what alternatives to Wordpress do I have?

[tazarbm]

There is none. I have researched it extensively, every single "alternative" is lacking in one or other direction.

I'll keep looking though... and if I find one (or at least one that comes at close as possible to what I'm looking for) I will share it with you (unless I forget, as my memory is not as good as in my youth) so you can enjoy it too

 

[KloudBucket]

If you have problem with wordpress, then go for laravel.

There are many ready made laravel script and theme available at codecanyon, Just purchase and install theme, They are super fast.

 

[SirLouen]

There is none. I have researched it extensively, every single "alternative" is lacking in one or other direction.

Yep, for what he is looking there is none
He wants an almost free system, ideally self-hosted, that has a big community to have a good selection of themes (which must be very cheap, responsive and big in WPO), and must be simpler than WP.
It doesn't really exist.
If you want a good selection of themes and simpler tha WP, you have to rennounce to cheapness and self-hosting
If you want self-hosting and cheap/free, you need to renounce to simplicity.

Again, I'm not a fan of Statamic, in fact I would not recommend it. But unfortunatelly, that is the nearest option.
A little expensive the first licensing, but then is barely $5/month. Simpler than WPO, can be selfhosted, very fast and a pretty good community. Biggest problem is the first payment upfront

I've been reviewing every single CMS under the sun and there is nothing that meets this criteria.

If you have problem with wordpress, then go for laravel.

Laravel is anything, but simple. Its not even a CMS. You need to code every single bit.

 

[tazarbm]

It doesn't really exist.
If you want a good selection of themes and simpler tha WP, you have to rennounce to cheapness and self-hosting
If you want self-hosting and cheap/free, you need to renounce to simplicity.

fair points! I will make due with what I find, no worries

I've been reviewing every single CMS under the sun and there is nothing that meets this criteria.

I am taking a look at Concrete CMS at the moment. Any insight you can give me for it?

 

[SirLouen]

Concrete CMS

What do you have in Concrete that you don't have in WP? .
This is one of those CMS like Joomla or Drupal, that were instantly discarded by me.
If you don't like WP for political reasons, I would rather choose ClassicPress than Concrete.

I think that you should have really stated what you particularly hate so much about WP, to recognize where others could be actually shinning

What have been your pain points in WP? What is your "rant" with WP.

 

[tazarbm]

What do you have in Concrete that you don't have in WP? .

nothing! And I already ditched it after I watched a few of their tutorials and saw that it's as head-spinningly complicated as Wordpress. So I'm not interested in Concrete MS anymore

This is one of those CMS like Joomla or Drupal, that were instantly discarded by me.
If you don't like WP for political reasons, I would rather choose ClassicPress than Concrete.

actually, I'm done with all of the CMSes... I've put my hopes in Publii at someone else's recommendations, but Publii - despite of how beautiful it looks - is so weird. Like, I have to work with it directly on my computer instead of in a browser, and I'm sooo not used to this... Such a bummer!

I think that you should have really stated what you particularly hate so much about WP, to recognize where others could be actually shinning

I think I've already mentioned, but here it is:

- constant updates
- too pricey
- the gutenberg crap and the blocks
- too complex and complicated (and that's me after having used WP for over a decade, it still takes me a lot of time to navigate through the billions of settings and figure out what I want to do (I guess you can call it information, or options overload)

What have been your pain points in WP? What is your "rant" with WP.

I've just listed them...

And it's not just these, I genuinely want to try something else, see what else is out there. Too much Wordpress is bad for your health

 

[SirLouen]

- constant updates
- too pricey
- the gutenberg crap and the blocks
- too complex and complicated (and that's me after having used WP for over a decade, it still takes me a lot of time to navigate through the billions of settings and figure out what I want to do (I guess you can call it information, or options overload)

Very interesting
This is exactly my rant, the other way around
- Updates are few and with no many changes
- You find it pricey? I'm hosting hundreds of sites for peanuts. Its the cheapness by nature
- Gutenberg can be disabled with Classic Editor. But yes: if you don't like Gutenberg, you are cooked (in fact I'm looking for a CMS that actually implements a thing like Gutenberg). Block designing is the future, and Automattic knew this (hence they put all the eggs into that basket). My suggestion is that if you want to stay in the top of the wave, don't reject it too much, its like the AI, for web design: you can hate it but its what everyone will be using. Also these patterns, helps AIs for automatic designing massively. But if you don't like the "blockish" designing, discard Wix, Tilda, Duda and Squarespace.
- My rant, the other way around: I find that the bare bones are excessively simple and they are totally against adding more features in the UI

Plus I recommend checking the next big step of WP
https://make.wordpress.org/design/2023/08/10/admin-design-kickoff/

And it's not just these, I genuinely want to try something else, see what else is out there. Too much Wordpress is bad for your health

Yes, I agree with this. I'm perma looking out there. You don't know how many times I've thought on attempting creating an alternative crafted by myself. But given the history we have with newborn CMS.. it doesnt look too appealing after a second thought.

 

[tazarbm]

But if you don't like the "blockish" designing, discard Wix, Tilda, Duda and Squarespace.

I already did

I'm hosting hundreds of sites for peanuts. Its the cheapness by nature

you're rich, mate! I'm not!

Of course that for rich people $100k is bubble gum money

Block designing is the future, and Automattic knew this (hence they put all the eggs into that basket).

I don't care! Automattic is not the God of site builders, there are still plenty of options out there, and those guys need love too, much more than the same old greedy fucks like Automattic.

You like them? Use them indefinitely! I like Wordpress too (customizability-wise), but I'm done with them for a while, despite of how good, and beautiful, and strong, and handsome, and whatever else Automattic is...

- My rant, the other way around: I find that the bare bones are excessively simple and they are totally against adding more features in the UI

well, with this I agree. It's been one of my eternally internal struggles with site builders: I want builders as customizable as WP, but as simple to navigate and use as Bludit (my newest fascinating discovery)

So I guess this is the reason for which I'm never fully happy with any site builder LOL

Plus I recommend checking the next big step of WP
https://make.wordpress.org/design/2023/08/10/admin-design-kickoff/

I couldn't care less about WP's grandeur.

I'm on a mission to ignore Wordpress for the next 12-15 months, and if I fail even at this simple task... well, what else am I good for then?

Yes, I agree with this. I'm perma looking out there. You don't know how many times I've thought on attempting creating an alternative crafted by myself.

at least we agree on something, that's good

But given the history we have with newborn CMS.. it doesnt look too appealing after a second thought.

you don't have to go straight for CMS, though. If you know what you like / want in a site builder and you have the skills to do it (and especially since you'll be doing it for your own use probably), I think you can come up with something good in a year.

And with the money you have you can easily hire 2-3 trusted people to help you with it

 

[CPANathan]

Have you looked at Sanity on React or Astro mate? Once off config of a json file for your sites structure, post types and their relationships, the whole lot... It's a nightmare how little but how much goes into it compared to WordPress

 

[tazarbm]

Have you looked at Sanity on React or Astro mate? Once off config of a json file for your sites structure, post types and their relationships, the whole lot... It's a nightmare how little but how much goes into it compared to WordPress

didn't have time, I'm already swamped in options that I want to check out, I barely got to eliminate (earlier today) Ghost, Grav, HTMLy, and Concrete from my list.

Right now I'm still checking CMS Made Simple, Xoops, ModX, Composr, Publii, and Bludit... I genuinely don't have time to check everything at the moment... Besides, I haven't even heard of those things before, so

But I will get to them eventually...

 

[fffop]

in all solutions, look if the features you want CAN be static.
If you want dynamic customisation several times per page and per user, any cache mechanism will not be able to do its work, and it WILL be slow whatever you decide.


With modern systems, if you are building pages that can be cached and optimized media, most will work good and little PHP will run.
With dedicated cache plugins, or WP Static or equivalent
Of course you want to avoid additional layers of builders, fonts, ... (=all the basics that you know for sure)

 

[CPANathan]

didn't have time, I'm already swamped in options that I want to check out, I barely got to eliminate (earlier today) Ghost, Grav, HTMLy, and Concrete from my list.

Right now I'm still checking CMS Made Simple, Xoops, ModX, Composr, Publii, and Bludit... I genuinely don't have time to check everything at the moment... Besides, I haven't even heard of those things before, so

But I will get to them eventually...

Oooh, did I suggest that already sorry dude

really appreciate the reading material

 

[fps216]

How were you hosting wordpress that made it so expensive? Wordpress expenses when self hosted is almost free.

You can load a website relatively quick with cache too.

I built two websites this year using bricks builder and they get almost 100 score on google analytics speed test. Have you heard of bricks builder for wp?

Sony Music and the White House, just to name two, use wordpress.

 

[tazarbm]

Have you heard of bricks builder for wp?

nope! And at this point I'm not interested in it either

I already found something (Bludit) so I'll try to make this work...

 

[fps216]

Goodluck with Bludit.

Here is a short list if you decide to explore other options.

 

[tazarbm]

Goodluck with Bludit.

Here is a short list if you decide to explore other options.

View attachment 475013

most of these I did check 2 days ago (I spent an entire day.... more than a day actually, but nevermind) installing and looking at each one of them

But thanks for the list, there are a few in here that I still haven't checked (bravenet, silex, temper, mmm, cargo, framer, webstudio), so I'll have a look...

And speaking of bravenet, I think this is only available to members of Brave.net hosting (which I used to be part of some 15 years when they were newbies), but some years ago they've overhauled their entire site, and they've become more expensive (they're probably still good though) so I had to leave them... But I didn't know they had a site builder, I mean back when I was using them they didn't have one... I think... I don't remember...

But yeah, thanks for the list, I'll see if I can find the time today to check some of these out, but otherwise I'm set on using Bludit...