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Free Will - Does Anything Like That Exist ?

Discussion in 'BlackHat Lounge' started by xrfanatic, Mar 9, 2013.

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  1. xrfanatic

    xrfanatic Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    Hey Blackhatters,

    I today came across ShadeDream's thread about mathematics in nowadays world located here:

    http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackhat-seo/blackhat-lounge/540344-math-necessary-todays-world.html

    and this has triggered in my mind something I have thought about few months back and thought I would open thread about it here.

    What triggered my mind was the fact there are lots of people who try to learn different things, maths other subjects and it simply does not go so quickly/effectively comparing to other people who have better predispositions for learning specific things and vice versa.

    There are lots of aspects, factors which form our personality and ability to acquire information more or less effectively throughout our entire life.

    I came across this lecture by Sam Harris about "free will" and being honest I'm glad I found out theres someone else who shares my point of view in that matter.


    I'm sharing this here with you guys and would like to hear what is your oppinion on matter of free will.


    Apologies for Polish subtites, but this is the version I found on youtube which strictly focuses on Free will part what is the topic of this thread, I hope it does not make a lot difference since the value is in the audio.





    So do you guys believe in something like Free Will ? Does anything like that even exist ?
     
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    Last edited by a moderator: May 18, 2016
  2. ShadeDream

    ShadeDream Elite Member

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    I've just watched the video and I find it quite interesting though at the same time I believe that it is much more complicated then that. Yes we don't choose our gender, we don't choose where we're born, and we don't choose a whole lot of other things but you can't single these out and factualize theories. This world is a crazy place but in order to make such assumptions you have to consider all factors and there's a lot of them. Take for example near death experiences, theories would suggest that there is something beyond the mind. If that's the case, then maybe all those thoughts appear from that place? You could argue that this suggests even further that our free will is not so free, but how do you know that this place isn't on a whole different level of understanding in which you make decisions on a level we can't comprehend?

    It's interesting that you've brought this topic up, especially that I've watched Cloud Atlas just a couple of hours ago.

    If we stop for a moment we realize that our brains take in a lot of information every second, the letters on the screen, the colors, the environment around you, all of your past memories, and pretty much anything and everything that goes on and around us. This probably causes neurons or whatever it is that works in our brains to fire up and down all sorts of information, and as it does this, on a subconscious level we think about (sift through) everything we've seen, everything we've heard, and our conscious thoughts are those things that our conscious mind catches based on what we're doing what we have planned or just randomly as neurons fire through these past experiences and information that is always around us. This doesn't mean that we have no free will, it's quite the opposite. This would mean that all our actions and our conscious thoughts are somewhat based on all our experiences. Our thoughts create who we are on a level we can't comprehend.

    I'm kind of tired, hopefully that somewhat makes some sense. It's just a small viewpoint from my side. Of course, none of this is set in stone.
     
  3. bryzoned

    bryzoned Newbie

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    Video seems to be that long. Will watch later.
     
  4. PinguSpy

    PinguSpy Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Sam Harris... I respect him before but not now..
    Because I'm relive that, he always try to make "everything" looks simple +nothing special..
    The way he talk like the answer of the universe and everything is already been known.

    While scientist right now still struggle with quantum/consciousnes/etc/etc and etc/ and stuff.
     
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  5. DownTheRabbitHole

    DownTheRabbitHole BANNED BANNED

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    I need a tl;dr version. 34 minutes is far too long!

    But without watching it.. yes I believe in free will. Absolutely.
    This doesn't mean that we don't cater to our primal needs and impulses . food, water, shelter, starting a family.. It's all genetically ingrained into our sense of wanting and need of fulfillment to further the species. That doesn't mean, however, that we don't make our own choices at each and every moment.

    Look. I just stopped typing for 5 seconds. Now, 7 seconds. Who made that decision? I did!

    How is that not free will? :)
     
  6. ShadeDream

    ShadeDream Elite Member

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    It's deeper then that and it kind of makes sense once you watch the whole video. I know it's long so do what you want. ;)
     
  7. USProxyKing

    USProxyKing Regular Member

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    Lets say we have someone who is addicted to hard drugs for years.

    Does this person have free will?

    Yes. At one point he was not addicted, but made a choice.

    Free Will is in our ability to choose. Now, we don't know all the facts, but when we've made a decision and carried it out, there is a price. Lets say that a bad choice results in a slide (The Fall). When you're sliding (or Falling), it is usually in a downward motion, right? How deep is the slide, or the Fall? We certainly hope not far. But,"It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to."

    "As Above; So Below" or "On Earth as in Heaven"

    Where do you make choices? With your mind. Hear voices? Yes, everyone does, it's the yin/yang. Good vs Evil. Dark vs Light. Daniel vs Goliath? But know this, "I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the LORD, do all these things. (Isaiah 45:7)"

    I look at life as a Guantlet, repeated every day. And if you say you want to be a dark person, you really need to educate yourself (and believe me, you will).


    When you hurt others, you really hurt yourself. I think the word selfish means Sell Fish (fish =Pisces = Jesus = "You sold your Jesus and now who is going to keep satan at bay?"). Some people learn quickly, some very slowly. But all return to the source. Hell is a prison of your mind. You were judged guilty because you made the mistake of judging someone else guilty. Learn, Grow. Evolve. Stop fighting what is right. But there is a battle! What do you need? You need to learn! Best things to learn? Research what is going on RIGHT NOW in your life and in your mind. There is a reason for the phrase "Curiosity killed the cat".. Be Kurios :)

    Most wisdom/learning comes by experiences you've had. That's why we have exp bar's in a game.

    But the highest form of wisdom/learning is through other people's experiences.

    Ever hear the scottish hymn "I'll take the high road and you take the low road; and we'll meet together at the end!"

    Life is beyond beautiful. Become aware of what you truly want. If you say "First. Be slow to speak. Quick to list!


    "Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends." - Gandalf :)


    Stone walls do not a prison make,Nor iron bars a cage;Minds innocent and quiet takeThat for a hermitage.If I have freedom in my love,And in my soul am free,Angels alone, that soar above,Enjoy such liberty.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2013
  8. antsaoo

    antsaoo Supreme Member

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    Truth is there is no good or evil. If i kill someone, someone else will get better cance of surviving. The energy your dead body stores will give some plants better chance to live longer and so on. on Atom level we are all the same, there is no plants animals , rocks or human. only protons and neutrons

    Its hard to know if free will exist, no one can tell if everything we do has been decided already. Some scientist had theory that there is another universe which's time goes backwards or something like that.

    Few times i have done ayahuasca or shrooms i have had good though about my past, memories from 10-15 years ago. These days i wonder if those moments ever existed or has this all been one big lie, that much time is hard to comprehend IMO , not to mention some people have lived 2-3 times more than I.
     
  9. ShadeDream

    ShadeDream Elite Member

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