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Anyone into nootropics?

Discussion in 'BlackHat Lounge' started by ShadeDream, May 31, 2012.

  1. ShadeDream

    ShadeDream Elite Member

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    I recently found out about "Pramiracetam" and found the whole subject on nootropics quite interesting. I was wondering if anyone here has any experience with these?

    Here's a video with some basic information for those that may be interested:

     
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  2. eloquenceeee

    eloquenceeee Regular Member

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    Tried aniracetam for two months and didn't notice much. Supplemented it with the choline citrate.

    -shrug- Could just be me
     
  3. ShadeDream

    ShadeDream Elite Member

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    What kind of dosage did you take it at?
     
  4. florflor

    florflor Senior Member

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    Sure, I've been using something called NZT-48, it's pretty amazing! Do you want some? ;)

    On a serious note, I found a good forum on this, guys who are constantly testing weird supplements on themselves but I don't have the url handy right now.

    I believe NZT is based on a real drug used to keep you awake without feeling tired at all. I forget the name of it. edit: search for Modafinil Modafinil. Also search for "Nuvigil/Provigil".
     
  5. illfounded21

    illfounded21 Senior Member

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    I have heard some bad stories about modafinil... might be unjust though.
     
  6. kingbrend

    kingbrend Regular Member Premium Member

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    Oxiracetame worked well for me. Add in some ALCAR, choline and fish oil with a healthy diet and exercise and I'm golden.
     
  7. FunkyWaltz

    FunkyWaltz Junior Member

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    Whoa very interesting. Just being put on Trileptal for Manic Depression, I'm curious to some of these over the counter substances now.
     
  8. ShadeDream

    ShadeDream Elite Member

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    I don't know about NZT but Provigil is damn expensive and not easy to source.
     
  9. [Bender]

    [Bender] Registered Member

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    I have expertimented with nootropics quite a bit. I've tried piracetam, pramiracetam, supplemented with Alpha-GPC, vinpocetine, ginkgo biloba.

    Verdict: Ginkgo = useless. I was not able to determine if vinpocetine was useful on it's own, since I combined it with racetams, it did not seem interesting enough to continue experimentation.

    Both piracetam and pramiracetam are very interesting. When choosing an acetylcholine precursor please consider Alpha-GPC, it is definitely worth every penny. Choline bitartrate, citrate and lecithin are not very bioavailable.

    To get the maximum effects of racetams you have to keep taking them for at least a month, while ajdusting your dose. Different people find the peak of the effects at different dosages in terms of mg/kg. With racetams the relation of the dosage to the effects are a bell curve - there is an optimal dose - the further you lower or increase it, the less efficient the nootropic will be. Also, some people respond to some racetams better than others - so if after a month you have felt no effects, you can try switching racetams.

    What you can expect to experience once the racetams start having effect is heightened perception of sound and vision (including to more saturated colors), more intricate abstract thinking, using a much wider vocabulary than you usually do, one gets the impression the perfect words just magically roll of the tongue, faster reflexes, heightened spacial perception (try playing table tennis :p). You can develop very good visual memory (for example I tried to close my eyes and remember my great grandmother's house and I could vividly remember details of the yard, the house, her face, etc).

    There are also neutral/negative effects (based on your personal judgement) - you can get utterly emotionless and calculating, in nootropics communities it's often called the "Spock feeling". You can get very irritable, people annoy you by engaging in pointless babbling (or at least that's how you percieve it). Your dreams can become extremely lucid and you remember details - this is espacially the case if you take large doses before going to sleep. But bear in mind, for some people piracetam can have a slight stimulant effect, making it a little hard to fall asleep (note this has nothing to do with the nerulogical mechanisms involved with amphetamines, caffeine or other CNS stimulants).

    If you do not supplement with enough Alpha-GPC (or other ACh precursor) you can get headaches or experience sleepiness, which cannot be aided by aspirin/caffeine respectively.

    As for pramiracetam, it must be noted that it's much more powerful and it is best cycled every other day. The other thing I used to do is take a small dose of piracetam - ~800mg and like 100mg of pramiracetam. In terms of effects, pramiracetam appears to emphasize on abstract thinking and emotionlessness (it's a word, I checked) more so than piracetam, but it seems to lack some of it's other effects, like increased dream recall and ehnanced verbal skills.

    PLEASE NOTE: Racetams do very little for motivation. If that is your goal, some people claim temporary success with Modafinil. However, bear in mind these simple supplements are not magic pills, they will not make you a genius or something. If you put work in changing how your mind works, or want to develop some kind of mental skill or just need a little boost - they will be in your aid, if used properly and patiently.

    Racetams have been studied for many years now, they are extremely safe pharmacologically. Please note, they may diminish any alcohol tolerance you may have built over the years, so be careful. All in all, it would be a bad idea to do a lot of drinking or marijuana smoking while on a nootropic stack.

    Another note, if you chose to take ALCAR, please don't forget to supplement it with anti-oxidants.

    Imminst (immortality institute) has a rather large forum on Nootropics, I suggest you read up there, if you are interested, since it's one of the few places (i've seen) where people with neurology and pharmacology training interpret scientific literature for the layman.

    I hope that helps a bit, I'll be glad to answer any other question about racetams if you have any, since I am rather fascinated by the subject myself :)
     
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    Last edited: Jun 1, 2012
  10. silentthunder

    silentthunder Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    Great post. Thanks and rep. I forgot about Piracetam. I always wanted to try Piracetam but I forgot about it. I get the gist of your explanation and I think I'll pass. I don't wanna be Spocky. Empathy and compassion are crucial. Besides, I take Chinese herbs and do chi kung and light weights. Great results with that. Still a great post though.
     
  11. codo3500

    codo3500 Regular Member

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    I use Modafinil (Provigil) when I have heaps to do. This week I done 3 days in a row with only 30-60 minutes sleep a day. Felt great, got heaps done, very motivated. I only use it when I'm super busy though so I don't build up a tolerance. You really have to remember to eat on it though.
     
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  12. [Bender]

    [Bender] Registered Member

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    Thanks, man.

    Yeah, "being Spocky" isn't quite as fun as some people might imagine. As you adequately put it, empathy and compassion are natural human traits, and that becomes very apparent to you once you get to know what it feels like to be a robot :p

    I don't know about chi kung and herbal supplementation, but my mind is open to all kinds of possibilities, since I've benefited from meditation and applying NLP techniques as well. Brainwave entrainment also had some peculiar, but noticeable effects
     
  13. [Bender]

    [Bender] Registered Member

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    That's cool. Have you tried the Indian stuff? I read there is a significant difference in efficiency across brands. Although that might just be because someone stumbled on a vendor that sold him sugar pills..
     
  14. silentthunder

    silentthunder Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    Now this I might be interested in! Hmmm... That's the Limitless drug. Don't use daily and eat with it. They finally put motivation in a bottle. Could you share your trusted vendor. pm me if you like.
     
  15. silentthunder

    silentthunder Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    Actually I practice Nei Kung. Incredible stuff.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neigong
     
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  16. ShadeDream

    ShadeDream Elite Member

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    Definitely a great post, rep plus for that. In terms of "being Spocky" is that something that happens all the time and to everyone or it doesn't have to happen? Can it be handled?
     
  17. Chris22

    Chris22 Regular Member

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    I'm toying with the idea of experimenting with noopept
     
  18. Mutikasa

    Mutikasa Power Member

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    i did in the past, but after 30 years of life I strongly believe that any supplement or drug will do you no good in the long run, as a matter of fact it will do worse. It's just not the way the nature works and your brain is 100% natural. You CANNOT skip the steps on the ladder!
    If u want more creativity and intelligence train your brain to form new neuron connections and live healthy.
     
  19. techcrunked

    techcrunked Regular Member

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    damn! didnt know jack about this stuff until this post. any advice for newbies who wanna dabble in some racetams?
     
  20. moeatwa

    moeatwa Regular Member

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    What Mutikasa said... Even if you don't build up a tolerance, you build a psychological dependency (or at least, I did)...

    Not to be a total movie nerd but do you remember what Bradley Cooper did there at the end of Limitless? He stopped taking NZT altogether because he managed to alter his neural pathways pernamently...