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SEO - The Art of Bullshit, what to expect from an SEO?

Discussion in 'White Hat SEO' started by NovaflareFX, Jul 20, 2015.

  1. NovaflareFX

    NovaflareFX Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    If your like me and have been doing this for a long time, you must have realized that Google basically says you can not do anything without it being grey hat or blackhat.
    As such, I personally have no idea what I should be doing for my website's SEO to remain out of the spam radar. Many of what they say is bull, but I just don't know what's safe to do anymore.

    I know many SEO's that have a method, but all of you at some point have thought.. shit, should I be doing this anymore?!
    The last I checked, Guest Blogging was the thing, but apparently this has been a waste of time since 2011.

    For example, I paid an SEO company £250 per month for a while. What should I expect back? I would prefer 1 high quality link, but WHAT IS A HIGH QUALITY LINK.
    What I got was a few blog comments from relevant websites and a few well written articles placed on 3 PBN sites and 1 weekly updated, relevant web 2.0 per month.
    Is this good, bad? I don't even know.

    What should I expect if I paid £1,000 per month? I have done so with another provider for 3 months.
    What would you expect if you paid this per month?

    I've just had it with SEO, it just seems like the art of bullshit and for small businesses, it's just not possible to compete with larger firms without breaking the rules.
    But breaking the rules could cost you everything, so why start?
     
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    Last edited: Jul 20, 2015
  2. fredfred547

    fredfred547 Power Member

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    And here lies the problem with small business' use of SEO. Big firms will always outrank small companies. They're budget is 10x larger if not more. Personally if I was charging $270 a month (250 euros), I would be doing a little bit more but that's average for an SEO company. If you're paying 1000 euros per month, you should be seeing some sort of result unless it's an extremely competitive niche. Three months is enough to see movement. If there's no movement you're being ripped off. And pretty much any SEO is full on blackhat. PBNs, web 2.0s, you're already breaking the rules, that's just what SEO is. There is no such thing as "white hat" that's bullshit. If you were to actually do white hat SEO, you wouldn't see results. Like I said, I myself and other people here could probably offer you a little more bang for your buck in that $270 example, but what you're getting isn't unreasonable for the price.
     
  3. ranksonic

    ranksonic Junior Member Premium Member

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    Well.. do you have any other options? Seems like it's worthless to do SEO)) Actually I don't mind if somebody won't ;-)
     
  4. NovaflareFX

    NovaflareFX Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Amazingly useful comment.

    Thanks for the post, I think that's exactly what I see wrong here. Playing by the rules in this field seems to be a waste of time, ultimately, there are a lot of excellent sounding offers on this forums.
    But is legit and what is not? I can't see the difference between black, grey or white anymore, perhaps i'm just a little discouraged.

    I'm not so much after bang for buck, i'm after building a safe and reliable link empire over time which I just can't seem to find as people in general seem to offer very quick, cheap services instead of high end, dedicated SEO. I guess that's a problem with SEO, they usually have 20+ clients and your just one of many.

    Thanks bro :D
     
  5. asap1

    asap1 BANNED BANNED

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    You know, after learning and understanding SEO 99% of what you read is bullshit.

    SEO is fucking easy, I cannot stress this enough. I went from $0 to 2k+ a month ON MY VERY FIRST SITE I EVER DID SEO ON

    The best part is I ranked a 100k keyword, not one 100k keyword but TWO.

    Stop buying SEO from these "seo companies" they all keep you on a string and do minimal SEO so you stay with them and pay more.

    Learn SEO, understand what works, and buy the packages separately from the marketplace.
     
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  6. SkyrocketSEO

    SkyrocketSEO Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    Well, you want high, safe and reliable link profile for $250...not sure where you can get that
     
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  7. NovaflareFX

    NovaflareFX Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    That's the thing, I know a lot about SEO already and I know what Google is looking for, it's really simple if you think about it: Non-Spammed Crap on a decent site.
    But i'm not sure what the best way to move forward is or if i'm wasting my time doing certain activities such as blogging, guest posting, PBN, social spam etc.
    Do you have any personal suggestions? It looks like your quite far ahead of me but seemed to have thought the same as me at some point!


    Sorry, let me explain. I don't want to pay junk for garbage, that's exactly what I DONT want. I want to pay big for big wins but I can't seem to find that anywhere.
    It's easy to run an agency, asap1 hit it on the head, your just one of a crowd with many of these companies.

    With all of the talk on here, moz, wf and other forums, SEO seems to be a contradiction, every single person in this field seems to have a different opinion that works and nobody seems to have a solid answer to what does work, which is why it's hard to justify.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2015
  8. lostgringos

    lostgringos Senior Member

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    @fredfred547 a very accurate take on SEO. I like what you said partly because you did not try and get work from this guy. You just answered the question.

    I want to point to point out something you should know. For example, would you agree that anyone who is an expert at Online Reputation Management (RM) knows SEO? SEO is the cornerstone of RM.

    Let's take this a little further, the number one company for RM on the Internet right now is http://reputation.com.

    Silly people spend millions of dollars trying to get their reputation back with very little success. Is it possible that the most popular website for RM does not know about SEO?

    Before I answer that question I wan to point out three key components of SEO.
    It takes time to successfully rank a website in a Google search (SERPs).
    It takes allot of knowledge in terms of how to rank a website successfully in the SERPs.
    It takes lots of effort to rank a website.


    Do a Google search for reputation.com fraud!
    Look at all the negative comments about this site.
    Ask yourself how can they get rid of the bad reputation of others and they can't clean up their own mess?

    There is no definitive guide on how to do SEO and once these books are published most of these methods fall by the wayside. Beware of free guides that have lots of affiliate links in them. Everything changes when it comes to SEO because Google is always moving the goal post. They have effectively rendered most small business bankrupt when they try to use SEO on their own. Google wants everyone to use Google Adwords for SEO.

    By way of ending this comment, the first priority when doing good SEO is to do an extensive Keyword Campaign in terms of finding the keywords you want to target and if you can actually rank really well with them in the SERPs.

    In sum, I do not believe you can good SEO for competitive keywords for any less than $1,000 a week. Would you use Blackhat? Of course!
     
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  9. NovaflareFX

    NovaflareFX Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Excellent post, thanks a lot for that any all other posts so far! Apologies if my original tone was rude, SEO just seems to be a huge walking contradiction of things that people think work but aren't really too sure.
     
  10. fredfred547

    fredfred547 Power Member

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    I totally agree. If you can do SEO you can do ORM. Generally it ends up being part of SEO, especially if your client is ranking in the 8-pack on Google. If you rank a company with terrible reviews, you're actually doing them a disservice. SEO is really common sense but people try to pile on bullshit to sell it to people. Anyone with a little time on their hands and some motivation can sift through the heaps of shit on the internet and find what actually works.
     
  11. Apricot

    Apricot Administrator Staff Member Moderator

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    Friendly reminder: please stay on topic and if you see spam, report it and let us deal with it.
     
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  12. K.H.R

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  13. NovaflareFX

    NovaflareFX Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Thanks H.K.R, I think that's part of the problem. I know all of the parts of SEO, but i'm not sure what to do with them.
    A logical point would be to create content, promote it on a third party domain (or PBN) and socially share it, rinse and repeat but outreach to bigger fish.

    9/10 however, this will be a dead, pointless link which will have no visits, shares or link-backs.

    However, my logic is probably a few year behind. There are many posts saying what not to do, but none saying what a good thing to do is so i'm lost on where to start.
    My problem with PBN's is that they are usually 5- 10 years old, not linked to or used for years, have no traffic, are usually blocked from spiders and suddenly come back to link spam from the grave.
    If I was Google, I would just ban any web link that has these parameters.
     
  14. BassTrackerBoats

    BassTrackerBoats Super Moderator Staff Member Moderator Jr. VIP

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    With a PBN site, the best practice is to treat it like a regular site; backlink it in a normal fashion, add content on a regular basis, put an ad on it here and there and not use it for backlinks for some time after you resurrect it.

    It would then appear natural and not be a part of those that could get zapped due to appearing to be nothing more than a piece of a ranking puzzle.
     
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  15. SkyrocketSEO

    SkyrocketSEO Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    What is the niche that you actually want to target? is your site a "real" site or some 5 page aff thing?
     
  16. asap1

    asap1 BANNED BANNED

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    http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackhat-seo/white-hat-seo/775875-help-how-push-keyword-page-3-page-1-a.html#post8088291, this is all it takes to rank.

    Make sure no anchor text goes above 10% (besides url and branded) and you will be fine.

    Edit: I forgot to mention I also use http://www.linkauthority.com/main.php

    You can buy some cheap articles from http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackhat-seo/content-copywriting/739057-supercheaparticles-com-quality-content-only-0-4-100-words-satisfaction-guaranteed.html and post them on link authority's network.

    For $24 you can buy 20 300 word articles and you can place 2 links per article.

    So all in all you get 40 high pr links for just $24
     
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    Last edited: Jul 20, 2015
  17. onlineonly

    onlineonly Power Member

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    Thats not gonna happend because people buy expired domains all the time to create legit buisnesses. How can they know if the domain have been used before? Its only marketers and other people who do this for a living that check the history of domains before buying.
     
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  18. lostgringos

    lostgringos Senior Member

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    @KHR so buying packages is the way to go? Your packages maybe? There is no quick and easy way to rank a website nowadays. It will take you years to sift through all the lies regarding SEO. Maybe follow someone on their epic journey? Only to find out they are promoting an affiliate! Pick a few Black Hatters who have a decent rep. Get an idea of what they do. Don't even believe everything they say. Be smart and read between the lines. When someone says SEO is easy turn your back on them.

    Be careful buying bots that claim the world and deliver very little. Be wary of people promoting those bots as most are just affiliates and don't give a damn about you.

    Every time Google comes out with a new algorithm you can bet your ranking will get harder. So much so, you will likely need to buy Adwords from Google!

    Yes, there are sites that rank well in the SERPs but their ranking depends on many factors. Do want to know what really works? Start a company up like I did in the Philippines. Test and evaluate and test again. It is just as important to know what doesn't work just as much as what does work!

    Run from people promoting SEO when they use these words; effortless SEO, rank #1 in just a few days, quick and easy. I love guys who sell Snake Charm Oil like this LOL. You get the idea!
     
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  19. soccerlover

    soccerlover Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Rather than paying those amounts, you can learn SEO and rank up the site.
    It is easy :) not so hard though.
    you can grab video tutorials, read the posts over here, subscribe to top seo blogs.
     
  20. lostgringos

    lostgringos Senior Member

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    @sagarmanker most tutorials are setup to promote affiliate products. What you fail to understand is that the concepts behind professional SEO are not difficult to understand. What is difficult is implementing strategies! What software to use for all the tasks you need. Anyone who says SEO is easy just doesn't know what they are talking about! The problem with most people who "think" know SEO is that actually set themselves up to fail! They are in it for the quick buck and they come on BHW whining about how their website got sandbox and how much money they are losing.

    Nobody knows Google's algorithm here. NOBODY. It's all speculation! This not say that SEO cannot be done because it can. But you need to be smart about it. Even using Blackhat tools you need to use your head! Some tools they are selling for Twitter are basically useless. It is almost impossible to target various niches with Twitter and most often you will have fake followers following you! The bots just can't get quality followers. You will at one time or another have to go into most of these accounts and clean them up manually.

    I can get more quality niche followers spending 10 minutes a day on one Twitter account than having a Twitter bot running 24/7 on a server!

    SEO is easy. Bullshit!