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[SEO Question] What Do You Think About Pay Per Performance SEO?

Discussion in 'Black Hat SEO' started by SolidTactics, Sep 12, 2012.

  1. SolidTactics

    SolidTactics Power Member

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    Okay, so I see several seo agency's and consultants offering "pay per performance" seo services, aka client paying only after they rank. The concept is a very effective way to get prospects, however I'm wondering about the "nitty-gritty" fine print details in the contract. Is it really pay after you rank or is there usually stipulations, etc. I'm curious to know the best way to offer this service.

    Some idea's I had were:
    • Pay when you see an increase in ANY organic rankings, ie. position 500 to position 50.
    • Pay when any keyword ranks, long or short tail.

    Another question I am wondering about is the actual rate to charge once they rank? What is the best way to figure out a rate for this?

    Any and all feedback on any of the above concepts is greatly appreciated!
    :ranger:
     
  2. SolidTactics

    SolidTactics Power Member

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    wow no one has any ideas or suggestions? :(
     
  3. Endire

    Endire Elite Member Premium Member

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    Solidtactics,

    Great questions. I think you are on the right track with the ideas you provided. Perhaps some companies say in their "fine print" that any increase in rankings will warrant a charge for their services. I doubt any reputable SEO would promise number one ranking in exchange for payment or even close to that amount yet after looking at a client's niche and how hard it would be to rank for certain keywords, maybe that would be enough to tell if it's a good prospect to offer this deal to.

    As far as rate, you could approach this in a couple different ways. You could charge an hourly rate or a flat fee. There are obvious advantages and disadvantages to both approaches. For example with a flat fee, clients know what they are going to have to pay yet if you don't estimate the amount of work correctly, you could end up shorting yourself. The hourly rate solves this however the client then doesn't feel as comfortable. Its really easy to claim that 5 hours' worth of SEO work actually took 8.

    I have seen some agencies use a combination of both. For example, examine what it is your clients goals are and offer a predetermined set of services for the flat fee. The flat fee will be hour hourly rate multiplied by the number of hours you think it would take you to complete the work. You must be very clear to manage customer expectations here. Let them know what it is they are getting for the money and anything "extra" will be charged at the hourly rate. People almost always come back and say "oh I read about this being good for SEO could you do it real quick?" Before you know it you have done a bunch of extra work and your flat fee is shrinking.

    Hourly rates span from 20-50 dollars at the low end to around 100 dollars at the high end. There are some professionals that can command up to 1000 dollars per hour. Your rates are heavily dependent on the industry within which you are working, who your clients are and what the information is worth to them. For instance a small local business probably won't be willing to pay 550 dollars an hour for SEO services. A huge law firm with 10,000 employees on the other hand may see that fee as a drop in the bucket. The size and complexity of the website will also weigh heavily on what fee you charge.

    Check out this post from SEOMoz on charging for SEO services,

    http://www.seomoz.org/blog/in-seo-do-you-get-what-you-pay-for

    Hope that gives you some ideas,

    Shawn
     
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  4. flx89

    flx89 Senior Member

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    500 or 1000$/ hour for seo services? really? this must be a joke anyway
     
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  5. jsmith250

    jsmith250 Junior Member

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    My opinion is to buy some tools like scrapebox, GSA, SENuke... then can you rank your website, I don't believe in these services.
     
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  6. RobotDestruct

    RobotDestruct Junior Member

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    I've seen a few services attempt pay per rank , charge X amount for page 3 to 6, X amount for page 2 to 3, X amount for page 1 to 2 and X amount for ranking in the top 3 on page one. You have to make clients sign up for a 6 to 9 month contract, otherwise everyone will bail once they are ranking and do the rest themselves. You should also set up a system that charges them based on the keywords monthly search results and competition level and if they can type that in your site, and see in real time what they would be charged at the moment, then that would be great.
     
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  7. jb2008

    jb2008 Senior Member

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    If I ever hire any SEO service, I pay for performance only. I use a third party site with escrow like Vworker, so that I do not release the funds until X keyword is on page 1 stable for at least 1 week. I know what I am prepared to pay in advance due to my knowledge of how much these sites would make in ranked on page 1 for their keywords, so if I get an offer above that amount I reject it immediately. I get a lot of SEO "professionals" trying to charge me ridiculous rates, it's sad that this is the norm, they bid that much as they are used to ripping people off. I kindly tell these "professionals" to get on their bike.

    How the hell you are supposed to make a profit from your sites by paying SEO "experts" 1000 USD per hour, I will never know. Hell, $50 an hour is ridiculous too: ask yourself the question, is that person working 1 hour on your site going to make you more than $50 within the next few months? (Until the next algorithm update screws around with everything again.) Relatively little can be done in 1 hour so I would guess no.

    And SEO "experts" like Rand Fishface charging astronomical rates like $10,000 for a mere "consultation" - it's not robbery strictly speaking, but it may as well be.

    Keep your money, stay economical, estimate how much ranking each keyword on page 1, say #5, will make you within the next month. Do not spend more than that to rank that keyword. Err on the side of caution so in your estimates be conservative. This will enable you to remain profitable while other idiots pay $200 an hour or even $200 a month per keyword.

    And SEOmoz talking shite as usual.
     
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    Last edited: Sep 13, 2012
  8. apoorv

    apoorv Regular Member

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    Pay for performance, so far as I know, works on a traffic increased basis. Businesspeople aren't concerned with the keywords they want to rank for—you get them the keywords, the rankings and then, according to the increase in their traffic (or sales, conversions, leads, whatever is agreed upon), they pay you.

    There are several companies like these and the arrangement works great. The charges are not astronomical and as a client, you have nothing to lose.
     
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  9. therage

    therage Senior Member

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    LOL, any seo that I pay for is a one time deal OR for my non adsense and affiliate sales sites I take on around $600 a month max for good white hat seo. As of lately however, I have not worried about SERPS but rather ppc and ppv performances. If I were to charge any amount to do someone's SEO I would charge them $750 a month and give them ultra targeted traffic from one of my several ppc campaigns alongside exceptional services for their product or sales site. For a MFA site, I would just piggyback them on one of my Adwords campaigns as a "sponsor" and let them get converting clicks that way.

    That is a steal for some keywords, but not all. Then again, I know the strategy behind sales and PPC conversions. BHW download section, and BHW content download section has a lot of useful information on this subject. Read, try, and twist. Scale up on any money made and outsource. Done.
     
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  10. SolidTactics

    SolidTactics Power Member

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    I appreciate the feedback you guys have provided! If anyone else has any thoughts to share, I would love to hear them!