Long Term Experiment - The "Foolproof" Linkwheel

[MisterGemini]

I've been using something similar but do it slightly differently: I build my network first, a good three months before the site in question is built, and hand write all the stuff on it, so it looks decent and monetise it with Amazon, so it looks like the web 2.0s are the property of some mommy blogger. But none have more than three pages.

If you stagger the building this way, and backlink them, they not only rank, but gain pagerank. I even got some Amazon sales from them, as they look legit.

Then I start work on my money site, build content, send a few article backlinks and social bookmark backlinks. Then one month in I start sending a link from my web 2.0 network in, one a week. It's all very slow and under the radar. You do start moving up the serps though at a steady pace.

Because all of the above is pre-planned, you need to control it all with a spreadsheet just so you can track where you are up to, and this approach lends itself to working on multiple projects at the same time.

The only thing I disagree with the OP on is that he has only 8 web 2.0s in his linkroot. I find I need about 15-20, even when some of them have accrued pagerank to pass on to the money site.

Nicely done. You even got the terminology correct.

I agree that a wider base linkroot system will result in better results. Perhaps for the OPs experiment sake, he is using only 8 just for the sake of testing. It is also possible that he has only taken 8 because they are all high PR and allow follow links while perhaps others are n0follow. However, I think the 8 will suffice if he continues to build deep. The strength can come from a wider linkroots base, or a series of deeper linkroots. The optimal result is when you have both. This of course is a LOT of work.

 

[Rose99]

I agree that a wider base linkroot system will result in better results. Perhaps for the OPs experiment sake, he is using only 8 just for the sake of testing. It is also possible that he has only taken 8 because they are all high PR and allow follow links while perhaps others are n0follow. However, I think the 8 will suffice if he continues to build deep. The strength can come from a wider linkroots base, or a series of deeper linkroots. The optimal result is when you have both. This of course is a LOT of work.

My most successful network has 13 web 2.0s in it, and many of those have pagerank 3 or 4 - but of course they didn't have that to start with, I continued to build links to them. I build a steady two links to each every month, just so they continue to maintain both their pagerank and rankings.

It's only a huge amount of work at the start - writing them, getting them indexed and ranked and making them "stick". After that, just a couple of links a month to each will maintain them, and as they get stronger the money site gets stronger. You can't really completely forget about them - then again, you can't completely forget about any site, it's just a myth pedalled to lazy people.

But it's easy to control the work with a spreadsheet. You look at August and think, OK, I've got to build two links to this list of web 2.0s, and just mark them off on your sheet when you've done it.

It's also a good way of hiding the source of links. Most competitors will look at Market Samurai and say, oh, this site is ranking with just 45 links (the articles plus the web 2.0s). They never investigate further and look behind the web 2.0s.

 

[Micallef]

My most successful network has 13 web 2.0s in it, and many of those have pagerank 3 or 4 - but of course they didn't have that to start with, I continued to build links to them. I build a steady two links to each every month, just so they continue to maintain both their pagerank and rankings.

It's only a huge amount of work at the start - writing them, getting them indexed and ranked and making them "stick". After that, just a couple of links a month to each will maintain them, and as they get stronger the money site gets stronger. You can't really completely forget about them - then again, you can't completely forget about any site, it's just a myth pedalled to lazy people.

But it's easy to control the work with a spreadsheet. You look at August and think, OK, I've got to build two links to this list of web 2.0s, and just mark them off on your sheet when you've done it.

It's also a good way of hiding the source of links. Most competitors will look at Market Samurai and say, oh, this site is ranking with just 45 links (the articles plus the web 2.0s). They never investigate further and look behind the web 2.0s.

I like your approach, and yes, some of my networks will be bigger too. I view the creation of these networks as continuing indefinitely.

Most critically, you have hinted on the importance of building powerful backlinks to your properties. This is truly essential, and actually comprises a lot of the total workload.

 

[takeachance]

My most successful network has 13 web 2.0s in it, and many of those have pagerank 3 or 4 - but of course they didn't have that to start with, I continued to build links to them. I build a steady two links to each every month, just so they continue to maintain both their pagerank and rankings.

It's only a huge amount of work at the start - writing them, getting them indexed and ranked and making them "stick". After that, just a couple of links a month to each will maintain them, and as they get stronger the money site gets stronger. You can't really completely forget about them - then again, you can't completely forget about any site, it's just a myth pedalled to lazy people.

But it's easy to control the work with a spreadsheet. You look at August and think, OK, I've got to build two links to this list of web 2.0s, and just mark them off on your sheet when you've done it.

It's also a good way of hiding the source of links. Most competitors will look at Market Samurai and say, oh, this site is ranking with just 45 links (the articles plus the web 2.0s). They never investigate further and look behind the web 2.0s.

I also like this approach although if you don't mind I have a couple of qustions;

1. Your network has 13 web 2.0 properties, do you set these up manually or use automation for some/all of it?

2. Your most successful properties - do all these pages within the property contain unique content or spun?

3. You manage a link building campaign using a spreadsheet placing 2 links per month per property - are these two links linking to the TLD of the property or to sub pages as well?

As Michallef has indicated, the construction of the properties is fairly straight forward but the true results will come only with good quality backlinking in the right manner just as you are evidencing.

 

[Rose99]

I also like this approach although if you don't mind I have a couple of qustions;

1. Your network has 13 web 2.0 properties, do you set these up manually or use automation for some/all of it?

2. Your most successful properties - do all these pages within the property contain unique content or spun?

3. You manage a link building campaign using a spreadsheet placing 2 links per month per property - are these two links linking to the TLD of the property or to sub pages as well?

As Michallef has indicated, the construction of the properties is fairly straight forward but the true results will come only with good quality backlinking in the right manner just as you are evidencing.

1. I set them all up manually. I know it seems like a lot of work in the beginning, but it's worth it in the long run, because when your money site starts doing well, your competitors will start nosing around your links, and will not hesitate to take you down if they see rubbish there. For instance, most web 2.0 platforms like Squidoo, hubpages and blogger have terms and conditions that are quite strict. If you put rubbish on there and your competitor sees it, it's easy for them to report you, and poof, your linkroots/linknodes are deleted. Then you have to start over, which is more work.

2. I use unique content on all things directly linking to the money site.

3. The linking building is to the web 2.0s not to the money site. The money site just has a few articles and the web 2.0's linking in. (Though occasionally I send a nice unique article to the money site - and have a link to both the TLD and an inner page).

Think of the above as a giant pyramid. You have your money site at the top. Linking into the money site are unique articles and unique web 2.0s. They are all as white hat as possible and have value in their own right (and often make sales in their own right).

Then underneath, linking to the web 2.0s is "other stuff". It's up to you what this other stuff is, and it doesn't have to be manually written, and doesn't have to be wonderful. Web 2.0's can take garbage linking in to them, but your money site cannot.

Also think about how your competitors spy on you (or how you spy on them!). Most likely you are using Market Samurai and just look at the first layer linking to the money site. Only people using yahoo site explorer look at the links to the links and hardly anyone bothers, because Yahoo Site Explorer is so manual, and they are all trying to "save time".

Therefore make sure that your money site is pristine, and your web 2.0s are pristine. What is under that need not be.

I know the above seems like a lot of work, but it's stable and seems to withstand Google's periodic clearout of linking footprints.

You know the old saying "more haste less speed" - it's so true in IM. Staggering the production of your linknodes works better than doing them all at once - as the OP pointed out. Making sure that the stuff linking to your money site is above board works better than linking garbage to it, and then having those links disappear when G does it's quarterly clearouts.

Be patient and pre-plan and you are ahead of all the "Nuke-it-now, get-nuked-by-G, start-all-over" crowd

 

[Rose99]

P.S. I'd like to re-emphasise what Micallef said in the very first post.

The timing of it all is really important. Google knows when a property was first indexed, and it's really easy for them to do comparisons of the date your money site was indexed and when your linknodes were indexed.

So stagger the building of the linknodes, consider building some before your build your money site. A link coming in from a pre-existing property looks like a genuine editorial link. Links coming from stuff done in the same day as your money site look like they've been built by you.

Think of this as a proper business project, get a whiteboard or spreadsheet and draw a timeline of when you will build these things.

Remember the spammers arn't proper business people, they are chancers, and haven't the patience to execute a proper plan. Mix it up and make sure that your footprint is as different as possible from theirs.

 

[Micallef]

1. I set them all up manually. I know it seems like a lot of work in the beginning, but it's worth it in the long run, because when your money site starts doing well, your competitors will start nosing around your links, and will not hesitate to take you down if they see rubbish there. For instance, most web 2.0 platforms like Squidoo, hubpages and blogger have terms and conditions that are quite strict. If you put rubbish on there and your competitor sees it, it's easy for them to report you, and poof, your linkroots/linknodes are deleted. Then you have to start over, which is more work.

2. I use unique content on all things directly linking to the money site.

3. The linking building is to the web 2.0s not to the money site. The money site just has a few articles and the web 2.0's linking in. (Though occasionally I send a nice unique article to the money site - and have a link to both the TLD and an inner page).

Think of the above as a giant pyramid. You have your money site at the top. Linking into the money site are unique articles and unique web 2.0s. They are all as white hat as possible and have value in their own right (and often make sales in their own right).

Then underneath, linking to the web 2.0s is "other stuff". It's up to you what this other stuff is, and it doesn't have to be manually written, and doesn't have to be wonderful. Web 2.0's can take garbage linking in to them, but your money site cannot.

Also think about how your competitors spy on you (or how you spy on them!). Most likely you are using Market Samurai and just look at the first layer linking to the money site. Only people using yahoo site explorer look at the links to the links and hardly anyone bothers, because Yahoo Site Explorer is so manual, and they are all trying to "save time".

Therefore make sure that your money site is pristine, and your web 2.0s are pristine. What is under that need not be.

I know the above seems like a lot of work, but it's stable and seems to withstand Google's periodic clearout of linking footprints.

You know the old saying "more haste less speed" - it's so true in IM. Staggering the production of your linknodes works better than doing them all at once - as the OP pointed out. Making sure that the stuff linking to your money site is above board works better than linking garbage to it, and then having those links disappear when G does it's quarterly clearouts.

Be patient and pre-plan and you are ahead of all the "Nuke-it-now, get-nuked-by-G, start-all-over" crowd

Staggered production is, I believe, critical.

However, there is one point you've made that I have to look at in more detail.

Web 2.0's can take garbage linking in to them, but your money site cannot.

Money sites can accommodate dubious links from sources like blog comment spam. I have a lot of experience in this regard, and I would put the risk of you getting into trouble with Google for this practice at lower than 10%. Scrapebox and xrumer make things a bit more risky and so I don't use them on core pages, but to be honest, you'll probably be fine as-well.

There are limitations to these "garbage" links, however. For one, you do not control them yourself. When and if they get removed, your rankings drop and you have to patch up the holes.

Further, Google may ignore many "garbage" links, depending on how bad they are.

However, most of the rank-power for my critical pages is provided by high PR comment spam. It's unpredictable and unreliable, but it definitely moves your sites up in the SERPs.

For me, the whole point of building your own networks is to gain an extra level of control over critical money pages and stabilize their rank.

 

[imp3ratore]

ZzzzZ..Honestly i don't really understand what's you guys are talking around here, but One for sure Google is not a GOD that we must focus on..i know most of traffic are comming from google about 50% , that's only 50% and not 100%..You guys like battle for one woman only..ZZzzz..How Sad was that when you have 50% left to dominate..? Embarassing for me.. Put your money in one basket that sucks..

Google is like a WOMAN in my think when you are going aggressive to get them, the more they will ignorant you , why they ignorant you..? cause they want to get more attention from you or other people and when you turn to ignorant them, they will start to get your attention...Big G..? what's the meaning of that.? big Google ( X ), big God ( X ), ahh no...big GIRL ( V ) for me..

I am working with linkwheel for 4 month now and get better result until now for my adsense earnings and some for my sale..

You guys can blame me for this but i don't care since i know what i am talking about ( This is a forum right, ? all people can show up their opinion )..Open you eyes and your brain and see many possibilities out there sometimes OLD can be GOLD, don't too monotonous and move too forward , sometimes you must see your back maybe you drop / left something..

= Just My 2 Cent = Thank's

 

[takeachance]

3. The linking building is to the web 2.0s not to the money site. The money site just has a few articles and the web 2.0's linking in. (Though occasionally I send a nice unique article to the money site - and have a link to both the TLD and an inner page).

Appreciate you taking the time for these detailed answers. What I was getting at here in relation to this question;

"3. You manage a link building campaign using a spreadsheet placing 2 links per month per property - are these two links linking to the TLD of the property or to sub pages as well?"

is I can see you are setting up a linking schedule to the web 2.0 properties (not the money page) and when obtaining links TO the web 2.0's are you providing links to the TLD or sub pages?

Again, thanks for taking the time for sharing your approach to this, and to Michallef for starting such an informational and very topical post.

 

[MisterGemini]

Rose99 recent post was quite good. I agree with Micallef on the point that link diversity has its place in the money site. I totally get your point about your competition sourcing your links, but usually what they look for is the link partner/sitewide type links. The ones and twos from comments that you might get from a small spam campaign don't mean anything to them.

The details Rose99 went into though was a great contribution to this topic though. You are right about google knowing exactly when those properties are made, and it is ineed better to have them made before the money site.

Rather than looking like a pyramid though, I prefer to think of it as thinking of a tree with its roots reaching into the earth. Pyramids are certainly nothing natural to look at. They are even, might I say.. alien (X Files theme plays).

 

[Rose99]

Appreciate you taking the time for these detailed answers. What I was getting at here in relation to this question;

"3. You manage a link building campaign using a spreadsheet placing 2 links per month per property - are these two links linking to the TLD of the property or to sub pages as well?"

is I can see you are setting up a linking schedule to the web 2.0 properties (not the money page) and when obtaining links TO the web 2.0's are you providing links to the TLD or sub pages?

Again, thanks for taking the time for sharing your approach to this, and to Michallef for starting such an informational and very topical post.

When linking to the web 2.0s, you need to backlink any page that has a link to your money site.

So if the web 2.0 is a squidoo lens, there's just one page/lens you are backlinking. If the web 2.0 is a mini-blog with say three posts, each of which has a link back to your money site, you need to backlink each of the three posts.

HTH

 

[Rose99]

Staggered production is, I believe, critical.

However, there is one point you've made that I have to look at in more detail.

Money sites can accommodate dubious links from sources like blog comment spam. I have a lot of experience in this regard, and I would put the risk of you getting into trouble with Google for this practice at lower than 10%. Scrapebox and xrumer make things a bit more risky and so I don't use them on core pages, but to be honest, you'll probably be fine as-well.

Hi Micallef,

You are probably right that some money sites can cope with "dubious" links. I would imagine if your money site has gained age, it is more able to absorb these.

I don't do this because I'm a bit paranoid and protective of my sites. But that's just me! Everyone has a different tolerance for risk.

 

[Micallef]

When linking to the web 2.0s, you need to backlink any page that has a link to your money site.

So if the web 2.0 is a squidoo lens, there's just one page/lens you are backlinking. If the web 2.0 is a mini-blog with say three posts, each of which has a link back to your money site, you need to backlink each of the three posts.

HTH

Absolutely - deep link to all your posts, not just to the subdomain itself.

 

[shapsp]

another source of articles can be old school textbooks.

 

[Micallef]

Update:

I've revised my content recommendations for making networks of this type.

In certain circumstances, spun content is acceptable and I believe it will get through the various filters Google may have in effect.

The exact process I use is detailed in this thread:

http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackh...roduce-unique-readable-content-mini-nets.html

 

[Natlex]

I use some 90% or so copied content in some articles. A few uniques, a few copied etc. It's normal to have copied content here and there... I don't put links in those though and only add 1 every 1-3 weeks per blog.

 

[beatuplunchbox]

Been watchin this a few weeks. I also make plenty of different 2.0 sites to use as "stabilisers" for my money sites.

Links from comment spamming are "unstable" for several reasons. the first of which is that you have no control over them.

They tend to be rapidly degraded by other spammers (if you dropped a link there, others will follow...)
or they are cleaned out/deleted periodically by owners.

You do get some ones like that that are semi permanent. The best ones are the ones that close comments after a few days, or ones who get pissed at all of us and shut down comments sitewide without cleaning the old ones out...

As far as having the stabilizer type sites, you can play a whole lot looser with anchor text, and Im starting to figure out relevance does not mean jack more than one layer removed from your money site...

Many of the 2.0 sites also have zealots within their ranks whose only purpose in life is to report spammers. If you can play along and blend in at these places, those folks actually will help you unwittingly.

I have accounts with some of these places where I can now push out a reasonable amount of spam with impunity just because I played along to start out with.

Been doing this for three years now, and have a whole army of these little bs pages with decent PR pointing back to my main networks.

Can go in, change up or add links at will, and boost anything I need to.

Just have to build a whole lot of stuff to get there, and keep track of it.


No real structural plan, just random, but there is a method to my madness...

 

[Crixus]

Good stuff lunchbox.

Can you tell us more about "playing along" and how the spamnazis can actually help you? Does this imply being a sort of spamnazi yourself at first?

 

[beatuplunchbox]

No, never be a spam Nazi. Heck, thats too much work.

Im just talking about using some common sense. Instead of setting up one account and immediately spamming the heck out of it, set up multiple accounts over time, poke around, find out some of the posters to that platform that are really dedicated.

Make a few nice comments about their stuff, "star" or "like" their stuff. Really simple stuff. (This kind of stuff also helps get your stuff indexed naturally because it makes tons of internal backlinks to your own pages on that site.)

I also start out with non commercial posts. Really simple stuff. One I did by taking pics of dirt and rocks and different materials. Simply put captions underneath like "Earth Texture #3 Sample for Project" and made posts like this every few days for a couple of weeks.

Started working links into similar types of posts. I did this all over the place and didn't get slapped by a mod once.

A little extra time spent initially usually pays off in droves. Once "accepted" I have accounts that I can push a larger volume of pages published.

Just don't over think it...

 

[josh21]

This information is very insightful. Now I know why my linkwheels seem to have no effects at all.any way thanks for the info dude....