention right now because it's power.

    It is pretty easy to learn (at least to an intermediate level)
    It's a general purpose programming language (fits in practically everywhere)
    Clean, short and simple syntaxes, yet very powerful
    Built for automating web activities
    Secure

    With the daily demand out there, the need to automate stuff remotely online increases by the day, hence the need for python **.
    Python can be used for!
    web applications
    desktop apps
    very good for bot programming (especially web-related).

    So the fact is that Python is HOT...
    but if you are already learning JS Language, No Need to stop for python. Reason being that JS is as hot as python too, and will always be a useful front-end scripting language.
    They are both complementing and not competing Scripting languages.
    JS --- Front-end
    Python --- Server-side **. (backend)

    So it depends on what you really need right now... Front-end right now or Backend right now?
    ........... your answer........ determines your direction.....>


    When you have relatively mastered the JS Language, you can add up PYTHON ** to your Programing arsenal.
    Python usually goes with the Django DB so you may need that as well or if you are good with MYSQL, there might be no need for Django DB.

    All the best, and happy learning!:)
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2016
  16. abeltensor

    abeltensor Newbie

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    Python is extremely good for backend programming as well as whitehat/greyhat/blackhat hacking/security. I would say that it is worth learning python at some point because it is such good language to learn in general. Yes, it's a good first language but that doesn't mean you can't pick it up later for other things like making web crawlers and spiders. The way I approach programming personally and professionally is to learn as many languages as I can, though after learning my 4th or 5th language it was pretty easy to learn the rest that I know rather quickly. Python really is a nice language if you want to put a notch on your programming belt because it has such a large community and it also can run at a lower level than some of the other popular languages. It also has a relatively small core which makes it very quick and easy to learn.
     
  17. derekxec

    derekxec Registered Member

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    Python is just a tool like any other language. If you have a few languages under your belt already, learning a new one is pretty much just syntax. Don't pause anything to learn it! It's like picking a big spoon over a small spoon, sometimes you need a big one for the job and sometimes you need a small one. You wouldn't give up small spoons just because you seen a big one would you? If you find a need for it then it's good to add it to your tool belt.
     
  18. 0xxi3

    0xxi3 Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Python is a backend/database language in this sense. Just as almost every other programming language it has libraries that allow it to interact with databases, run socket connections and do anything else you might come up with.

    Actually, Harvard should've dropped PHP years ago, Python is one of the best languages to start learn programming. It's forgiving, has easy syntax, very wide support, and enormous community. It's just fun to code with. In my opinion it's one of the most satisfying object-oriented languages. If you know JS, learning Python won't be so hard, maybe confusing at first.

    Now, I'll probably sound like a grumpy grandpa, but take this advice. Don't bother with learning new languages unless it's necessary. Read a couple of books on algorithms instead. It will make you a much better programmer in the long run, because once you get more experienced learning a new language won't be harder than getting around new syntax and compiler.
     
  19. abeltensor

    abeltensor Newbie

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    I agree complete. Some of the best books for learning how to program don't really teach you a specific language. The pragmatic programmer is one that comes to mind immediately.

    Also, python is really good for penetration and security. a good book on python and security is blackhat python.
     
  20. living2xl

    living2xl Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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