Errr...I don't feel right doing this...

So, er, usually I'm quite decisive in my SEO efforts. I act very quickly. I don't have periods of hesitation. I don't let any negative feelings influence my work.

But after Penguin and a lot of my sites getting hit, half my income wiped out, I've been feeling a bit sick lately. Maybe some of you can relate. Even though I tell myself I must keep testing in order to crack it, and to stay positive, for some reason my body and brain is not following. I feel like my stress/cortisol levels in my body are up all the time, I've done a few tests but none of them conclusive.

My most recent one is on page related. To completely "de-optimize" or, more accurately, "pessimize" my websites that have been hit. Everything from meta tags to keyword density. Even though those sites are getting near 0 traffic now, (pre penguin average was 300 visitors a day for each site, ouch) I feel just fucking WRONG going in and ruining my sites like this. I know it's the nature of everything, but how can something that was so awesome and 'correct' SEO one day, be completely wrong the next. My brain almost doesn't want to process it. Remove keyword in meta description ?!?! ===> BRAIN OVERLOAD
Remove keywords from article?!?!?!? ===> 1 month ago I would have thought you were heavily drunk or retarded to suggest such a thing. Now I have to do that on sites that used to earn me hundreds per month each. I am seeing sites with thin content, very basic english perhaps not written by native speakers, no exact keywords in meta tags, adsense and affiliate links everywhere. Of course I wasn't retarded, I kept my kw density reasonable, in fact I felt I did everything "correct". I was so fucking proud of myself. Also I love xrumer. Now I am forced to do the most RETARDED shit ever like remove keywords from my site, remove everything that could possibly reasonably conceivably have any positive effect on my site, and make links like "hey guys click here" and "http://myphaggotsite.com" and "http://www.myphaggotsite.com" and "check it out guys look at this amazing resource" . And waste all my links and spamming power?!?!

I don't usually ask for it but I guess I am in need of a bit of moral support from people who may be going through the same thing. I will let everyone know the results of my tests and if I don't find conclusive results on how to solve this shit I am seriously quitting SEO. Yes I would have to go into PPC and give money to G, it's what they want. I would feel like the biggest little bitch if I did that, I would feel a mixture of shame and anger that I might need some tranquilizers to keep me from punching the wall.

P.S. FUCK MATT CUNTS

Ya fuck him in his stupid ass with a rotten donkey cock.

Diversify, diversify, diversify.

If you have all of your eggs in one basket, you leave yourself
open to these kinds of things happening. It is always best to
create multiple streams of income through various ventures.

I learned that the hard way . . .

"Wiz"

I don't think de-optimization is the way to go. The core of Google's algorithms didn't change, once the robot will visit your website it will still look after on-page SEO.

Penguin is just something they run from time to time, and according to what we see its far from perfect for now. You cant fight a buggy algorithm, switch to other streams of traffic meanwhile. How about FB, Twitter, Pinterest? Forums?

With regards to keyword density in pages:

That's a bit of a myth. So long as the article looks 'natural' and isn't "US plumbers have long been US plumbers ever since the British plumbers moved to the US to become US plumbers" - then it doesn't matter if it's 2% density or 20% density on the page. Just make it look natural. Sometimes having a short bit of text with the keyword lots of times is the most 'natural' thing.

The big G is trying to play on our intelligence, as WizGizmo said, we all need to create multiple streams of traffic and income.

I wouldn't remove your keyword from your site.

I reduced the number of times I mentioned my keyword, but I didn't eliminate it.

When I got hit with penguin on April 24th, I felt so sick to my stomach, I don't think I ate for three days.

You have one month or so until the next update, hopefully your site will come out of penguin after the next refresh.

p.s. whats up with the demi lovato video?

Google is playing mind games with you. I would try 301'ing some domains. I would also get new ones and XRUMER/SB the heck out of them. They have not killed blog comment/xrum spam. Not even close. Just about the opposite IMO.

From everything I've read and experienced, I've come to the conclusion that onsite seo isn't affecting much of anything these days. There might be a small argument for "over" optimization but I'm doubtful.

Chances are you may have to leave your old domains behind although I've seen and heard of 301'ing working...at least for awhile and in some cases still going just fine. Stop that deoptimizing shit and test some 301's. Other than that, throw your junk out there on new domains and backlink it like crazy.

Take some B complex vitamins for stress and stop bitching. Sooner you fight back, sooner your income comes back.

Good luck to you,
Con

P.S. I'm NOT buying this diversification of links and anchor shit either. I've seen ZERO proof of it. I AM BUYING and have totally promoted diversification of income streams!!! Let this be your "ah ha moment" for IM. Tell yourself that you will NEVER AGAIN be wiped out by some algo change because from this day forward you will diversify your income. It's not easy...but that's good news...cuz if it was everybody would do it :biggthump

conrulez said:

Google is playing mind games with you. I would try 301'ing some domains. I would also get new ones and XRUMER/SB the heck out of them. They have not killed blog comment/xrum spam. Not even close. Just about the opposite IMO.

From everything I've read and experienced, I've come to the conclusion that onsite seo isn't affecting much of anything these days. There might be a small argument for "over" optimization but I'm doubtful.

Chances are you may have to leave your old domains behind although I've seen and heard of 301'ing working...at least for awhile and in some cases still going just fine. Stop that deoptimizing shit and test some 301's. Other than that, throw your junk out there on new domains and backlink it like crazy.

Take some B complex vitamins for stress and stop bitching. Sooner you fight back, sooner your income comes back.

Good luck to you,
Con

Click to expand...

I was hit by the first penguin on April 24th and recovered on the 1.1 refresh. So you could wait a month and see what happens...

i got hit by the latest penguin 1.1 on one of my websites, so i feel your pain!!!
my home page has dropped from no 3, to no where but my inner urls are where they used to be, is that strange?
im doing the same as you taking out most of my keywords and adding stupid "click here" backlinks that seem like a waste of money, but i dont know what else to try!
im going to look up about the 301'ing and maybe give that try

one thing ive noticed though, my serp trackers are showing the correct results for my other domains but for this one dropped domain it shows results like 35, 144, 20 etc but the domain is actually no where to be found,
is that weird?
im using serpfox, se scout, micro site masters

@zb.ouykcuf, thank you for your useful comment, actually those matt cunts insults make me feel better, I think we should make a thread full of them for us to at least write down some good ol' vitriol about this annoying square jawed cunt. this is BLACK HAT world after all.

@WizGizmo, I always thought you were a cool guy, no homo. Just some of the shit you say makes you seem quite old and wise. Maybe you're just a young guy who's been through a lot or you're actually old and experienced, but either way you're right. I do have a small shop which makes me a regular income aside from IM, that was my 'diversification'. But it's not really that scalable compared to SEO, and it's only there to pay the bills. If I could sort SEO out, I could reach my golden goal of 10,000$ a month on SEO alone. In fact, if penguin had not hit, I would be at around $4000 a month already. Now I am just $1500. A big hit. I've put so much work into SEO, my brain is fried. Maybe my head is burnt out. Lately even before the penguin update I was just not doing any work as the xrumers on my 2 vps spammed the hell out of my sites and got them to 1st page. It was pretty fun getting up only to load the comments and project file and linkslist into xrumer, then pressing start and leaving it, to go back to sleep while my money increased. It took a lot of work but I guess that's the Black Hat dream. I was happy about my sites winning but didn't have much energy to jump around, even when I went from 0$ to $1000, which was crazy for me. Link building is all I know and my best skill, I feel if I give it up I would put myself back in the bottom 5% when I might have been nearer the top if I had kept going. However, in the end, yes, I was planning to diversify with paid traffic, but not until I saved some good amount of money on SEO so that I can afford to lose a bit at the start of PPC.

@kmvcable, I agree with you on the matt cunts snitching thread, people (myself included) become like deer in headlights when it comes to their sites dropping. Now Blackhat world seriously sounds like WF. How do I de-optimize this, REMOVE keywords, REMOVE links, use bullshit anchor links, etc. Yes, I am doing this as part of my tests to see what da fuck is up with this algorithm and what exactly trips the penalties. But at the same time I am taking the spam to a new level. If that doesn't work for me then I can safely bow out with honor, at least knowing I did more than 99% of people. And rest assured that my spamming resources are not sitting idle. One has 2 instances of SB running separate 1 million lists each, 100% of CPU used, and the other has hrefer on 1000 threads. I do fear sometimes. I fear that there is no solution to this. I fear that I will not be able to get rich and live my dreams. For example I want to buy a house, something that matt cunts probably already has. Simple things. I want to live in Japan for a while and dedicate my life to banging as many hot young j-girls as possible, maybe WizGizmo can come along with me because he seems way cool. (If he has a gf/wife, don't worry Wiz, just don't tell her, cheating is fine, Google does it all the time) Also I told this dude from the forum a long time ago by the name of Micallef that we would meet in the far east to bang hot chicks if I ever make it. I wonder how he is doing with the algo update as he is a well versed spammer. Apart from travelling the world banging hot chicks (something which matt cunts could never do unless he paid prostitutes to jump on his wang which is probably bent at a 90 degree right angle just like his jaw) I would like to have a secure family. I know I should diversify etc. but I have put a lot of work into this and it would be a great loss if it failed. But there comes a point where you have nothing to lose. As I said I am ramping up the spam, because despite my fears, the work I do doesn't entail having fears like being a WF pussy. For example, when I first started spamming hardcore 6 months ago, I was a bit scared. What if G deindexed my site? What if people complained about my spamming? and so on... But I did it anyway, balls to the wall. I vowed in my desperate situation that I would spam with all my god given might , that I would nuke the internet with my link seed, until my entire link database was whored out, then I would find new places to put links.

At that point, however, I may just quit, or if there are only a few sites above mine, try slamming them with SB. I never thought I would do this, but maybe this is just part of normal everyday SEO now! But so often the sites above me are amazon, consumersearch, consumerreports etc., which I don't think would be penalized with any amount of links, in my opinion.


@lancis, this could very well be the case. De optimization could all be bullshit and rumor, but I must test it as kw density and meta tags are major variables which could possibly (or not) affect a site's ranking / trigger a penalty. They are just another variable that I test. I don't assume anything until I see concrete results. As above, I was planning to switch from SEO to PPC but not until I get a good base of money for PPC. Now my diversification plan is missing the SEO money if I can't solve this penguin crap.


@manny, I'm not removing keywords from all of my sites, just 2 of them, testing different variables independently to see which, if any, caused a penalty. I felt sick on the first update, I improved in the next few weeks but it's come back now. I doubt my sites will come back after the next refresh, if anything they will get worse, and maybe my others will get hit. Penguin seems to be a punitive update. If I keep my other sites the same, the only way for them is down. I posted the demi lovato video because that song reflects how I feel and also I would very much like her to sit on my face (without her pants on). But if I had to choose between demi lovato sitting on my face and me chomping on her vagine, and the penguin update never existing at all, I would choose the latter. Yes my friends, that's how much I want this update to go away.


@conrulez, interesting ideas, thanks for your input. I am considering doing a 301 and starting again, yes. From my vantage point, it seems that they have actually killed XR/SB spam , because I was spamming hard with both and penguin has raped my sites. I fear the method you are talking about, i.e SB/XR spamming the 301s, allows the link power to flow through but not any penalty for shitty links, but how long that will be before the loophole is closed up is probably not long, especially since the method is now public on BHW and G reads everything on this forum. Me too, I have seen ZERO proof of ANYTHING in this update: anchor text diversification, link diversification, etc etc, all these variables that all these tutorials, like that recent SENuke one, talking as if they somehow 'know' this update when really NO one does, I don't buy any of them. That's why I need to TEST , experiment like a scientist to see what da fuck is up. Cheers for your encouragement and insight bro it's much appreciated.


@Santa Claus, I watch that commercial frequently. But at the same time it's hard to take that I have "failed". One algo change and I am a failure. Before it I felt like some hotshot spammer. Nowhere near the viagra pharma level but still pretty OK. Now I am just another blaster who can't rank a site for shit.

Anyway, I will let everyone know the results in a month's time when the refresh comes. Gulp.

I'm not doing any seo for a while. I disappeared from the serps during penguin for good keywords but now I'm back in. The only thing I will be doing to my site for a while is updating and adding new content. I will also keep making use of social media, bing ads, and offline marketing. Funny thing that happened today. I checked one of my sites that I haven't touched in years and totally ignored, and it's in the serps for excellent keywords. Go and figure.

best of luck to you, i hope this works out in the end and you find a solution...

google bot is an algorithm and all math problems have solutions, it will take time to figure this one out...

redrubies said:

I'm not doing any seo for a while. I disappeared from the serps during penguin for good keywords but now I'm back in. The only thing I will be doing to my site for a while is updating and adding new content. I will also keep making use of social media, bing ads, and offline marketing. Funny thing that happened today. I checked one of my sites that I haven't touched in years and totally ignored, and it's in the serps for excellent keywords. Go and figure.

Click to expand...

this is one thing i forgot to put in my thread about what I did the month after penguin 1.0 hit, i added a shit load of new articles...i probably added over 300 blog posts after i got hit the first time...

@jb2008...No I wasn't talking about spamming the 301's (although that has successfully been done too). I mean hitting hard with both Xrum and SB at BRAND NEW sites. And yes, directly at $ site. I'm willing to bet you had plenty of other links pointing at your sites that got whacked huh, not just xrumer links? Although nothing would surprise me...

Personally, I don't believe there is just one general algo...I've NEVER believed that. I mean a different algo besides the OBVIOUS fact that google treats the "big dogs" differently. I have no proof, of course, but I've seen too many weird things over the years to believe that what applies for "buy cheap viagra" also applies to "red knit sweaters for little dogs".

I think google runs "micro algos" based on who knows what (keyword traffic?... local popularity vs. global?...who knows)....but I'm convinced they do it...I've seen stuff work for low to mid traffic keywords that are "general" and then not work a lick for keywords with the same traffic that are truly "local" keywords. It's just my personal theory. But I've yet to see any proof that it's false

Nevertheless...DO NOT write off xrumer and SB by ANY MEANS. Go get a domain and POUND IT. Don't expect instant results. Hit it for two or three weeks and see where it goes.

Anyways...Good luck bro.

Con

@conrulez, Yes, I am pure Xrumer through and through. Xrumer til the death. It hurts my heart to see Xrumer getting punished. I find it morally disgusting, like killing babies or something... This one time I banged a girl for 4 hours because I could not spooge, she was hot but a bit loose, so I just kept pounding and pounding and pounding in the hope of a grand spooge. But my balls became heavy. If you take that amount of pounding, and cube it, that's how much I have POUNDED sites in the past. Safe to say I have POUNDED my sites more than the average alpha lion on the african savannah. Profiles, articles, web directories, forum posts, GBs, SB, Blogs, Wikis, Refspam, everything imaginable. I have pounded the shit out of it like there was no tomorrow. I enjoy blasting and am extremely aggressive. I know there are a lot of people who say XR doesn't work anymore. I would always say, you're not using it right. And that would be true. But at the moment, the blasting is getting sites penalized, for real. I can hammer my sites with GOOD quality links (yes I can create pretty good quality links using XR) , but they don't recover from penguin, they just get penalized MORE the more I pound them.

Previously I had done SEO on 1 site for 1 week, at a total cost of $50. That site pulled in at its height 500 visitors a day. If I had done adwords PPC it would have cost me at least 100 bucks per DAY to maintain that traffic. And that's assuming very very low CPC. The ROI for SEO was therefore very good. Now, where these excellent links that I had are getting my sites penalized i.e. doing the exact polar opposite of what used to happen, and with me having no idea why , or how to get out of the penalty, the ROI has crashed. I could say I am gonna fight this til the death, but the truth is, maybe it's easier to make money elsewhere than SEO right now. Before penguin, it was hard enough for me. It seems simple but getting good links and content on a massive scale cheap enough to make a nice big profit, is difficult. A lot of automation is involved and it means a lot of tricky coding and custom scripts and bots to make it happen. Sure, paid traffic may have its challenges, the main one being the obvious one, that you pay per click so you've got to watch like a hawk to make sure you don't lose more than you can afford. But if the ROI of it (not just money, your own time/effort/sanity as well) is much better than SEO, I would be stupid not to quit. When I came into SEO I was a naive newbie, I thought if I got a site to the top it would remain there for years, thus it would be an excellent source of passive income. If someone had told me of the bipolar-like algorithm updates, and the way, for example, Penguin has flipped everything on its head, and the big corporations hogging the top spots with shitty, irrelevant pages, I WOULD NEVER HAVE GONE ANYWHERE NEAR SEO. I would have gone into something that is quicker and more stable. Sure, I don't want to deal with Google let alone give them money because their algorithm beat me, but in order to beat Penguin I would probably have to build links at a cost which would be unacceptable to my revenues, in terms of both time and money. Anyone who says SEO isn't harder today, it's just "different", is bullshitting. If I had the tools I have now, 5 years ago, I would be making at least 20k a month. 10 years ago, I would probably be a millionaire. The bot I had to buy an ice pack for, I would have gone CRAZY to have such a bot before Penguin. Now, I am not so sure the links it makes will have any positive effect at all. Hell, they may even penalize my site further. If I had this bot 5 years ago, I would be a millionaire no doubt. Now, in May 2012, the bot may simply slap me further down the SERPs and back into miserable poverty.

I have vowed that if I can't find a solution to this ridiculous penalization of links which anyone could have built, cannot be solved, within 3 months, I will quit SEO. I'm not so naive as to believe 'get rich quick' schemes but as far as traffic generation (hence money making) goes, SEO is damn slow. I am wasting my life here. Out of the window, I look at all the hot young girls walking in hotpants in the summer sun outside, and I am indoors scrambling to put an ice pack under my laptop because my spamming bot will melt it otherwise, in a desperate attempt to crack an algorithm named after a fucking antarctic bird. =WASTING MY FUCKING LIFE. The hot girls outside, if I am in a good mood to socialize, I KNOW I can get them, I'm not like loser square jaw matt cunts, who couldn't get a hot young girl in hotpants no matter how much cash Google pays him, because he is square jawed and SO DAMN BORING. That's the frustrating thing, but until I can get a good income so that I can have some security, I will be wasting my life forever. I think maybe I got in it too late. If nowadays SEO is ratting on your competitors like a little bitch and matt cunts laughing as he ruins another small business and puts more amazon links on the 1st page, I'm done. Even if that means having to use Adwords. I'm a blackhatter, I will do all that is in my power to get clicks for bottom, bargain basement prices such that I don't even notice the cost. I have learnt a lot from SEO even if I was a bit too late for the pot of gold at the end. I sure will miss my Xrumer. She will gather dust on my PC, no more use for her. We were so close. You know, I vowed that once I reach 100k, I would get the Xrumer logo tattooed somewhere on my arm or chest. Now I guess that will never happen.

My end goals were paid traffic (PPC) and emailing by the end. But I wanted to have a good cushion to fund it, and have some left over for emergencies and stuff. I guess I won't have such a big cushion and after all this link penalizing phaggotry, it may be time to move on if I can't find a solution quickly.