Ebay/Paypal buyer protection program

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oatmeal

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Can anyone explain how this works?
If I sold something for $20 and then say 45 days later the buyer
opens a case claiming they did not receive anything, does the ebay
or paypal buyer protection program automatically take the $20 out of
my account and return it to the buyer against my will?

Or does that $20 come from some insurance company and I, the seller, can
keep the $20 still but may get banned etc.?
 
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oatmeal said:
If I sold something for $20 and then say 45 days later the buyer
opens a case claiming they did not receive anything, does the ebay
or paypal buyer protection program automatically take the $20 out of
my account and return it to the buyer against my will
Click to expand...

1. Once the buyer makes a claim, ebay or paypal put put the funds on hold until the claim is resolved.

2. If buyer claims that they did not receive anything but you have delivery confirmation you will win 99% of the cases. That is the one thing that eBay will side with you against most scammers.

3. Bigger problem is if buyer receives something and files a SNAD claim. If buyer makes a SNAD claim, you make the buyer return the item to you before you refund. If the buyer does not return, you win the case.

The only good that "seller protection" does for you is if buyer somehow wins a claim after not returning the merchandise and the seller follows eBay/Paypal policy TO THE LETTER. Any deviance from eBay/Paypal policy voids your seller protection.
 
Thanks. But recently I had sold a small priced item (only about $8 + $5 shipping so around 13 bucks), and I had tracking number by FedEx that confirms delivery was made successfully. The buyer though told me he never received anything. He left a negative and I told ebay, gave them the tracking number, nobody responded or resolved my case after 20 days.
 
Since Ebay owns paypal, what happens if I decide to close my paypal account before a buyer opens a claim to take money from me that ebay/paypal will most certain award the buyer and not the seller? Is it possible for me to first move what little money I have left in my paypal transfer to my bank account, then once the transfer is cleared, close my paypal account permanently.

Will this prevent ebay/paypal from being able to take money from me? Or will they somehow take it from my actual bank account (which I don't think is possible...they would have to I guess go to law enforcement to forcibly get funds from me, but I doubt they'd do that for just $20 or even $100).
 
oatmeal said:
Thanks. But recently I had sold a small priced item (only about $8 + $5 shipping so around 13 bucks), and I had tracking number by FedEx that confirms delivery was made successfully. The buyer though told me he never received anything. He left a negative and I told ebay, gave them the tracking number, nobody responded or resolved my case after 20 days.
Click to expand...

Call to a eBay rep will resolve this in most situation.
 
oatmeal said:
Is it possible for me to first move what little money I have left in my paypal transfer to my bank account, then once the transfer is cleared, close my paypal account permanently.

Will this prevent ebay/paypal from being able to take money from me?
Click to expand...


I'm pretty sure when you signed up for paypal, you agreed to let them take the negative paypal balance from your bank account even after paypal account is closed
 
toml3030 said:
I'm pretty sure when you signed up for paypal, you agreed to let them take the negative paypal balance from your bank account even after paypal account is closed
Click to expand...

Aha, really? So then they can still take money out of my main bank account after I close paypal and some outstanding buyer claims open up?

So, what if I clean out my bank account too? Then there's 0 money in my bank account. 0 money in my paypal account which I close...then what? Will they still pursue the money? I have other bank accounts that I can just move the money to so that neither my bank account associated with paypal AND the paypal account itself, will have any money left. Would that work?
 
toml3030 said:
I'm pretty sure when you signed up for paypal, you agreed to let them take the negative paypal balance from your bank account even after paypal account is closed
Click to expand...

That's not true, well, not perfectly true. I don't know what their TOS says but they cannot snatch it from your bank account. Especially if your bank account doesn't allow your balance to go negative. I recommend adding new account (pre-paid card) to your account and removing your bank account.
 
OutOfTown said:
That's not true, well, not perfectly true. I don't know what their TOS says but they cannot snatch it from your bank account.
Click to expand...

actually they can, via ACH transfer

from Paypal user agreement

3.5 Bank Transfers. When Instant Transfer, eCheck, Pay After Delivery or a debit card is used as your Payment Method, or when you initiate an Add Funds transaction, you are requesting an electronic transfer from your bank account. For these transactions, PayPal will make electronic transfers via ACH from your bank account in the amount you specify. You agree that such requests constitute your authorization to PayPal to make the transfers. Once you have provided your authorization for the transfer, you will not be able to cancel the electronic transfer. For Pay After Delivery transactions please see Section 3.15. You give PayPal the right to resubmit any ACH debit you authorized that is returned for insufficient or uncollected funds.
 
oatmeal said:
Aha, really? So then they can still take money out of my main bank account after I close paypal and some outstanding buyer claims open up?

So, what if I clean out my bank account too? Then there's 0 money in my bank account. 0 money in my paypal account which I close...then what? Will they still pursue the money? I have other bank accounts that I can just move the money to so that neither my bank account associated with paypal AND the paypal account itself, will have any money left. Would that work?
Click to expand...

The only way to make sure you can't get charged back is if you close the account. They can snatch your money via ACH transfer and leave you with negative balance if account doesn't have the funds.
 
toml3030 said:
actually they can, via ACH transfer

from Paypal user agreement

3.5 Bank Transfers. When Instant Transfer, eCheck, Pay After Delivery or a debit card is used as your Payment Method, or when you initiate an Add Funds transaction, you are requesting an electronic transfer from your bank account. For these transactions, PayPal will make electronic transfers via ACH from your bank account in the amount you specify. You agree that such requests constitute your authorization to PayPal to make the transfers. Once you have provided your authorization for the transfer, you will not be able to cancel the electronic transfer. For Pay After Delivery transactions please see Section 3.15. You give PayPal the right to resubmit any ACH debit you authorized that is returned for insufficient or uncollected funds.
Click to expand...

I'm trying to twist that around to read as you're suggesting, but it doesn't. Essentially, it reads if the money isn't in your bank account it can resubmit the transfer if needed. Uncollected funds fall both under 'collection' & 'funds that were not collected from a previous transfer'.
 
OutOfTown said:
I'm trying to twist that around to read as you're suggesting, but it doesn't. Essentially, it reads if the money isn't in your bank account it can resubmit the transfer if needed. Uncollected funds fall both under 'collection' & 'funds that were not collected from a previous transfer'.
Click to expand...

Except that authorized ACH transfers will in most cases will be paid out by the bank and turn your account negative.
 
toml3030 said:
Except that authorized ACH transfers will in most cases will be paid out by the bank and turn your account negative.
Click to expand...

I've never seen nor heard of this happening specifically with paypal. Do you have any sources I can check?
 
OutOfTown said:
I've never seen nor heard of this happening specifically with paypal. Do you have any sources I can check?
Click to expand...

1. I used to work for a bank. ATM withdrawals and PIN based debit card purchases can not cause an overdraft but checks, non-pin debit purchases, bill pay services and pre authorized ACH transfers will be paid out for small amounts, as a courtesy by the banks because it's a nice source of profit for them (It costs the bank $0.25 to process ACH transfers but they get to charge you $35 overdraft fees)

2. This situation (paypal causing negative balance at bank) specifically happened to me in the last stealth account I created.
 
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