Back Link Diagram Tutorial

[blackieman]

Hi JV,

Yes, I agree with you. Sniper sites would be easier to set up, but they cannot expand. Sniper sites would be easy to do links for - you can do an exact phrase submit to directories, and since the phrase matches your domain name, it would likely not be penalized for bombing that phrase.

I can definitely see the merit of your approach for larger sites.

Thanks for a VERY informative thread.

 

[donjuan]

Hi JV,

Yes, I agree with you. Sniper sites would be easier to set up, but they cannot expand. Sniper sites would be easy to do links for - you can do an exact phrase submit to directories, and since the phrase matches your domain name, it would likely not be penalized for bombing that phrase.

I can definitely see the merit of your approach for larger sites.

Thanks for a VERY informative thread.

are you referring to google sniper method?

 

[Riposte]

Instead of linking the web 2.0 properties to one another, wouldn't it be more effective to build a large number of links directly to the web 2.0 sites from other sources?

That way, at least it seems to me, you avoid leaving an obvious footprint and also considerably boost the link juice for each web 2.0 property much more.

Obviously this is working for you, so I'm not trying to demean the layout in any way. It's just that the footprint seems so obvious.

 

[blackieman]

@donjuan - yes, I am referring to google sniper method. His method is an expansion of that were there are multiple pages to rank for, not a single one. But otherwise similar.

@Riposte - I have studied Linkwheel (what you are talking about) and like you, I am uncomfortable implementing something like that. I read somewhere that goog has some amazing network visualization software which I am sure is available to manual reviewers. They can in an instant figure out what is going on. So the linkwheel-type strategy is not for me as a longer term player.

 

[donjuan]

@donjuan - yes, I am referring to google sniper method. His method is an expansion of that were there are multiple pages to rank for, not a single one. But otherwise similar.

@Riposte - I have studied Linkwheel (what you are talking about) and like you, I am uncomfortable implementing something like that. I read somewhere that goog has some amazing network visualization software which I am sure is available to manual reviewers. They can in an instant figure out what is going on. So the linkwheel-type strategy is not for me as a longer term player.

Indeed I am no fan of the linkwheel method or any method that utilizes complete the circle linking. I am reading the google sniper method now.

 

[blackieman]

Goog sniper is great. When matched with a 'fuzzy' link building method, should yield great results.

With sandbox, having to hide identity, etc. IMHO it does not pay to do short term stuff.

 

[jvmarket]

Instead of linking the web 2.0 properties to one another, wouldn't it be more effective to build a large number of links directly to the web 2.0 sites from other sources?

This is one of the reasons I dont like link wheel....what's not on the diagram are the bookmarkings done with a number of programs or the blog posts that link to all the sites.

If we linked associated content to squidoo then squidoo to ezinearticles then ezinearticles back to associated content then your point is well taken but we do everything randomly so that its different every time and in the above example the linking would end at ezinearticles and not make a full circle.

j

 

[jvmarket]

I should add to the above post....the more locations you can get links from the better. Not just because you're getting more links but because it looks more natural to the search engines to get links from many places.

Lets take a program like senuke (which we use) if we create a profile that has 10 user accts (we use 40) for every bookmarking site and we start bookmarking our site on a daily or every other day basis at some point the search engines look at our links an say...this guy has 10k links but they are all coming from same 200 places.

So...even though it the beginning we were able to do well long term there will be issues.

That being said you now have a great way to promote snipe sites. Every time one of the many gurus cranks out a new product you can rank well for it pretty quick if you like.

j

 

[MakeLemonade]

blackieman[/B]]
@Riposte - I have studied Linkwheel (what you are talking about) and like you, I am uncomfortable implementing something like that. I read somewhere that goog has some amazing network visualization software which I am sure is available to manual reviewers. They can in an instant figure out what is going on. So the linkwheel-type strategy is not for me as a longer term player.

Indeed I am no fan of the linkwheel method or any method that utilizes complete the circle linking. I am reading the google sniper method now.

But if you include enough external links wouldn't the link pattern get lost in the noise? The number of websites out there is humongous, and every new link just makes this more and more complex.

I've never even seen indication that three-way-links has been busted, let alone links spaced further apart. People still pay for 3 way links, and it still seems to work.

I was planning on doing something without a central hub. See the attached graphic for an idea.

Edit: Also see this diagram for an example of many links. If it were a simple wheel with not many links, yes it would be obvious. But if there were MANY, then not a problem, IMO.

 

[blackieman]

Probably true. The fuzziers and wilder the better. I am just saying make an assumption (I think a good assumption) that a goog manual reviewer with a click of a button can get a very high res image of your link network. Now if it is fuzzy, good! If it looks clean and linkwheely, then probably one can get busted.

I guess the point is risk/reward. My risk/reward may be different from the next person, since I think completing the wheel would pump a LOT of juice, but at certain risk/cost.

 

[jvmarket]

My suggestion for anyone starting out would be to map out the plan first...take a good look at it and see if it makes sense. If it does, test it to see how it works then modify as required.

I'm looking to add traffic geyser to the mix soon....looking forward to see how much this will increase our effectiveness.

j

 

[Riposte]

This is one of the reasons I dont like link wheel....

Isn't your image in the original post pretty much a link wheel though? Why link the web 2.0 properties together at all?

 

[donjuan]

I should add to the above post....the more locations you can get links from the better. Not just because you're getting more links but because it looks more natural to the search engines to get links from many places.

Lets take a program like senuke (which we use) if we create a profile that has 10 user accts (we use 40) for every bookmarking site and we start bookmarking our site on a daily or every other day basis at some point the search engines look at our links an say...this guy has 10k links but they are all coming from same 200 places.

So...even though it the beginning we were able to do well long term there will be issues.

That being said you now have a great way to promote snipe sites. Every time one of the many gurus cranks out a new product you can rank well for it pretty quick if you like.

j

From your experience how long does it take before you start seeing your sites move up in the serps using your linking method?

 

[jvmarket]

From your experience how long does it take before you start seeing your sites move up in the serps using your linking method?

That depends on a number of factors, but anywhere from a week to a few months.

Factors

niche
competitiveness of the niche
competitiveness of the keyword
how much effort is put into it
the exact web 2.0 sites used
how the linking is set up
how well the blog/site is optimized
site content

There are more but I'm sure you get the point. I will add that it is critical that you choose the right keywords.

Here are 2 examples (took about 5 mins to get this info)

"stock investing"

1,040,000 phrase results
349,000 allintitle results

9 searches per day


"investing money while in college"

3600 phrase results
135 allintitle results

85 searches per day

Which keyword would you try and rank for? If you're in the adsense business and you built a page on each of these terms you'll find the google will serve up the same type of ads for each. This means you will make just as much targeting the easier of the two keywords.

To answer the original question...to rank well for "stock investing" could take up to a year and be very expensive. To rank well for "investing money while in college" should take no more than 30 days to see some good results.

Hope this helps.

j

 

[olm75]

ok i am absolutly loving this post something i was looking for i have a diagram that i was using can someone tell me if i need to change it because i really do like the one you have JVmarket.... there are like 3 sites that are out dated...

i also have a question when you do your keyword phrase research what will be the ideal specs for exact phrase match, and allintitle... i know i usualy use phrase match < 30000 and allintitle < 5000 and searches per day > 100 , now i know some tat do very well look for phrase match < 5000 so whats right or the ideal i should be looking for with in reason that i can rank fairky well for...
thanks in advance...

 

[olm75]

i think i like JV's diagram gives more back links... = more traffic = more profits

 

[olm75]

JV let me ask you how long does it take to do all on your diagram by the way

 

[jvmarket]

sorry olm

I have not checked this thread for a couple days.

JV let me ask you how long does it take to do all on your diagram by the way

I doubt that one person could complete all the work manually in less than a week. It takes our staff about 3 days for the majority of the work for one content package...the bookmarking continues for up to a month or more for each content pack.

i also have a question when you do your keyword phrase research what will be the ideal specs for exact phrase match, and allintitle...

My partner and I were talking about this the other day. I dont have an exact answer for you because it depends on a lot of factors. I've found that we can rank very well for keywords with a phrase match value of less than 100K and an allintitle of less than 4k

That being said...we produce a lot of content, have the system down to a science and will produce additional content if needed to prop up a ranking. The key is to staying focused.

By the way....if I find a keyword with 1000 searches per day and a phrase match greater then 100K I may go after that because the amount of traffic is worth the additional work required to rank well for that term.

j

 

[olm75]

ok so by me doing "phrase match" < 30000 and allintitle < 4000 and using your diagram or similar changing of course i should rank very high in google.. and you r also indirectly saying i should hire a team of people to do the diagram for me about 2-5 poeple and let me ask you what would be a fair price also for this...

 

[Jakai]

great share and excellent discussion in this thread. I'm motivated to use this for my struggling auto blog.

I also found some new web 2.0 properties on that diagram that I did not know about.