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The Ethics and Morals Thread - No fighting just discussing please

Discussion in 'Black Hat SEO' started by yao1994, Aug 13, 2009.

  1. yao1994

    yao1994 Regular Member

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    Back when I first found about BHW, the methods here were all bending the rules of the "IM ethics code". Like BH SEO, spamming and such that were mainly breaking the business side of IM.

    It's been more than a year now on this awesome forum (I now basically spend quarter of my day reading *and taking action which is very important). BHW is my second family.

    Now days I see all these methods that is just straight out BH the customer (especially in CL were 99% lying to get a lead).

    I'm not trying to start a fight a say what is right (infact I AM TRYING TO FIND THE ANSWER).

    What's your take on ethics?

    ALL thoughts would be awesome.

    Thanks
     
  2. dizz

    dizz Elite Member

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    Ethics are subjective to the person looking at themselves... It may be ethical for someone to go on a mass killing spree of persons who offend his religious beliefs and think that its for the greater good. My ethical view is that eventually if you do something bad, someone is going to do it back to you.... It may not be today, or tomorrow, but someday.... The world or whatever you believe in will bite you back... Good luck on this not becoming a flamed thread... LOL... I hope everyone speaks upon this subject with intelligence. Have a good day and happy money making
     
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  3. biginch

    biginch Regular Member

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    You will never find an answer to that question. Everyones ethics is their on system of principles. What works for 1 person and may seem ethical to them, may not seem the same to another...

    Just remember that at least 1 time in everyones life they have done at least 1 thing that was not ethically right in the eyes of others.
     
  4. ironlifter76

    ironlifter76 Registered Member

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    yao1994,

    Interesting thread and I am anxious to see some of the answers and the reasoning behind those answers. For me, and I emphasize for me...I try to follow what was said by a great man some many years ago. "Treat people like you want to be treated". So, if I don't want to be lied to or scammed to make a few bucks then I won't do it to someone else.

    Regards,
    ironlifter76:coffee:
     
  5. MandatoryMagic

    MandatoryMagic Registered Member

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    Think of ethics this way... People in Africa think it is completely unethical that the US and other wealthy countries have the amazing access to food that we do. I mean while we are enjoying our pork roast and huge thanksgiving dinner, people in Africa are dying from starvation. Everything in life is unethical for the most part, but again, that is in the eye of the observer.
     
  6. Shine

    Shine BANNED BANNED

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    Ethics ? They went out the window weeks ago. take CU ewhoring for example.

    We are scamming them, there is no other way to put it. We are impersonating women to try and trick men into entering their cc details which will eventually charge them ALOT of money (but really how stupid do you have to be to put your cc details in these things?)

    At first I felt really bad, then I got my first $300 cheque. I dont feel so bad anymore.
     
  7. Djingel

    Djingel Junior Member

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    I think, the more you know of SEO and IM in general the more you'll be considered doing ethical things by other people. Making fun of Google's algorithm on large scale is even considered quite cool :)

    Someone who really knows his stuff wont have the need to lie to people in order to get leads.

    Lying to people like e-whoring is for me a big no no in this game. (I don't consider myself even average, but e-whoring is close to the lowest most pathetic thing you can do in IM and is really something for DP noobs in my opinion)
     
  8. cashermaster

    cashermaster BANNED BANNED

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    Hahah I HATE ewhoring every time I respond to them my dick shrivels up. EWWW *shivers*

    Other than that, we are NOT scamming them.

    Take the iPhone Email submits, they WILL get it if they follow it all through.But usually they don't.

    I'm not scamming, NOR lying. But it IS BLACKHAT, so it is SNEAKY.
     
  9. Timbo

    Timbo Regular Member

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    If you are ewhoring my suggestion is to ASK or RECOMMEND in your emails "Have you verified yet?" or "I recommend you verify and then get back to me" . But if you are saying I will meet you for sex if you first verify at cu then I am pretty sure that is fraud but I am not a lawyer. If you promise then dont deliver all of those earnings may go to pay for your attorney. If you are lying then that is immoral but anyones standards in our society or down thru history. However if you are only asking if they HAVE verified and they then cc verify on their own then you didnt coerce them based on a promise to deliver goods if they did verify. One is a reccomendation the other is a promise to deliver. And yes most of these guys are too embarrassed to go public but not all of them. I am not being an ass but we have to stick together here and that means being fully aware of the law and potential consequences. Then if you proceed fine. I realize there are some 19 year olds plus here who are diving in head first and we need to be clear on what may be a problem and how to help each other avoid those problems.


    BTW if you do ewhoring you can simply send them to a free signup link at an affiliate dating site and say something like "I got 30 responses from real people after my first day. Give it a try, No more chasing fake profiles."

    That way no lies. Just a reccommendation.

    Use some great salesmanship. Sell it without lying
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2009
  10. wakkaoaka

    wakkaoaka BANNED BANNED

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    If it feels wrong for you then it is unethical according to your own moral/ethical compass. Its not about what other people think is unethical or ethical because ethics are subjective.

    Blackhat is generally unethical by definition, what i got from blackhat marketing is creativity not theivery.
     
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  11. neo

    neo Power Member

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    Back when BHW was originally started, it was more of a BlackHat SEO forum. Things have changed.

    Bending the rules of conventional SEO is purely within ethical limits. We can use page generator, clocking etc without being feeling guilty because it is our site and google has no right to tell us what to do.
    However outright fraud is not ethical. And being black hat is not about being a scammer.
    -Neo
     
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  12. biks

    biks Power Member

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    I used to have ethical problems with humanity when I was younger. Things like:

    "Psychics are just scamming people out of their money, I need to explain things to their victims." or..
    "Don't they know that it's just snake oil they're buying? I need to explain things to the victims."

    I'm now building an astrology site and intend to make money off of the stupid. I'm also promoting CPA offers for anti-aging shit (snake oil) and hope to make money off of THOSE morons.

    I justify all this by saying "the non-stupid would never fall for any of this". This dovetails nicely with my "why aren't you wearing your seatbelt? You don't believe in the laws of physics?"
     
  13. gotstano

    gotstano Registered Member

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    Great thread. I'm not perfect by any means. I know of CPA offers I could market, in a certain way, to make money, but don't feel are right and therefore don't use. Then I don't have money to may my bills. Hmmm.
    Why do we have money anyway? Why do we have to pay to live on a planet where we were born? A lot of this doesn't make sense to me.
    I say, if you would feel weird explaining what you do to people you hold in high esteem, that's telling you something...
     
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    Last edited: Aug 14, 2009
  14. starbeezy

    starbeezy Newbie

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    To each is own, i agree that what's ethical and unenthical is subjective however you must know that the consequences for what you do. This is not to instill fear in anyone but know what you are getting into and if you want to continue to play the game, then play it...
     
  15. trushafty38

    trushafty38 Regular Member

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    Personally, IDK about morals any longer. I see those big houses and the nice cars and think that a lot of people have done stupid crooked things to get there. I can sleep easy as long as im feed good and have a nice roof over my head. Survival of the fittest still exists. For our world it has become a monetary thing. I personally don't like the fact that everything is about money. When you know you can count on your friends and family that is all that matters. FFFFFF the rest and get what you can. Why? Because morals are for poor people. Fake morals are for priests that have sex with little kids. And no morals is for idiots. Just treat your family and friends with respect and love and do your best in this world. We only get one shot at it. No sense in being broke at your mothers house the rest of your life. No sense in not going to visit all the beautiful places on this earth. Enjoy life. FFFFF everyone else.
     
  16. WizGizmo

    WizGizmo Super Moderator Staff Member Premium Member

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    When it comes time to pay the rent, try paying your landlord with "ethics". Then try to feed your family with "morals". Only then will you understand why Black Hat exists.

    Cheers! - "Wiz"
     
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    Last edited: Aug 14, 2009
  17. Squishy

    Squishy Newbie

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    I think of my "customers" as fish: If they're stupid enough to swim in my net, I'm going to gut and eat them.

    Humans are stupid - Roughly 80% or so are stupid enough to pay my bills.
     
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  18. Yukinari84

    Yukinari84 Elite Member

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    If anything seems unethical to you, then don't do it.

    Simple as that.

    What seems unethical to you may be something that I don't consider unethical at all.

    I run my business the way I see fit and accept full responsibility for everything that happens with my business - good and bad.

    To me, this is the only way to make sure you keep your business thriving.
     
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  19. keinehabe

    keinehabe Supreme Member

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    I`m thinking it's a personal meter , for example I`m '' into online job's since '99 '' well that's true on my side lol , thing is I`ve never touch or touched egay and CL ( not even small ones like alibaba and other ) .... why you will ask ... well I don't like to '' hit '' on innocent peoples , well I`ve done things which about I`m not so proud some of them even '' cross of the line of legality '' , but still have bad feelings about doing something which can touch innocent peoples , please note here I really enjoy to hit idiots/retards and such species when it's about money lol .
     
  20. portugalkix

    portugalkix BANNED BANNED

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    What is moral or ethic for me, for you can be unethical.

    It's like: In my life i'm guiding by my principles.
    And my principles, it's me that I choose.