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PBN Domains - Do they have to be related?

Discussion in 'Black Hat SEO' started by imdavid, Dec 28, 2014.

  1. imdavid

    imdavid Registered Member

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    Hey all,

    So I was wondering about PBN's... I'm about to make a PBN for my phone review niche, an review article will be boosted with the pbn. I have some quite good domains I could possibly use with nice backlinking etc, but they're not related. They're deleted so I could register them cheaply.

    For example, one is from a football team, can I just use that domain and write something about this phone and then link to the money article? Or does the domain really have to be related to the phone niche?

    Thanks!
     
  2. PandaDomo

    PandaDomo Senior Member

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    You can still do it, but it won't be as effective as using a niche-related domain.

    You're probably better off just redirecting it and then get more related ones.
     
  3. T0NYS

    T0NYS Supreme Member

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    #Shqipo

    OP I don't wanna say that but yesterday you were like a newbie when it comes to PBNS so you learnt everything overnight ? thoughts ?
     
  4. PandaDomo

    PandaDomo Senior Member

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    I'm not sure how basic you think my knowledge would be from a single question. Just because I asked something for confirmation, does not mean I have absolutely zero knowledge.

    Also, towards the OP, here's the thread pidhsame is referring to: http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackhat-seo/black-hat-seo/728297-power-pbns.html

    Read mickyfu's posts on my thread, he has some good info there. I think it's more relevant towards your question as well.

    Edit:

    I also forgot to mention, his question isn't so much as directed towards PBNs, but more towards niche relevancy. I'm under the impression that it's the same in regards with PBNs and regular guest posts/links/whatever, relevancy is important. In the same way relevancy is important for other links, relevancy also has weight in PBNs. I don't see why these two would be different.

    On the other hand, if I'm wrong, whoever that's more knowledgeable than me is more than welcome to correct my conceptions.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2014
  5. Aty

    Aty Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    It's would great but way too time consuming and expensive to find related domains. So the answer is no.
     
  6. PandaDomo

    PandaDomo Senior Member

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    Depends on how much you want to spend really, just hiring somebody to get the domains for you is somewhere between $30-50 each (registration included).

    It would of course be much more effective to have it related to the phone niche, but it would depend on if the OP would want to spend the time to do the research or take the lazy way out and just hire somebody.

    In the event the OP wants to hire somebody, here's two threads:

    The first one, I got a review copy only but the domain I got was very solid.

    http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackh...times-bbc-forbes-cnn-backlinks-pbn-ready.html

    In this thread, I haven't used it myself but there's a lot of good reviews and BassTrackerBoats (who is a very reputed member) recommends it.

    http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackh...-backlinks-prices-will-make-you-weep-joy.html

    Also, I think your only option would really be to 301 the football domains you have. I think it would be far too costly and time consuming to build actual PBNs out of those domains for irrelevant links.
     
  7. Aty

    Aty Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    That's a price range for non niche targeted domains. For relevant domains you will have to pay much more than that.
     
  8. PandaDomo

    PandaDomo Senior Member

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    Well, this is the starting price for niche-targeted domains with a handful of authoritative links to it already. I'm going strictly from BHW prices in the BSTs.

    I think what you're referring to would probably be the higher end ones with a lot stronger profile to it with high PR/PA/DA/TF and whatever else.
     
  9. SEO Power

    SEO Power Elite Member

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    You don't need relevant domains for your PBN. Heck, you can even use one PBN to link to all your sites in different niches. It's the article containing the link that has to be relevant.
     
  10. LordofTempest

    LordofTempest Junior Member

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    so much for non related websites? you could find dozens of those with ahrefs and scrapebox.
     
  11. Aty

    Aty Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    Well, not everyone has a working method to find such domains.
     
  12. AceOfDreams

    AceOfDreams Junior Member

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    It's much less effective but highly possible. Try to relate it to your money site.
     
  13. rankspire

    rankspire Elite Member

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    As some other members rightly suggested, it should always be a trade off between cost and results. If you can find niche relevant domains while keeping the costs down, by all means go for it. If not, unrelated domains will work just well like always does.
     
  14. domainingin

    domainingin Regular Member

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    You just need to refurbish your site to the new niche, wait a while and start linking to your money site after some time (1-2 weeks) and it works well, if the domain was healthy, spam free and not penalized.

    Cheers
    Dan
     
  15. Shadeofblack

    Shadeofblack Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    I can only go by experience. I would not bother with niche specific domains. The tiny amount of positive effect it will have (if any) will be miniscule compared to the DA & PA & TR each of your sites in your PBN.
     
  16. TBSdomains

    TBSdomains BANNED BANNED

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    Niche related is always a plus but not a must.
     
  17. SteveWaller

    SteveWaller Regular Member

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    My old view was that the niche of the domain did not matter because you could always retheme it to suit your purposes, but the more I have been reading into the way that Google actually ranks pages (I've read blog posts explaining some of the Google patents), the more I am convinced that finding domains that are niche relevant is the ideal approach.

    You have to ask yourself this - if Majestic can come up with a way to score a domain based on topical trust flow, then Google are easily capable of doing the same and with a much greater sophistication. And from the perspective of their algorithm making sense, links that flow through from related site to related site to related site are much more natural and should be more likely to actually lead to user clicks and user satisfaction (just look up Google's reasonable surfer model to understand why a link that is more likely to be clicked is actually worth more).

    Then there is the case of manual reviews - these are hard to pass at the best of times but if you have relevant domains then at least you stand a chance if all of the other aspects of your network are done correctly.

    But yes, it does come down to a trade off in price, time, effort and availability.
     
  18. BreaknBrix

    BreaknBrix Power Member

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    This is a topic I've always been curious about.

    From what I've seen, all 3 of my top competitors (one is a franchise), all ranking #1... all have links from niche relevant PBN's.

    What is interesting however, they are very weak PBN sites. In fact, they don't look like expired domains. They look like brand new domains they registered years ago around the same time they built their sites. Then I guess they just waited, registered more related domains, let them age, and now they all rank really well.

    These are rare, but competitive home improvement type niches.

    2 years ago I had a guy doing SEO for me. He wasn't using niche related domains. Just articles on PBN sites. And he ranked a 3 month old site, about 64 pages above an 8 year old franchise with more than 1000 pages. We made a lot of money back then.

    So I started building more sites and having him do my SEO. The same thing happened in 2 other niches. I was able to get sites #1 within a matter of 2 months using non-related PBN sites. A couple years passed by, Google penalized his entire network but fortunately he 404'd the sites and none of the penalties passed. But ranks did drop substantially on 2 of my sites and now I just have 1 site on page 1.

    I'm about to redo my strategy and built out my own PBN rather than rent or buy any links.

    But this is what really confuses me. My competitors are still ranking incredibly well today. But their PBN sites are weak as fuck. As in, citation and trust flows under 10-15, no backlinks at all to their PBN's. They just bought a bunch of new domains, populated them with relevant content, then linked back to their site. Almost like they didn't give a fuck about anything but the relevancy of the domain. And sure enough, they've been killing it for years.

    On the other hand, I've see with my own eyes what a few links from strong, non-relevant domains can do. To outrank a franchise and 2 other old, well established sites like that blew my mind.

    Yet it really makes me wonder how valuable relevant domains really are. Because now that my main SEO is out of biz, and I'm building my own PBN.... I'm wondering whether I should do what my competitors are doing or do what blackhatters on here are advising?

    My competitors are saying: Buy new, relevant domains. Populate them with some relevant content. Fuck the authority of the sites. Just keep buying up / establishing more relevant domains and linking back until you rank.

    BHW says: Get links from strong PBN sites. Doesn't matter if the domains are relevant. Just make sure they're good sites, good links, relevant articles, good authority, no spammy profile, etc.

    So I have to compromise between what my competitors are doing, what I see is working, and what people on here are advising.

    The only way I see to compromise is to do the following -

    Buy up 10 new, relevant EMD or PMD domains. Separate hosting and everything. Don't worry about the fact they're new. Just populate them with content (I already have thousands of pages of relevant, unique content ready so I'd waste very little time doing the content).

    Then buy up about 20 strong, expired domains from BHW. The $30-$50 ones. And use those as a tier 2 to link to my newer, more relevant sites.

    That way I have all relevant domains linking from my tier 1. And I use my tier 2 to boost all those sites.

    Does this sound like a waste of time? Too much work?

    These are local niches, so it only takes 5-15 PBN's to rank (based on my competitors). I definitely don't want a bunch of non-relevant domains as my tier 1, regardless of the authority it doesn't make sense.

    The other way I can do it is make like 70% of my links from the new, relevant domains. Then 30% from the sites I buy on here. So there would be no tier 2. The newer sites would feed the relevancy, and there'd be more of them. But the real authority / power would come from just a few very powerful, non-relevant sites.

    Which way do you think would be best? I'm looking for longevity here cause last time this site ranked #1 (was there for a good 18 months) we made a shitload of money. It's a very lucrative niche. It's just a matter of pushing my site from position 6-10 back up to the top 3. I'm not even sure how the site is ranking right now since I haven't build a link to it in over a year and all it's PBN links are gone. It seems to be ranking from sheer age (4 years old) size (200 articles), quality of the articles.... then the 20-30 web 2.0 I built and populated when I first built the site 4 years ago. Maybe I'm overthinking things. For all I know 4-5 really strong links might do the job and crack the top 3. I just wanna make sure when we hit #1 this time, that the site sticks.

    -BB
     
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    Last edited: Jan 3, 2015
  19. crackarama

    crackarama Regular Member

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    Break, you are asking a lot of questions i would like answers too. Bookmarked
     
  20. tony_d

    tony_d Elite Member

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    I dont want to over-simplify something that you've clearly spent alot of time thinking about - however, you're overthinking it.

    Go get some spam-free expired domains with at least 10 referring domains, TF>10, CF<2xTF and load up some articles relevant to your money site, and place your links.

    You WILL rank. It might take 10 sites, it might take 100. Just keep at it - and if stuck, refer to my signature below.

    Thats not just theory on my part - its the ranking method behind most of my money sites.

    Its really very simple.

    I'm sure that if you were running an SEO lab, you could test different theories and find slight outcome differences.
    But you dont run an SEO lab - you run a roofing business.
    So rank your site (or preferably, multiple sites) and go do the jobs and get paid :)