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people are so stupid - seo customer

Discussion in 'Black Hat SEO' started by Bartman, Oct 29, 2010.

  1. Bartman

    Bartman Power Member

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    I have to rant.
    I really enjoy SEO but only doing it for my own site. I dont want to deal with people's stupidity.
    I posted an ad for SEO on craigslist. The reason I posted the ad is I really enjoy SEO and I wanted to see if I could make a living doing this. well today this personal trainer emails me. He tells me "I want to be number one on google, how much?"
    I am like "WTF? number one for what keyword?"
    and then he says "I have a list of 200 keywords. Here is a sample: weight loss, strong muscles, core fitness, kick boxing, endurance, body toning...how much will you charge?"

    How do you explain to someone like this it doesnt work that way?
    Are all SEO clients this stupid?
    if so, then i would rather go back to my old boring job.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2010
  2. determined

    determined Regular Member

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    Yes, lol I think they are all really that dumb. Hell, half the people that know what SEO is are that dumb. How much more the people who only know what it means not how to do it.
     
  3. googlemonster

    googlemonster Supreme Member

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    10k a month? I get/got this working in an office as an SEO, and also a client. Some retarded shit I got was:

    Why does traffic go down between 2pm-3pm?
    Traffic is down 13% since last week, why?
    Can you give me reports on when Google visits the site?
    I want to rank for (broad keyword) when it's a local gym.
    I don't do it anymore unless they pay a ton, I do my own shit!!
     
  4. mudbutt

    mudbutt Jr. Executive VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    I run an SEO company right now, its very profitable if you can spot the badseed clients from the good ones. Usually the ones that are spending their entire marketing budget to hire you are generally going to be the really bad eggs you dont want to keep around. Once you have a handful of good clients, life is good. I recently just picked up a 5 figure contract to do SEO work that required roughly 40 hours of upfront work and about 1 hour a week maintenance. This is a yearly fee, and Im pretty sure i'll keep this client for many years, because he came via word of mouth from another established client.
     
  5. jstover77

    jstover77 Executive VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    Ya most average Joes have no idea what SEO entails. Not their fault though. It is still a very young industry, and people are not that educated with it.
     
  6. biteablegravy

    biteablegravy Registered Member

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    $50 per keyword per month. Promise no front page results until after the first month, and then if you're not meeting the goal just rank for some long tail keywords in the meantime as freebies. Show him they're at number one like you promised.
     
  7. Dubbletoke

    Dubbletoke Regular Member

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    every time i post an ad on craigslist for SEO services i find out my posts get flagged within an hour of creating them and the funny thing is i dont see any other seo services on craigslist in my area
     
  8. Bartman

    Bartman Power Member

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    wow, you are my hero. thats how i dream and aspire to be.

    what do you do when a client is too stupid to understand what SEO is?
    people think they need online marketing, but they have no idea what that means. do you explain to them that google cares about backlinks and that you are going to build them backlinks?
    how technical do you get?
     
  9. partymarty4870

    partymarty4870 Elite Member

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    thats why I don't do customers - although I own 1-5 on G for (mytown)searchengineoptimisation . As mentioned before thats mainly to piss off the 2 other SEO guys in my town. It's also a good backup if EVERYTHING gets delisted.
     
  10. garyr9001

    garyr9001 Newbie

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    I agree it is very hard to dealt with offshore or outsource provider but always there is an exemption. I have been in the outsourcing business for more than 3 years now and I gain reputation to my clients with outstanding feedback. I deliver results. I refund money. I accept criticism and I gain friends.
     
  11. tyler8541

    tyler8541 Regular Member

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    It only snowballs from there.

    What people can't see or feel they have a hard time understanding or quantifying value from.

    Start them out on something small. Get a contract together and a letter of intent (LOI). Say it's for getting them on page one for city+personal trainer.

    In your contract put a price on this keyword and a price for all the other keywords he wants to rank for. Make him agree that if you rank him for X keyword in position 10 or better within X amount of days he will pay X amount per month for the rest or X amount per X ranking per keyword. You more or less make him a believer before forking out the big bucks. This way he isn't on your ass every ****ing day cause he has 5k on the line or something. Be reasonable, get results, collect the bigger check, make him some money, go bigger. Rarely do I ever get the big kill right off the bat. Just my experience although I suck at sales...

    I go after high value services but downside is that you have to build a good portfolio, awesome case studies, etc before landing big clients on a steady basis. Just remember though, all it takes is one client at 3K+ per month and most people can quit their day job.
     
  12. Bartman

    Bartman Power Member

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    EXACTLY! thank you for understanding how i feel.
    another question:
    how do you convince someone that "personal trainer Boston" is better than "weight loss"
     
  13. tyler8541

    tyler8541 Regular Member

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    personal trainer boston is a hell of a lot more qualifying search term than weight loss IMO. Now "weight loss boston" would be a different story. Depends on what he selling on his site. Is he selling weight loss supplements or something? Otherwise he runs a service that takes physical presence. Weight loss is too broad unless he is selling supplements or info from his site IMO.

    It's all in the keyword research. Show him the exact search numbers and cut that in half by 50%. Show him cost per click to give a better value to what people are actually paying for. Don't BS him on potential traffic as that will bite you in the ass big time. I tell my clients there is no other marketing platform I know of that is like "looking into a crsytal ball". Business is risk, but at least with IM and SEO you go into it with SOME kind of a guarantee when you get there. Be clear that you can get qualified traffic to his site but conversions are another story. That's on him. He needs YOU, project that attitude without being cocky, be confident.

    Hope that helps.
     
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  14. tyler8541

    tyler8541 Regular Member

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    Go to insights and type in "weight loss" and select Boston. See what comes up. Do KW research on those terms. That will better narrow it down for you.
     
  15. dunhill

    dunhill Power Member

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    Sometimes customer need our explanation. As for me , when I take any SEO job, I will explain all those thing to them for FREE .. Hehehe.. Once he said ok.. then I will put my price tag. :D Be creative of course.
     
  16. BorisTipsIt

    BorisTipsIt Regular Member

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    I hate clients. Okay, most are good, but the few that are bad will drive you bat sh*t crazy. I had one guy who kept calling me that was "willing" to spend $1,500 a month, but wanted to be number one on G for "real estate" in three months. Please.
     
  17. dunhill

    dunhill Power Member

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    ohh shit.. that guy is an idiot !!! :cussing: Just ignore him.. Hahaha
     
  18. minute80

    minute80 Regular Member

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    As others have already said, you have to understand that people are not used to SEO services, and that they look that field through the only lens they have at the moment, and that is traditional marketing. In traditional marketing you buy certain ad space/time and since it is usually your only variable at the moment, you can see what is happening and why.

    So googlemonster, questions about traffic between 2pm-3pm and G bot should be easily answerable. 13% traffic drop too (some other site overtook you and therefore has more visits, pay x amount so I can regain your position etc.)

    This below is actually quite common when you deal with people. They are always trying to squeeze the last from you. The truth here is that this guy probably got a quote from somebody else, lets say for 2k, and now he is fishing for better price. My approach would be in following manner:

    "To rank your site for real estate keyword that has N amount of sites ranking for it, we need approximatly to build X amount of links, and write Z amount of articles. This job would cost you more than Y amount of USD. If somebody told you different, please by all means, do business with them, I know what is real. On the other hand, for 1.5k I can rank you first for real estate Boston, which will give you approx. 150k visits per month, with converting rate of 0.4%. Let us start here."

    What I am trying to say, is that people are looking for free education and don't want to loose too much money in learning process. Once you establish yourself as authority (by educating them), they won't question your decisions. Of course, there are always jerks, so you have to limit time you spend on useless bunch.

     
  19. jagrmeister721

    jagrmeister721 Junior Member

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    Yes, Bartman, they are that stupid. The average SEO customer is simply out to lunch, having delusional expectations on what can be achieved and think it can happen overnight, all on a budget of a few hundred dollars. It's ridiculous. We chose to focus instead on our own properties and have cherished our sanity, as a result.
     
  20. mohit

    mohit Newbie

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    I am not a SEO KING and not making any 5 figured money.Hehe this could be opposite if i learn SEO.According to me proper learning of SEO can make u lots of money and dealing with bad clients is just a small challenge.
    Posted via Mobile Device