Actual use of BTC

[honestIM]

GBP stopped being backed by gold years ago bruhhh... 89 years ago in fact
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...k-of-England-abandoned-the-gold-standard.html




What kind of warped logic is this? Of course it stores value, if value is volatile it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

The reason for gold standard to be abandon is to facilitate more paper money printing (which results in falling value in currency itself). However each GBP issued is backed by the govt of England whereas for BTC (or any other crypto) it is back by the crowd confidence. The govt holds all the resources in the country thus their backing and guaranteed means that repaying value promised on the note would be possible (aka through issuing more debt debentures) but then again, country like Argentina has failed to repay their sovereignty debt in the past too. However you do not expect big countries like USA, China, Russia to default on their debt obligation. Not that it won't happen but the chances are very slim. Whereas for Crypto, this portion is missing. Therefore the crowd confidence is more important aspect for crypto.

Crypto values lies in the public confidence in it. At this point in time, confidence is all time high. But one single big bad news can easily affect the confidence level. Example, wild fluctuation of BTC value causes merchants to ditch usage of BTC as one of the payment mode.

Between a currency and crypto, I think it is not an apple to apple comparison.
BTC is in a different class on its own as crypto backed by crowd confidence level
Currency is backed and guaranteed by the respective government (and govt is the only institution that is legally allowed to print more money)

@MikeyMikey13 is just being kind hearted to do some warning to the public. I also agree that the value of BTC is too high and I expect it to go even higher now that Wall street is involved through future trading. From more than ten years trading the market, i can tell you that things are not going to turn out well.As these people from WS are sharks.. they will feed the market till it is fat and round (aka pushing up the price of crypto to unrealistic level) before shorting them and crashing the value out of them. Maybe 90% of the value of BTC before they enter the market again to repeat the same trick. Usually when the value falls about 25% they will push that asset value up slightly to attract value buyers as they know that the market liquidity is insufficient. So they will do this by batches and eventually crashing the market.

Think I am talking nonsense? You can seek anyone working in WS trading desk and ask if what I am saying is true. WS traders are sharks and bloodless. They make money through milking innocent public who are blinded by greed.

 

[alwaystoday]

The reason for gold standard to be abandon is to facilitate more paper money printing (which results in falling value in currency itself). However each GBP issued is backed by the govt of England whereas for BTC (or any other crypto) it is back by the crowd confidence. The govt holds all the resources in the country thus their backing and guaranteed means that repaying value promised on the note would be possible (aka through issuing more debt debentures) but then again, country like Argentina has failed to repay their sovereignty debt in the past too. However you do not expect big countries like USA, China, Russia to default on their debt obligation. Not that it won't happen but the chances are very slim. Whereas for Crypto, this portion is missing. Therefore the crowd confidence is more important aspect for crypto.

Crypto values lies in the public confidence in it. At this point in time, confidence is all time high. But one single big bad news can easily affect the confidence level. Example, wild fluctuation of BTC value causes merchants to ditch usage of BTC as one of the payment mode.

Between a currency and crypto, I think it is not an apple to apple comparison.
BTC is in a different class on its own as crypto backed by crowd confidence level
Currency is backed and guaranteed by the respective government (and govt is the only institution that is legally allowed to print more money)

@MikeyMikey13 is just being kind hearted to do some warning to the public. I also agree that the value of BTC is too high and I expect it to go even higher now that Wall street is involved through future trading. From more than ten years trading the market, i can tell you that things are not going to turn out well.As these people from WS are sharks.. they will feed the market till it is fat and round (aka pushing up the price of crypto to unrealistic level) before shorting them and crashing the value out of them. Maybe 90% of the value of BTC before they enter the market again to repeat the same trick. Usually when the value falls about 25% they will push that asset value up slightly to attract value buyers as they know that the market liquidity is insufficient. So they will do this by batches and eventually crashing the market.

Think I am talking nonsense? You can seek anyone working in WS trading desk and ask if what I am saying is true. WS traders are sharks and bloodless. They make money through milking innocent public who are blinded by greed.

Bitcoin is not a bubble. Price is not too high. I think price of ferrari is too high, that doesn't make it so.

The trading desk analogy doesn't hold, and this goes right to the heart of why bitcoin is so revolutionary, it's decentralised, and not at the whim of large banking institutions.

 

[X-R0]

I think everyone investing with different thoughts and hopes and some (I would say the majority) is investing in crypto because they want to stick with a future technology which is obviously revolutionizing the hole world.
Sure bitcoins have their problems/ downsides and nobody know's what is happening in the future, but I think 10 years later bitcoin remains as an important and valuable asset.

 

[Dread Pirate Roberts]

paid anothing on internet . altenative CC . anonymous payment without detail information etc .

 

[honestIM]

Bitcoin is not a bubble. Price is not too high. I think price of ferrari is too high, that doesn't make it so.

The trading desk analogy doesn't hold, and this goes right to the heart of why bitcoin is so revolutionary, it's decentralised, and not at the whim of large banking institutions.

I think everyone investing with different thoughts and hopes and some (I would say the majority) is investing in crypto because they want to stick with a future technology which is obviously revolutionizing the hole world.
Sure bitcoins have their problems/ downsides and nobody know's what is happening in the future, but I think 10 years later bitcoin remains as an important and valuable asset.

I think it is important to differentiate between the tech behind bitcoin aka Blockchain tech and BTC. Both are different. Blockchain tech is the one that is revolutionising. BTC is a by product of this revolution. The one that creates indefinite future possibility is blockchain tech and not BTC. From my reading and understanding, alot of people confuses BTC and blockchain tech and often associating them together.

 

[moviemoney]

What makes you think btc is not a currency? As far as I am aware this is still disputed and something being volatile can still store value. Any of the other currencies are also volatile, in lesser degrees or are you saying you have invented or decreed the degree of volatileness of what can or cannot be a currency, all by yourself?

Why do you think anything that can be used as currency, regardless if it is nor is not currency, needs to have a unique use to be useful? Something which has a mass of uses is in many cases more powerful then a single or segmented unique feature.
This thread is pointless as so many others you make

 

[MikeyMikey13]

What makes you think btc is not a currency? As far as I am aware this is still disputed and something being volatile can still store value. Any of the other currencies are also volatile, in lesser degrees or are you saying you have invented or decreed the degree of volatileness of what can or cannot be a currency, all by yourself?

What kind of warped logic is this? Of course it stores value, if value is volatile it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Yes, I was wrong on the GBP, but not the dollar. My bad.

And it doesn't have a store of value. I can recieve £1 worth of bitcoin today, and it could be worth 90p tomorrow when I want to buy my milk. That is not storing value. Just because something goes up, does not mean it stores value.

This is also the difference between fiat currency and btc.

Another funny thing is, companies always say: pay 9$ in BTC or whatever. Why do they never offer a fixed price in btc? Oh yes, because it doesn't store value.

Why do you think anything that can be used as currency, regardless if it is nor is not currency, needs to have a unique use to be useful? Something which has a mass of uses is in many cases more powerful then a single or segmented unique feature.
This thread is pointless as so many others you make

This thread isn't pointless, I just asked for uses. Which you clearly couldn't provide.

In regard to unique features. It can't do anything I can't do with my bank account, or with cash in my hand. My cash/bank account is also more widely accepted.

Money moves way way way quicker with a bank, in the UK can take less than 1 minute. BTC can be 20 mins-6 hours.

The blockchain isn't unique to bitcoin.

If I buy a share in Coca cola, it has unique products/features. Buy real estate I have full dominion over the property. Buy oil, I own it.


Bitcoin doesn't have a unique feature that I can't do with GBP/USD Etc.

 

[moviemoney]

The level of uneducated replies by you is incredible.

And it doesn't have a store of value. I can recieve £1 worth of bitcoin today, and it could be worth 90p tomorrow when I want to buy my milk. That is not storing value. Just because something goes up, does not mean it stores value.

The reason you can expect to purchase milk tomorrow for 0.90p tomorrow with the 0.9p you have today, is because it is denominated in the same currency.
The same way you could buy milk today for for example 0.9btc (example number) if the milk is priced in the same currency tomorrow
but you are comparing apples with oranges / btc and GBP 2 different currencies
Its as comparing Zimbabwe dollar to the GBP and even that is not a good comparison as btc is much more complex
like any currency they will fluctuate according to each other but not in respect to itself, in respect to itself they hold the same value aside from fiat inflation

it just means it has less domain in which items are priced in btc due to its volatility but this will change over time when it reaches its cap and becomes widespread and common use in a specific region. All of this will change when crypto will get their primary regions domains as primary currency but it does not change the fact they store value

 

[MikeyMikey13]

The level of uneducated replies by you is incredible.


The reason you can expect to purchase milk tomorrow for 0.90p tomorrow with the 0.9p you have today, is because it is denominated in the same currency.
The same way you could buy milk today for for example 0.9btc (example number) if the milk is priced in the same currency tomorrow
but you are comparing apples with oranges / btc and GBP 2 different currencies
Its as comparing Zimbabwe dollar to the GBP and even that is not a good comparison as btc is much more complex
like any currency they will fluctuate according to each other but not in respect to itself, in respect to itself they hold the same value aside from fiat inflation

it just means it has less domain in which items are priced in btc due to its volatility but this will change over time when it reaches its cap and becomes widespread and common use in a specific region. All of this will change when crypto will get their primary regions domains as primary currency but it does not change the fact they store value

Uneducated replies? How so all knowing Moviemoney? You must have cash falling out your pockets with your knowledge?

At what point do you see a mass adaptation of BTC into general currency? What region? It most certainly won't be in western countries. I could possibly see it replacing something like M-pesa, but not Bitcoin. Something else using blockchain.

In regards to 0.9btc... no you couldn't. You are completely wrong. People are not using it as a currency, they are using it as a means of exchanging their local currency. No one will adopt btc to buy milk (as in list the price as btc...) due to the fact it doesn't store it's value. It is merely a fad means of exchange. Similar to a cheque.

The economy is all about faith. Why the GBP fall 10-15% overnight after the Brexit referendum? Did the UK economy suddenly become 10% weaker? Nope. But people lost faith so the currency dip.
My BTC will never be less than $1k simply because I own zero of it. In my opinion other coins have more potential to grow so I put my money elsewhere. Also I invest in crypto only money I can afford to lose comfortably. Is it gamble? Sure it is. BTC may crash tomorrow dragging every other coin down. I am fine with this. However I think that is more likely all of the top 20 coins to grew by at least 100% next year simply because its still a boutique investment - the masses did not enter this market yet - when they do the prices will raise. Probably at some point will crash, but I plan to cashout before that. Like I said I am in for the money.

Just shut up with the rubbish you are typing. You contradict yourself and it is embarrassing.

I don't care what people think. I asked for unique features. You just talk about investment opportunities.

 

[moviemoney]

At what point do you see a mass adaptation of BTC into general currency? What region?

if when how are all interesting topics
however the point I made which completely passed you, is btc is a currency as it stores value
As you said, it has 4 defining characteristics
Having a domain/region/primary currency of a certain region is NOT one of those defining instruments

Anyway who cares anyway? It all does not matter what the semantics are, in the end what matters is, is the result and consequence of actions not the meaning of words. Words are often inadequate to explain many phenomena and used as a form of abbreviation in my opinion to classifiy something complex into something as simple as a word.

Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler.- Albert Einstein
Words often do not do this and are abused to make things look/feel/etc simpler than they actually are. For example using the word currency and old requirements set before btc of currency. Besides anyone can make a definition at any point in time, being widely circulate it to make it like a standard, does not mean it is the right one.

/end rant

I believe btc will go a long mile but it WILL fade in the end and the things it starts will be a new era marked in the history of mankind. The world connected through its computing power which through its inspiration will provide actual use in actualy unique elements which I think is what you wanted to illustrate. One day. I hope sooner than later this will spark the real rise of true AI


- Just another peasant

 

[MikeyMikey13]

I believe btc will go a long mile but it WILL fade in the end and the things it starts will be a new era marked in the history of mankind. The world connected through its computing power which through its inspiration will provide actual use in actualy unique elements which I think is what you wanted to illustrate. One day. I hope sooner than later this will spark the real rise of true AI

I love that, another peasant. Seems as we are in agreement. You believe bitcoin will fail, and something will replace it. You must be a peasant too

Hopefully, next time you try to use your "inadequate" words you'll do some research.

 

[Doozle22]

Uses of Bitcoin aren't been used by many bitcoin holders. It's right now just a store of value or an investment.

 

[AngelSeo]

Just shut up with the rubbish you are typing. You contradict yourself and it is embarrassing.

I don't care what people think. I asked for unique features. You just talk about investment opportunities.

Are you special snowflake or what? No one is investing in Bitcoin for "unique features" since the first few years. However this days are long gone, now everyone is in for the money, at least when we talk about Bitcoin, some alt coins still have idealists buying them for the idea, not solely for money. Also when your question is "why you invest in Bitcoins" you are going to receive answers about investment opportunities, deal with it. I am not contradicting myself, but you just don't like the answer to your question because it doesn't fit your (narrow) perspective. If I am embarrassing myself that's non of your business. And for the last you being unable to put a single argument against me and telling me to shut up is plain stupid. But I guess that's the best you can.

 

[MikeyMikey13]

Are you special snowflake or what? No one is investing in Bitcoin for "unique features" since the first few years. However this days are long gone, now everyone is in for the money, at least when we talk about Bitcoin, some alt coins still have idealists buying them for the idea, not solely for money. Also when your question is "why you invest in Bitcoins" you are going to receive answers about investment opportunities, deal with it. I am not contradicting myself, but you just don't like the answer to your question because it doesn't fit your (narrow) perspective. If I am embarrassing myself that's non of your business. And for the last you being unable to put a single argument against me and telling me to shut up is plain stupid. But I guess that's the best you can.

I said why do you invest in bitcoin (other than the reason of money) - I could have said "why do you buy bitcoin", if that would have made you feel better sweetie.

And i'm glad you know that no one is investing in btc for its unique features, and I assume you have sources and data to back this up?

Doesn't fit my mindset? I believe Btc will fail, and a coin will replace it. You can't prove me wrong, I can't prove you wrong.

Throughout this entire thread i've put plenty of arguments up about bticoins, you've just tried to ride on one comment I made that was incorrect regarding GBP. But you clearly don't understand investments. This is forex/binary trading all over again.

 

[sjohne]

The unique feature of BTC (as a currency in comparison with say the USD) is that there is no inflation and no central authority.

 

[MikeyMikey13]

The unique feature of BTC (as a currency in comparison with say the USD) is that there is no inflation and no central authority.

No inflation? Wait until it drops.

 

[Doozle22]

The unique feature of BTC (as a currency in comparison with say the USD) is that there is no inflation and no central authority.

Their is also no fiat money for bitcoin or anything to back Bitcoin's price besides demand through the finite amount.

 

[sjohne]

No inflation? Wait until it drops.

You obviously don't understand what inflation is.

Their is also no fiat money for bitcoin or anything to back Bitcoin's price besides demand through the finite amount.

Now do you mean that as a benefit or a downside? I quite like other cryptos e.g. dash better because they offer the same value as bitcoin (monetary storage) but also other things like fast, cheap, international transaction - like a credit card on steroids.

 

[AngelSeo]

I said why do you invest in bitcoin (other than the reason of money) - I could have said "why do you buy bitcoin", if that would have made you feel better sweetie.

And i'm glad you know that no one is investing in btc for its unique features, and I assume you have sources and data to back this up?

Doesn't fit my mindset? I believe Btc will fail, and a coin will replace it. You can't prove me wrong, I can't prove you wrong.

Throughout this entire thread i've put plenty of arguments up about bticoins, you've just tried to ride on one comment I made that was incorrect regarding GBP. But you clearly don't understand investments. This is forex/binary trading all over again.

Ok, some features you are looking for:
1. Its not depending of local economies/currencies. I have lived in hyperinflation - its not fun - at some point the monthly salary was enough for pack of cigarettes. Holding some money into cryptos can save you in such time. Even if situation is not that bad, still having some money stored in non-local currency is good decision (as my example earlier with GBP after the referendum - losing 10% value overnight is no fun as well). Which lead us to the next one:
2. Safety storage of wealth. Sure, I can buy dollars/GBP/Euro as non-local currency, but where I am going to keep them? Under the mattress? In bank (just last year the 3rd biggest bank in my country went south)? Having crypto in your off-line wallet is like keeping the money under the mattress, but way, way more secure.
3. Part of diverse portfolio. Sure, this is not "unique", but diversity is good for your investment portfolio. Having 5-10% invested in high risk/high reward can be very beneficial. You can go for some start ups, but this hardly can be done with $500..
4. The cool factor. Every cool kid is into cryptos. Sure, may sound silly, but with morning coffee people are discussing cryptos now, giving them feeling like they are Wall street mofos. You should not underestimate what people are willing to do to be "cool".

 

[MikeyMikey13]

Ok, some features you are looking for:
1. Its not depending of local economies/currencies. I have lived in hyperinflation - its not fun - at some point the monthly salary was enough for pack of cigarettes. Holding some money into cryptos can save you in such time. Even if situation is not that bad, still having some money stored in non-local currency is good decision (as my example earlier with GBP after the referendum - losing 10% value overnight is no fun as well). Which lead us to the next one:
2. Safety storage of wealth. Sure, I can buy dollars/GBP/Euro as non-local currency, but where I am going to keep them? Under the mattress? In bank (just last year the 3rd biggest bank in my country went south)? Having crypto in your off-line wallet is like keeping the money under the mattress, but way, way more secure.
3. Part of diverse portfolio. Sure, this is not "unique", but diversity is good for your investment portfolio. Having 5-10% invested in high risk/high reward can be very beneficial. You can go for some start ups, but this hardly can be done with $500..
4. The cool factor. Every cool kid is into cryptos. Sure, may sound silly, but with morning coffee people are discussing cryptos now, giving them feeling like they are Wall street mofos. You should not underestimate what people are willing to do to be "cool".

1. You could invest in any other currency than your own, then you wouldn't have an issue with hyperinflation. But you are right, it does give you a benefit.
2. Have you not read about all the wallets being hacked from online wallets (doesn't apply to offline, obviously)? Seems much safer to use a bank imo, insured and backed by the government.
3. Fair point- but not a unique feature to bitcoin
4. lame... lol.

Thanks for the reply though. I agree your top two are fair points, depending on what country you are in

You obviously don't understand what inflation is.

I understand what deflation is, and it could very well happen to bitcoin.

And yes it does affect it. In the UK if inflation rises a pint of milk, I can't escape that just because I used btc as a payment method. Nonsense.