Let's Talk Keyword Research

[mrpatel786]

There are some people who downplay Google's Keyword Tool, claiming it to be useful and accurate only for adwords, and not SEO. Here's an article:

hxxp://smackdown.blogsblogsblogs.com/2008/07/15/why-the-google-keyword-tool-is-useless-for-seo-even-with-exact-numbers/

Another good discussion (I know it's from Warrior Forum but the discussion looks useful):

hxxp://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-ppc-seo-discussion-forum/21175-warriors-beware-google-keyword-tool-apparently-not-so-good-search-engine-optimization.html

Personally, I stick to Wordtracker and this SEO Book Tool for keyword research:

hxxp://tools.seobook.com/keyword-tools/seobook/

However, when I use the above tools in conjunction with the Google Trends Tool and the keyword Tool, the results are always so different. Sometimes Wordtracker will report 200 hits for the keyword daily, yet when I look at Google's tools, they say otherwise. Google's Trend and Keyword Tool may even tell you that there is not enough data to report on the traffic!


So my question is, which tool should we trust? It's obvious that they all report different stats.

 

[mrpatel786]

Replace "XX" with "tt" in the above urls

 

[mrpatel786]

No one has an opinion on this?

Comon guys. These are some issues we all face

 

[Yukinari84]

I trust Google. All other 3rd party keyword research tools are just that -3rd party.

I used to use others, but now I pretty much use only adwords keyword tool, their new search-based tool, universal search, trends, and insights.

Why?

Because you're getting exactly what's going in Google right now from Google itself. No other tool can compare to this since they rely on analyzing Google from the outside, so the information can be pretty flawed sometimes.

With that said, no keyword tool is perfect, and so you have to take everything and test.

But in the end, I prefer to go with Google since it's the most accurate for what your searchers are looking for and when.

 

[penfish35]

Hi mrpatel786,

I have Keyword Elite, Keyword Swarm, Adword Anylizer and another one that I can't remember the name of...but as you say they all give different info back. That's if I can even get them to work.

I use the Google keyword tool sometimes and I find it quite useful for other purposes. But what really gets me is that there is a thriving industry that has grown-up around the whole adwords thing.

The Gurus like to recycle, rehash and re-package all the same old shit and give it a cool and sinister sounding name to get everyone thinking, this is it!!

It Never is though! They don't want you to know how to do it because you/we wouldn't buy the next rehashed crap that they all give each other testimonials about. The endless books, the software...all pretty much useless.

I had lost a small fortune on Adwords before I found the real secret....which was....Get a professional company to do it for me. Simple as that. No clicks to pay for, no contracts, no disappearing ads, no sinking feeling when you realise that it isn't working. Just a pre-agreed quoted price and top five placing on the front page.

I came to this conclusion a long time ago when I realised that I wouldn't do a joinery apprenticeship just to be able to fix some broken floor boards. I would get a joiner to do it for me. As I am colour blind, I rarely do my own electrics. I get an electrician in.

It's exactly the same with the adwords as far as I am concerned. I buy top placed ads the same as I buy fuel and food. And boy is it cheaper than doing it myself...not to mention the fact that it actually works.

Let's stop trying to be a jack of all trades and just try to be a master of one.

Anyone wanting Keyword elite, Adword Anylyzer etc let me know and I will upload you a copy. If you can get it to work then good luck to you. If anyone wants the address of the company I use then PM me.

Cheers
Penfish35

 

[Yukinari84]

Glad you found a "professional" company to do your Adwords for you that actually works, but most of these guys are either scammers or they are using the exact same methods that are in the "guru" ebooks.

I agree that the so-called "gurus" love to re-hash and sell, but there is some solid Adwords guides that are out there. The main problem is people don't take action or enough of it. They see a few small failures, then move on to the next thing.

 

[tp1313]

I've found that in most cases SEO Book and the Gtool are pretty similar. If I come across a big difference I tend to believe the smaller number.

 

[digitalblue]

Get, discover and research keywords from as many different sources as possible and always use the most advanced tool in the world to make sense of everything...your brain. hmmm so many people forget this one!

Google's keyword tool, insights and sktool are all coming from different data sources that kw discovery and wordtracker. Google is always current and up to date while other sources are dated, in some cases they are pulling data from 3 months earlier.

So play around and get a feel for everything and put things out their test, and track.

 

[instantk]

I use an old program that still gets updated frequently ... Adword Analyzer. It gives search results, you can use quotes, etc. Uses wordtracker or google sandbox tool.

It works alot more than it doesn't. The only limitations for me - it doesn't always provide results (competing website #s) and the number of keywords seem to be about 100 which leaves some digging.

You can only license on 2 computers, but it has been worth it to me. There is 60 day guarantee - it comes from clickbank so you can save even more.

Here is website (no affiliate link) hxxp://w3.adwordanalyzer.cOm/

 

[doncajunas]

google's numbers are overstated imo (don't forget that they have self-interest in getting you to use adwords for keywords that you think have decent volume)

do a simple test - get #1 position for some low competition term and then compare your actual search engine traffic with numbers that google's keyword tool gave you

 

[Keedev]

I use the adwords tool.. I have not noticed anything that would make me change my mind about using it.. Impressions seem a bit high and low for some keywords regarding to the google tools results.. I wouldn't have it any other way though.. Nothing like being able to dish out negatives at the same time your assessing your keywords.

 

[qcp860]

the main issue I have with the G external keyword tool is that when you are expanding a campaign (seo or ppc) it leaves a lot of keywords out.

Google is only reporting based on their notion of relevance and it is common that they will leave off a large number of good longtail keywords. This even happens with a geo expansion where they will leave off a city and if you go back and check the root+city keyword combination separately they will report numbers that are better than some of the keywords you got with just a root root+synonyms search.

Like most people I find their search estimate off but then again it will always be off. They are reporting total searches per month. Then you have to map that into the SERPS. As a rough estimate you can take a 30% CTR for the #1 organic listing but that is just that - a rough estimate. So your actual clicks will always vary depending on how far your keyword space is away from the mean.

 

[mrpatel786]

ok great. Thanks for sharing your experiences guys.

 

[penfish35]

Glad you found a "professional" company to do your Adwords for you that actually works, but most of these guys are either scammers or they are using the exact same methods that are in the "guru" ebooks.

I agree that the so-called "gurus" love to re-hash and sell, but there is some solid Adwords guides that are out there. The main problem is people don't take action or enough of it. They see a few small failures, then move on to the next thing.

Totally agree about people giving up after a few failures, but then you can kinda understand why if these few failures have cost them a couple of hundred bucks each time.

Add to that the fact that they have spent/wasted time following the "can't fail, sure-thing" guide provided by the "Gurus" and then the disappointment of seeing their campaign bomb, then who can blame them.

I guess it just comes down to detremination and sticking with it.

You are right about the cowboys out there though. The ones that say they can get you top places and can't or won't deliver. There are lots of scammers for sure.

However, the company I use have been in business for at least five years now - that's how long I have known about them - land line, offices etc in the UK...and they always deliver for me. Top places on the first page all month. That's all that I care about! But yes, you are right to urge caution with many of them as with everything online.

Cheers

Penfish35

 

[tonlilaz]

i really miss yahoo's old keyword research tool

There are some people who downplay Google's Keyword Tool, claiming it to be useful and accurate only for adwords, and not SEO. Here's an article:

hxxp://smackdown.blogsblogsblogs.com/2008/07/15/why-the-google-keyword-tool-is-useless-for-seo-even-with-exact-numbers/

Another good discussion (I know it's from Warrior Forum but the discussion looks useful):

hxxp://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-ppc-seo-discussion-forum/21175-warriors-beware-google-keyword-tool-apparently-not-so-good-search-engine-optimization.html

Personally, I stick to Wordtracker and this SEO Book Tool for keyword research:

hxxp://tools.seobook.com/keyword-tools/seobook/

However, when I use the above tools in conjunction with the Google Trends Tool and the keyword Tool, the results are always so different. Sometimes Wordtracker will report 200 hits for the keyword daily, yet when I look at Google's tools, they say otherwise. Google's Trend and Keyword Tool may even tell you that there is not enough data to report on the traffic!


So my question is, which tool should we trust? It's obvious that they all report different stats.

 

[visualmagic]

Yeah the overture tool was good. Now I use the Niche finder of SENuke to research keywords that can be SEO more easily.

 

[olm75]

ok here it goes,
i know all of you have heard the same ole speech, how do i find niches, i am using market samurai, great tool but its me i have alot of problem finding the right niches to market...does anyone else use market samurai on here and how do u find your niches
thanks in advanced