Ban tech support related topics

[proxified]

Every other day we see topics related to tech support, which is one of the most common scams these days, I wonder why they are still allowed on bhw considering their illegal nature and the innocent people getting scammed by these bunch of idiots who can goto any extent for few bucks.

I would strongly suggest to ban these topics for keeping the community clean from illegal stuff and scammers of course.

 

[BHW-News]

We can't really ban topics related to tech support but if you can link me to a couple of examples of the threads you mean, I can have a look at them and see if there's something we can do?

 

[ShiningWarrior]

Every other day we see topics related to tech support, which is one of the most common scams these days, I wonder why they are still allowed on bhw considering their illegal nature and the innocent people getting scammed by these bunch of idiots who can goto any extent for few bucks.

I would strongly suggest to ban these topics for keeping the community clean from illegal stuff and scammers of course.

U mean paid tech support related topics? Should have mentioned the word. Because lots of people post regular tech problem topics too and get help from members.

 

[Sephrata]

https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/pay-per-call-tech-support.1046991/
https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/tech-support-canada-us.1012462/
https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/tech-support-calls.1018934/
https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/is-anyone-into-black-hat-seo-for-computer-repairs-and-tech-support.1031065/
https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/wtb-tech-support-popup-calls.1036243/
https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/tech-support-campaign.1040444/
https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/any-publisher-with-tech-support-traffic.1040823/

I know this is a blackhat forum, but all these tech support call centres do is scam innocent people out of $100s, or even $1,000s:

https://www.engadget.com/2018/07/30/scamming-tech-support-scammers/?guccounter=1
https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/features/tech-support-scams
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/03/world/asia/india-call-centers-fraud-americans.html
https://www.guru3d.com/news-story/ftc-settles-with-operators-of-infamous-fake-microsoft-tech-support-scam.html
https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/press-releases/2018/06/ftc-reaches-settlement-defendant-related-tech-support-scam
https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/press-releases/2017/10/ftc-obtains-settlements-operators-tech-support-scams

 

[proxified]

We can't really ban topics related to tech support but if you can link me to a couple of examples of the threads you mean, I can have a look at them and see if there's something we can do?

@Sephrata just listed them. There must be alot more than just these.

U mean paid tech support related topics? Should have mentioned the word. Because lots of people post regular tech problem topics too and get help from members.

No, i din't mean that. Please lookup at the topics @Sephrata just mentioned above.

 

[Jiung]

What if I'm genuinely trying to find help for tech support so that I can help local computer businesses gain more leads?

There are legit sides to this, so I don't think tech support in general can't be banned. And also, if the post says they're just promoting tech call offer, we don't know if the person paying for leads is scamming or is actually doing their job and securing sales.

But, if it's genuinely used to promote a scam then individually reporting these posts seems to be the best solution as they're just a handful from a thousand. No need to ban an entire viable method here.

 

[Wilson Grant Fisk]

The amazing thing about these wannbe tech support scammers is that most of them are pretty bad at it and come here begging for instructions on how to do it.
I would support a ban on the topic as IMO they are worse than eWhores.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technical_support_scam
https://www.google.com/search?q=paid+tech+support+scam
https://www.csoonline.com/article/3...ms-are-on-the-rise-up-24-warns-microsoft.html
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/4013405/windows-protect-from-tech-support-scams
https://www.zdnet.com/article/windo...ammers-are-ramping-up-attacks-says-microsoft/
https://www.tomsguide.com/us/tech-support-scam-microsoft,news-27039.html
https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/blog/2018/03/refunding-10-million-after-tech-support-scam
https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/blog/2018/07/warn-your-friends-about-tech-support-scams

 

[Sephrata]

What if I'm genuinely trying to find help for tech support so that I can help local computer businesses gain more leads?

Google banned all tech support businesses from advertising on their platform, with the exception for known big companies like Symantec, because so many people were getting scammed. The same scammers then moved into the flight booking business and as a result, Google is banning all flight booking businesses that do not have a verifiable brick & mortar walk-in office.

It's unfortunate for legitimate businesses getting caught up amongst the scammers, but it is almost an inevitability. 99% of the people posting on here about tech support campaigns are doing so, knowing fully well that they are scamming innocent people. Their moral compass is so messed up, they don't know the difference between right or wrong when it comes to making money.

Another aspect to this is some of these fake tech support businesses often will ask for remote access to 'fix' someone's infected computer. After gaining access, they use any stored bank account details or card numbers to transfer money or buy things like gift cards.

Here are more articles about the issue - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-40430048 https://gizmodo.com/microsoft-warns-that-tech-support-scams-are-still-on-th-1825502696

 

[proxified]

What if I'm genuinely trying to find help for tech support so that I can help local computer businesses gain more leads?

There are legit sides to this, so I don't think tech support in general can't be banned. And also, if the post says they're just promoting tech call offer, we don't know if the person paying for leads is scamming or is actually doing their job and securing sales.

But, if it's genuinely used to promote a scam then individually reporting these posts seems to be the best solution as they're just a handful from a thousand. No need to ban an entire viable method here.

Well, we're not really talking just tech support here, we're talking about the "tech support scam" so the general one's won't get hurt with it.

The amazing thing about these wannbe tech support scammers is that most of them are pretty bad at it and come here begging for instructions on how to do it.
I would support a ban on the topic as IMO they are worse than eWhores.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technical_support_scam
https://www.google.com/search?q=paid+tech+support+scam
https://www.csoonline.com/article/3...ms-are-on-the-rise-up-24-warns-microsoft.html
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/4013405/windows-protect-from-tech-support-scams
https://www.zdnet.com/article/windo...ammers-are-ramping-up-attacks-says-microsoft/
https://www.tomsguide.com/us/tech-support-scam-microsoft,news-27039.html
https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/blog/2018/03/refunding-10-million-after-tech-support-scam
https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/blog/2018/07/warn-your-friends-about-tech-support-scams

Well ewhores are still marketing, these guys are not marketing but spreading ransomware.

Google banned all tech support businesses from advertising on their platform, with the exception for known big companies like Symantec, because so many people were getting scammed. The same scammers then moved into the flight booking business and as a result, Google is banning all flight booking businesses that do not have a verifiable brick & mortar walk-in office.

It's unfortunate for legitimate businesses getting caught up amongst the scammers, but it is almost an inevitability. 99% of the people posting on here about tech support campaigns are doing so, knowing fully well that they are scamming innocent people. Their moral compass is so messed up, they don't know the difference between right or wrong when it comes to making money.

Another aspect to this is some of these fake tech support businesses often will ask for remote access to 'fix' someone's infected computer. After gaining access, they use any stored bank account details or card numbers to transfer money or buy things like gift cards.

Here are more articles about the issue - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-40430048 https://gizmodo.com/microsoft-warns-that-tech-support-scams-are-still-on-th-1825502696

its not just actually a scam since most of them are involved in ransomware too.

 

[Sephrata]

There's someone with a JV for this very thing now - https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/jv-looking-for-publisher-pay-per-call-tech-support-niche.1047429/

The BHW terms state:

As part of Black Hat World's guidelines, please be advised that Black Hat World does not encourage or promote any posts or discussions concerning unlawful activities, fraud, or deception, including posts or discussions relating to fraudulent activities such as "Cookie Stuffing," "E-Whoring," "PVA" activities, or using classified ads in a deceptive manner.

The UK and US authorities are taking action and prosecuting people for fraud for running these tech support scams. This in itself should mean that it's a questionable activity here asking for help to run these campaigns or buying calls for them, even if it's not explicitly against the rules.

Another thing is we're not talking about small amounts of money here. According to the BBC article, Action Fraud says the average age of victims is 62 and they typically pay out £600.

 

[proxified]

There's someone with a JV for this very thing now - https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/jv-looking-for-publisher-pay-per-call-tech-support-niche.1047429/

The BHW terms state:

As part of Black Hat World's guidelines, please be advised that Black Hat World does not encourage or promote any posts or discussions concerning unlawful activities, fraud, or deception, including posts or discussions relating to fraudulent activities such as "Cookie Stuffing," "E-Whoring," "PVA" activities, or using classified ads in a deceptive manner.

The UK and US authorities are taking action and prosecuting people for fraud for running these tech support scams. This in itself should mean that it's a questionable activity here asking for help to run these campaigns or buying calls for them, even if it's not explicitly against the rules.

Another thing is we're not talking about small amounts of money here. According to the BBC article, Action Fraud says the average age of victims is 62 and they typically pay out £600.

@Apricot please look into this.

 

[daveblackhat]

@Apricot please look into this.

Proxified I have been trying to DM . you but it wont let me for creation of 150 IG accounts. Please DM me so we can discuss ASAP. Thanks.

 

[Deleted member 708208]

worse than eWhores.

Not right to disparage pleasure engineers like that.

 

[Gogol]

BHW already started doing so, great to see!! e.g.. https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/tech-support-canada-us.1012462/

 

[BHW-News]

@Apricot please look into this.

I've closed most of the linked threads as there wasn't enough info to be able to verify that the discussion is about a legitimate service.

So..

We can't automatically ban all discussion of tech support related topics. Yes, I'm aware that a large proportion of them are likely to be fraudulent but we can't just assume guilt by association. So, as long as the poster makes it very clear that the discussion is about legitimate tech support services and provides information to back that up, then we can't justify closing the thread.

However, if this information isn't provided, report the thread and we'll close it. We've started carrying out random spot checks on HAF, WTB and JV threads to make sure that the services are not breaking the rules - we'll include tech support threads in that rotation too.

Ultimately, we want to clamp down on fraudulent services but we can't apply blanket penalties to anyone talking about the subject. As long as there's enough evidence to reasonably believe the service isn't fraudulent - great. But if this isn't provided, or if we then receive subsequent reports or information that it's been purposely misrepresented, we'll close the thread and take the appropriate action against the OP.

 

[proxified]

I've closed most of the linked threads as there wasn't enough info to be able to verify that the discussion is about a legitimate service.

So..

We can't automatically ban all discussion of tech support related topics. Yes, I'm aware that a large proportion of them are likely to be fraudulent but we can't just assume guilt by association. So, as long as the poster makes it very clear that the discussion is about legitimate tech support services and provides information to back that up, then we can't justify closing the thread.

However, if this information isn't provided, report the thread and we'll close it. We've started carrying out random spot checks on HAF, WTB and JV threads to make sure that the services are not breaking the rules - we'll include tech support threads in that rotation too.

Ultimately, we want to clamp down on fraudulent services but we can't apply blanket penalties to anyone talking about the subject. As long as there's enough evidence to reasonably believe the service isn't fraudulent - great. But if this isn't provided, or if we then receive subsequent reports or information that it's been purposely misrepresented, we'll close the thread and take the appropriate action against the OP.

Thanks for stepping up and clarifying it. I really appreciate that.

 

[sammycooly]

maybe you want to also forbid support? in my opinion this is a normal topic for discussion. but that's how to get into this - it's already bad.