Idea for suprapopulation

[Roparadise]

@keinhabe

wtf you got 58 square miles of earth with 30% of it as land? lol

The land portion of earth is 57.5 million square miles out of 196.9 million square miles of total surface area.

 

[jazzc]

In our lives,I don't think we'll face any of this problems.

UN projections for the next decades

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/77/World-Population-1800-2100.png

Ask yourself, in the good and medium scenarios, by what means is the global population going down?

 

[jazzc]

isn't much cheaper one atomic bomb ? why to bother to keep investing into new tech/construction material and other SF-like scenarios when we have already '' perfect '' solution for this matter ?

Surely it is. Please let us know your current residency coordinates to get this going

 

[keinehabe]

I am pretty disturbed by the smiley at the end of your sentence...

eace:

hmmm let me think a second ... why I`ve hit the smile ... well first of all because I seriously believe '' everything '' what happened on the past was with a strong reason ( a strong cause / effect cycle ) ... was kinda an ironic smile nothing fancy whatsoever , most of the time I`m using smiles actually I`m kinda '' positive '' thinking person even on most bad things I`m seeing something '' good to happen '' . Yes I know I`m broken

Surely it is. Please let us know your current residency coordinates to get this going

hard to believe will have success such action on my current residency area , an helicopter it's on air most of the time ( I don't know why it's there or any details but I suppose it's guard coast helicopter ? - never asked local peoples about it , like one year or so when I moved there I didn't noticed at the start but it's seems to be a real problem for me [ being kinda paranoia with my '' dirty works '' ... started to notice and give me loads of nerves when I hear the noise ] fk it in last couple of hours I swear @ it few times and I didn't even notice will stop hear this damn noise lol .

@keinhabe

wtf you got 58 square miles of earth with 30% of it as land? lol

The land portion of earth is 57.5 million square miles out of 196.9 million square miles of total surface area.

typos sorry , think I`m way too over-super-extra-mega tired , wanted to write '' approximative 58 million sq miles '' and '' approximative 30% '' I never knew I think the exact numbers ( just what I remember from school way long back lol ) and if you do the math's I think it's makes sense , if the 196.9 million sq miles is the surface of the earth .... way to early on the morning for me / way to late on the night lol to search now exact numbers on web lol ...

 

[ijof9]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Venus_Project

 

[jazzc]

Anyone that says about overpopulation never been to Canada, Russia etc.

The problem with overpopulation is not where to stack people, it 's how to feed them

How are you going to do agriculture on lands that are not efficient for that? You 'll need more energy and will get sub-par quality/quantity.

Machinery does not move without fuel. Where are you going to get the energy from? Oil? There 's not enough oil any more and when we reach the overpopulation peak, there will be much less. Also, let 's not forget that plastic and a shitload of other things we take for granted have oil as their base material.

So, yes, population will not grow forever, but guess how it 's going down...

A graph to get some perspective...
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b7/Population_curve.svg

 

[Kickflip]

Anyone that says about overpopulation never been to Canada, Russia etc.

Was coming in here only to say Canada & Russia as well. Even many areas of the USA are just open farm land owned by old timers who refuse to let it be developed. There are a few small areas where people are packed in like sardines, but there are tons of countries/areas that have so much wide open space and natural resources to spare.

I drove through Montana (a state in the USA) recently and it was just like 1 giant farm for the entire state.

 

[jazzc]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Venus_Project

The Venus Project was founded on an idea that all nations are fundamentally corrupt and that this corruption comes from the use of money.
Fresco instead advocates what he refers to as a "resource-based economy", which is an economy where resources are allocated by a computerized automated system referred to as the Cybernation.

The soviets already tried that (central planning) without the high tech clothing. It took them just about 80 years to figure out that humans are not angels who get corrupt by something external...

 

[Kickflip]

The problem with overpopulation is not where to stack people, it 's how to feed them

How are you going to do agriculture on lands that are not efficient for that? You 'll need more energy and will get sub-par quality/quantity.

Machinery does not move without fuel. Where are you going to get the energy from? Oil? There 's not enough oil any more and when we reach the overpopulation peak, there will be much less. Also, let 's not forget that plastic and a shitload of other things we take for granted have oil as their base material.

So, yes, population will not grow forever, but guess how it 's going down...

I don't think population will grow forever, I think within 200 years every civilized country will have family size restrictions in place. But Canada and the USA (I dont know much about Russia) have tons of farm land that can grow food and is just going to waste currently. If we need to go Amish, then so be it. I think people underestimate humans abilities to do hard work.

Of course people don't WANT to do hard work, but if the governments came out with carpooling laws, and food rationing, and manual labor became forced, we could survive just fine. We don't NEED cars for daily travel. Just restrict oil usage to essential travel only, and it would last much longer until we develop more efficient electric vehicles, and better ways to produce electricity.

 

[ijof9]

humans are not angels who get corrupt by something external...

No, but when we're born, we're born angels and we love everything. Education allows us to understand ethics and hold on to that. Some decide to exchange ethics for necessities, other decide to die without dignity just to protect ethical standards. It's always because of money and day to day survival, but regardless, there's still hope for humanity.

See countries like Netherlands, Sweden, Luxembourg, Norway, Belgium where they have constitutional monarchies, and the regular citizen loves the ruling party. I know it sounds crazy when you never had that kind of government, but when you do, you'll feel a lot better about it. Plus, those nations have a hell lot of better prosperity.

 

[jazzc]

I don't think population will grow forever, I think within 200 years every civilized country will have family size restrictions in place. But Canada and the USA (I dont know much about Russia) have tons of farm land that can grow food and is just going to waste currently.

Here 's an interesting read that claims the opposite. I am not knowledgeable in the agricultural issue, so I will not try to say if it 's right or wrong. I 'd like to hear your opinion about it though.

FOOD, LAND, POPULATION and the U.S. ECONOMY
by David Pimentel of Cornell University and
Mario Giampietro Istituto of Nazionale della Nutrizione, Rome

http://dieoff.org/page40.htm

If we need to go Amish, then so be it. I think people underestimate humans abilities to do hard work.

Of course people don't WANT to do hard work, but if the governments came out with carpooling laws, and food rationing, and manual labor became forced, we could survive just fine. We don't NEED cars for daily travel. Just restrict oil usage to essential travel only, and it would last much longer until we develop more efficient electric vehicles, and better ways to produce electricity.

Certainly, the humans as a species are survivalists. We did come out of the ice age after all. I am not concerned about that. It 's the quality of life that is concerning. And my observation is, like yours , that it 's going down, down, down. Cars will not be the only thing extinct. As a trivial example, imported goods will be unavailable due to extremely high prices. It will be the feudal ages once again. No foxes for the high society to hunt though

 

[Roparadise]

@kickflip

There is no need to have oil rationing as a practice electric vehicle is only 10 years away,and the current trend in gasoline powered vehicle is an increase in its average mpg. Running out of oil is so far away from when a electric vehicle with a great range,relative quick recharge time and a good price comes out.

 

[keinehabe]

are you kidding ? I wanna see the day when US government will have the guts to force you peoples to simply drop your trucks in and drive prius/tico or any other mini-car ) I WANNA SEE THIS DAY =)) well I can say when I`ll see in any serious and well respected media agency such announce made will quit smoking myself that's clear ( peoples who know me laugh now since until now everyone was trying to make me quit smoking and none had any kind of success ) BUT in the day when I`ll see the US government forcing peoples to trash your SUV's/trucks and any car with more than 2 litres of gas consume per 100km then I`ll quit smoking

 

[ijof9]

We don't NEED cars for daily travel. Just restrict oil usage to essential travel only, and it would last much longer until we develop more efficient electric vehicles, and better ways to produce electricity.

Last time I checked, the F-16 ran on aviation fuel. I think they were working on a nuclear powered jet, but they had to halt research because of the Cuban missile crisis.

Unless jets and bombers start running on something else, I believe Shell and Chevron would still need to be around.

References:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aircraft_Nuclear_Propulsion#Abandonment
http://www.lanl.gov/history/story.php?story_id=23

 

[jazzc]

Allow me to dissect your sayings

No, but when we're born, we're born angels and we love everything. Education allows us to understand ethics and hold on to that.

The first sentence contradicts the second. If you ar perfect, you do not need something external to force you to become "good"/"ethical". Not to mention that "ethics" is something defined by a society and not a constant. Ethics in the same geographical place has not been the same as the time goes by - a history book will let you realize that

Some decide to exchange ethics for necessities, other decide to die without dignity just to protect ethical standards.

So, there are people who choose to be bad and people who choose to live by a better standard. What does that mean? Humans are not angels

It's always because of money and day to day survival, but regardless, there's still hope for humanity.

There 's no such thing as "money". Money is a medium for the exchange of wealth. To get it with an analogy, think of money as the Internet. It 's allows the fast & easy exchange of wealth (Internet does the same for ideas).

See countries like Netherlands, Sweden, Luxembourg, Norway, Belgium where they have constitutional monarchies, and the regular citizen loves the ruling party. I know it sounds crazy when you never had that kind of government, but when you do, you'll feel a lot better about it. Plus, those nations have a hell lot of better prosperity.

This is something totally different and irrelevant. I totally disagree, but I will not comment it because it will throw the discussion away from the point.

 

[Roparadise]

are you kidding ? I wanna see the day when US government will have the guts to force you peoples to simply drop your trucks in and drive prius/tico or any other mini-car ) I WANNA SEE THIS DAY =)) well I can say when I`ll see in any serious and well respected media agency such announce made will quit smoking myself that's clear ( peoples who know me laugh now since until now everyone was trying to make me quit smoking and none had any kind of success ) BUT in the day when I`ll see the US government forcing peoples to trash your SUV's/trucks and any car with more than 2 litres of gas consume per 100km then I`ll quit smoking

You need to go to sleep, there is no car that only uses 2L/100KM or less lol That is 117.6 mpg for all you people that don't know the metric system.

It wont be the u.s. government that gets people to switch it will be the price of fuel,ofc some idiots that think they need a big truck for their business when they really don't, will still use one.

 

[jazzc]

There is no need to have oil rationing as a practice electric vehicle is only 10 years away,and the current trend in gasoline powered vehicle is an increase in its average mpg. Running out of oil is so far away from when a electric vehicle with a great range,relative quick recharge time and a good price comes out.

Let us know how the electric power will be generated...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Electricity_Production_the_USA.svg

 

[jazzc]

are you kidding ? I wanna see the day when US government will have the guts to force you peoples to simply drop your trucks in and drive prius/tico or any other mini-car ) I WANNA SEE THIS DAY =))

Be careful of what you wish, for it may come true.

 

[Kickflip]

Here 's an interesting read that claims the opposite. I am not knowledgeable in the agricultural issue, so I will not try to say if it 's right or wrong. I 'd like to hear your opinion about it though.

Even after reading the article, I still believe a lot of farm land is being wasted, mostly by livestock. From my 5 minutes of in-depth research, it does seem that if we just kicked our meat eating habits, and ate more vegetables and grains (effecting quality of life as you said) that the land could be "stretched" much further. There is a lot of farm land currently used for 5-6 horses or cows instead of being used to grow crops.

People currently consider a high quality of live as being able to do anything they choose to, at any time they choose to. That will have to change. But as far as health goes, I think we will all be just fine.

 

[Kickflip]

Last time I checked, the F-16 ran on aviation fuel. I think they were working on a nuclear powered jet, but they had to halt research because of the Cuban missile crisis.

Unless jets and bombers start running on something else, I believe Shell and Chevron would still need to be around.

I am not sure what this post means, sorry.