How do you guys handle chargebacks w/ members?

[flowergay]

So I'm thinking of starting my own membership site but first thing that worries me is chargebacks with members. Since I'll be only using PayPal to process $ and since we all know how anal PayPal can be, what do you guys do in situations like chargebacks?

No matter how hard you try to keep the customers satisfied, I just don't see how I will not get any chargebacks? What do you guys to prevent chargebacks in the first place and how anal is paypal about it?

Thank you.

 

[shravandude]

Place a donate button then the person wont be having chance to charge back or other option is when he makes a payment tell him to mention some thing like SERVICE.

But i would recommend to go with the first option which is donate button.

 

[SpareTimeBillionaire]

I tend to leave enough in PayPal to cover one refund after a sales shot, just in case. Fortunately, I've never had one.

Yes, donate is a good option if it's a one time sign up or you don't expect them to stay but if PayPal get complaints you're doomed. But here's the thing... if you're selling crap, expect complaints. If you expect complaints don't use PayPal.

If you use WebMoney, LibertyReserve or Western Union your visitors already know they're on a risky venture. If things go pear shaped for them they'll kick themselves not you.

 

[flowergay]

Thanks for the advise guys. Well, I plan on having 2 level membership along with monthly subscription so I don't think donation is an option. I did look into WU and other payments but how reliable are they? I couldn't really find much information at all on BHW or other websites on accepting payments (rebills and all that) with other merchants.

Any feedback is appreciated. Thank you.

 

[Adamsc1]

If it's membership based on access I just ban them. If not I make the ToS include no refunds, and make them write a consent note in the paypal account. I also hold credit card payments for 72 hours before membership.

 

[flowergay]

If it's membership based on access I just ban them. If not I make the ToS include no refunds, and make them write a consent note in the paypal account. I also hold credit card payments for 72 hours before membership.

Interesting so all the members do really write consent notes into paypal transaction? I think this is pretty smart but aren't there automatic ways of the buyers consenting instead of making them write themselves?

And what do you make them write? "I understand that no refunds will be allowed and that when I try to do chargeback, my name will be listed on the shame-on-you list on the webiste" or some sort? Thank you!

 

[Monrox]

Ask them to pay by check. This whole refund / chargeback mess is due to the fact that there is no simple way to use direct deposit as payment. If there was one, nobody would ever bother with the whole CC, PP, plimus, 2co etc. bunch.

 

[Adamsc1]

Interesting so all the members do really write consent notes into paypal transaction? I think this is pretty smart but aren't there automatic ways of the buyers consenting instead of making them write themselves?

And what do you make them write? "I understand that no refunds will be allowed and that when I try to do chargeback, my name will be listed on the shame-on-you list on the webiste" or some sort? Thank you!

There are but I find that works best when you contact paypal support about a charge back, as some jurisdictions don't give a damn about your ToS saying no refunds. Also if you have them consent and then take credit card through a secondary provider that you can control and hold the payment for 3 days before entry then your pretty much secure.

The best way to ensure yourself is to have the member do something manual rather than automatic, I used to do all my processing manually via fax and scan so that I had a users consent signature but my sites have grown too much for that.

 

[flowergay]

Adam,

When you say hold credit card payment for 3 days through a secondary, do you mean you also use a different c.c processor other than PayPal? If so, who do you use if you don't mind me asking?

I initially thought you meant you would not activate the membership unless 3 days pass via PayPal but I guess I misunderstood. Thank you!

 

[p0532673]

Get them to mass pay you the amount, the can't file a dispute with that option, only an unauthorized claim. Log their IPs as well so if they file for an unauthorized claim you can submit the IP addresses to paypal and it will be closed in your favor.

 

[Adamsc1]

Adam,

When you say hold credit card payment for 3 days through a secondary, do you mean you also use a different c.c processor other than PayPal? If so, who do you use if you don't mind me asking?

I initially thought you meant you would not activate the membership unless 3 days pass via PayPal but I guess I misunderstood. Thank you!

I use paypal for everything other than credit cards, all paypal ones have a consent note, agree to my ToS and are instant. For cc I use a local versign reseller in the UK

 

[SpareTimeBillionaire]

I thought this should be shared:

Hi there,

Thanks for your advice on my thread. I was wondering...what membership script do you use? I am tending towards DAP but I just don't know as I am a newbie when it comes to programming stuff.

May I ask what you charge your members monthly? I was thinking $49.99 for silver and $89.99 for gold...is that too much?

Lastly -where do you get all of your content that your members love and not complain about? Sorry for all these questions, trying to study much as possible before starting it up! Thanks

Okay, you've made the effort to write so I'll reply because I'm in a tolerating mood.

I think you have your questions in the wrong order though - I shall answer them in the order they should have been asked, in my opinion.

The most important thing about any membership site is in the content provided and the added value that the members gain from being in the site. This is your "niche". I currently operate in four niches. I am finding this complex and will soon be reducing it to two. The reason for that is my readers expect quality.

How much would you pay per month to be a member of Black Hat World for example? Would you be here if it cost you $12.79 per month? Would you be here if it cost you $0.49 per month? And yet the site is FREE. Why? Because the owners value us the members and our input and it beats the hell out of the competitors.

It's not a good business model though! The only profitable membership sites I know of make their profits by providing genuine valuable products for their members. Actually, I just checked this out and these guys are pretty savvy, using the Bond Street model.

And finally, you can't programme. Okay, use WordPress or Joomla and search the plugins and extensions. I personally use nBill on Joomla which does all my billing and accounting stuff too. There are plenty of free options though.

 

[e13a34d32]

I always issue refunds to whoever requests it. Then again my business is in a very tight niche so I have to please my customer base. If someone complains to friends or colleagues i'm screwed.

 

[phpdotnetguy]

why don't you use 2checkout. I think its best option to go for.

 

[lazyentrepreneur]

Sometimes I've had PayPal issue instant refund without my input, and the user had signed up for a prior 3 months before claiming it as unauthorized when it renewed. They acted like idiots on the phone and played opossum. There is no option that I see for digital goods when it's time to respond to complaint. You wait a few days and then PayPal says they're investigating it after you haven't responded. I've sent IP logs and usernames and they've won sometimes and I've won sometimes. But it's a massive waste of time. I mainly just keep reserves in account to have there in case some numbskull pulls this. And they will. So it's a part of doing business.