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Let's cut the BS, and hypotheticals. How do we do Keyword Research in 2012 (After Penguin)

Discussion in 'White Hat SEO' started by Toocoo82, Aug 14, 2012.

  1. Toocoo82

    Toocoo82 Regular Member

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    Ok, well first of all thanks for view. There are a ton, and I mean ton of threads on how to do keyword research.

    I want to ask the experts out there, how do we attack a competitive over the top keyword?

    Let's say we own a coffee shop, and we want to take over globally?

    "mocha coffee" is our flagship keyword.


    What steps would we take to rank this keyword? And how many keywords to rank is a good start?

    5-10?
    Exact match types
    Longtail

    So probably would this work (and excuse my spelling, and I'm using different products because I think users will search for similar terms as well):

    Buy mocha coffee online
    Order Free mocha Coffee Online
    Frappichino Coffee stores online
    Cappichino coffee online



    What suggestions do you have? Do you think the Google keywords tool is still the best to use?

    I just wanted to know if someone can enlightened me on what to look for and how to do proper keyword research?
     
  2. ber789

    ber789 Junior Member

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    I would use a couple of different tools. Google keywords tool only shows data related to adwords so you will be missing out on a lot of potential long tail opportunities. I have used Wordtracker in the past for research and it works well. It aggregates from several sources so you get a better overall picture of the popularity of certain terms.
     
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  3. Toocoo82

    Toocoo82 Regular Member

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    Ok, well I'm looking to invest in a tool as well. Do you think I should go with wordtracker or market samurai?

    I'm looking for something that is going to give me the best results. I'm working with someone and they are very anal about everything.
     
  4. ber789

    ber789 Junior Member

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    I haven't used market samurai but I know a lot of people use it so it has to have some value. Often with these tools they all do the same thing, just slightly different. Pretty sure both will give you some nice reports and numbers that you can show your partner.
     
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  5. Winston_Smith

    Winston_Smith Junior Member

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    Market Samurai is a really good tool to use for keyword research, but in all honesty, don't be afraid to get down and dirty with the research. Software is awesome and provides great ease of use, but if you're new to keyword research it's really best to start off by knowing exactly what you're doing and how to do it before using software. Knowing basics will really help anyone out in a pinch. Best wishes!
     
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  6. psytrance

    psytrance Power Member

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    you can do it manually in big g search bar, for example:

    mocha coffee a
    mocha coffee b
    mocha coffee c
    etc.

    doing this big g will suggest you all possible keywords related to your main keyword.

    of course you can also do it using tools like scrapebox or ultimate niche finder.
     
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  7. Z0mbie

    Z0mbie Regular Member

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    Keyword research hasn't changed at all due to penguin, panda, or any other google algorithm other than changes which change the search results page.

    As for keyword research tools, I recommend Ultimate Niche Finder, Scrapebox, traffic travis, and excel.
     
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  8. BlackOut

    BlackOut Registered Member

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  9. PreacherJesse

    PreacherJesse Registered Member

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    have you tried using ubersuggest . com ? :)

    J
     
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  10. Toocoo82

    Toocoo82 Regular Member

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  11. camel52

    camel52 Newbie

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    what is the recommended amount of keywords per page under the new penguin rule?
     
  12. V

    V Elite Member

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  13. GreyGhost

    GreyGhost Registered Member

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    There isn't such a thing as the "penguin rule" for the "amount of keyword". Since AG times (after Google) the common sense is the answer to all KW related doubts. Do not stuff keywords.

    How does, keyword wise, this keyword related sentence, look like, given keywords I use to describe keywords use in Google's keywords penguin keywords rule? Idiotic. So would any article / web page / post that does not sound "natural". Sapienti sat.
     
  14. jkwilson78

    jkwilson78 Regular Member Premium Member

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    One thing to keep in mind is that every tool out there gets their data from Google's Keyword Tool (Ultimate Niche Finder, Keyword Scout, Market Samurai, etc) Now they all do a little somethign different with that data so if you're just looking for keyword ideas and not competitive analysis of those keywords Google's tool is a great starting place.
     
  15. macdonjo3

    macdonjo3 Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    That's where you're wrong. You see, I put a lot of thought into this already.
    We find our keywords from 4 different sources, unlike the others. The first one is of course Google Keyword Tool. However, the 3 other sources are Amazon, Google Instant/Suggest, and LSI keywords. We're adding more all the time.

    I also agree with the first post by ber789, Google only gives you CPC/search data and Adwords competition but nothing to do with available domains, SEO competition, profit portential, etc.
     
  16. Techxan

    Techxan Elite Member

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    I was a BIG Market Samurai fan, and I have to say do not buy it for the keyword research function. It is useless.

    They started taking the keyword research for SEO competition from BING. This means for instance, when I search for "Best Tactical flashlight" for instance, a Google search will tell me that there are 59,300,000 competing websites, MS says there are 7650.

    MS used to be one of the best, they are now one of the worst, and I seldom use it anymore.

    I got my money out of it, but now it is a waste of time firing it up. It takes forever to do any functions, and it gives you back crap for results that you cannot trust and have to verify with Google. Pointless to use MS at all..

    You know the sad part? They have so many people using the free version, they they stripped out the functions of the paying customers bought, because the data acquisition costs became excessive - due to the fact that they are supporting so many free customers.

    As a paying customer, to see the product I paid for stripped of all functionality to support people who did not buy the software, tells me that they do not value their paying customers.

    As a business, they are doomed, as a software, it is 1/10 of what it was.
     
  17. futurestic06

    futurestic06 Supreme Member

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    Choose some of the low competitive and medium competitive keywords. and of course you should try the Exact match search. 5 keywords are OK.