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Is ACP still a viable company, or did everyone get the shaft?

Discussion in 'Affiliate Programs' started by dirtdevil, Aug 18, 2011.

  1. dirtdevil

    dirtdevil Newbie

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    In recent weeks, ACP (Affiliate Cash Pile), owned by Manuel Gonzalez has demonstrated a severe problem with cash flow.

    Here are some facts:

    ACP started out by paying semi-monthly (although for some strange reason they called it bi-weekly) with payouts coming less than a week after the period ended. This seemed fairly reliable.

    Several months ago he changed to paying weekly (Monday to Sunday), with payouts coming on Wednesday. This is when the problems started. Quite often payments didn't show, and he always had something to blame it on, like a bank issue or other various excuses. Once "reminded" payment usually did happen.

    It should probably be noted that with the weekly payments, the minimum payment was $100, if you earned less, your payment was carried forward to the next week. Manuel was very firm with this, and payments for less than $100 were not sent, even on special request. This is pretty typical, but its a fact to remember for now. I am unsure if there was a minimum payment for the semi-monthly.

    A couple weeks ago, on Wednesday afternoon (July 27), Manuel sent an email that he was pushing payments to Friday, claiming an influx of new affiliates. This was despite the fact that he claimed to have hired additional "accounting" people. Why would it take more people more time to complete the same task?

    When that Friday (July 29) came and went, not a single person could verify that they had been payed.

    As of Monday afternoon (Aug 1), there was still no confirmation that anyone had been paid.

    Finally on Wednesday (8/3) afternoon, an entire week late, it appeared that payments did go out to some people that screamed the loudest.

    Now comes Friday (8/5), another payment due, and not a word from Manuel, or his "accounting" people. He has quit returning emails, text's, phone calls, no way to contact him.

    Through that weekend, several forums start getting loud about the issue of non-payment. Finally, he steps in on at least one of them (here) late Saturday night (8/6) claiming he was swamped by new affiliates that he was making payments of $50 (remember the $100 minimum?) to all these new people, and claiming that "accounting" had been working hard all weekend making payments.

    Even with this claim, there was not a single person that could verify that they did indeed get paid, for any amount.

    Now comes Monday (8/8), Still, not a single person could confirm payment, yet he has the gall to tell people to double check with their banks or paypal or however they got paid.

    After it was obvious that the forums were getting louder, he finally did make payments to some of the loudest. Finally, late Monday afternoon, a few affiliates did confirm payment. Its still unclear even to this date if all affiliates have been payed (although he claims they have).

    Through all this mess, on that same Monday, he sends an email to what only appears to be some affiliates, with what appears to be "new" payment terms. There were all sorts of changes, limits, and restrictions, but if you read carefully between the lines, it essentially said that he was moving to a monthly payment and paying out 15 days after the month.

    This presents two issues:

    First, this means he has now "bought" 45 days before he has to make another single payment.

    Second, these new terms came out AFTER money was already earned, but not paid (specifically for the week of 8/1 to 8/7). This money (which should have been paid on 8/10) still has not been paid. If he had any integrity, this would have been paid, as the new terms weren't published until after this money was earned and owed. This issue alone casts doubt on anything that he has to say, as he's made it clear that his word and agreements don't mean anything.

    Typically the first issue comes up when affiliate programs are poorly managed and they have destroyed their cash flow. Every time I've ever seen terms change this dramatically, its not long before they are out of business. This is an attempt to keep affiliates working for them for another 45 days before affiliates finally figure out the cord has already been pulled.

    The second issue is especially scary, because it doesn't take more than a few seconds of research (internet is great, isn't it?) to figure out that Manuel really is a party type person, and blows money as soon as he gets it. Is he responsible enough to hold onto money for 45 days without being tempted to go out and party with it? I have very serious doubts. For someone that already has such a history of mis-management (like having to be reminded to pay), this isn't a good combination.

    I believe his income is really going to be slaughtered now because it wouldn't surprise me if many affiliates have quit pushing him, so he won't have much money coming in for the next 45 days. Talk about a double whammy.

    With all of this, there are only two possible conclusions, but either one is bad.

    First, he is experiencing major cash flow problems, in which case payments will always be a fight in the future.

    Second, he has decided to pull the plug (call it retire if you want) and wants to pinch out every possible penny by continuing to promise, then delay payments, then finally walk away, without making another payment.

    You can view this however you want, but I really believe the facts speak for themselves, and I can't in good faith keep quiet on this while people are still working for him.
     
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  2. flowergay

    flowergay Newbie

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    Something is DEFINITELY going on with ACP. Something is NOT right over there and I can tell a huge difference in his behavior and actions after working for him for more than a year now. Just stop while you are ahead of the game and move onto a different network. I can't believe Manuel has turned into something like this, totally unexpected...
     
  3. trustedfire9

    trustedfire9 Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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  4. aj113

    aj113 Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    To be fair, I will say that technically I am paid up to date at the moment. Although as dirtdevil says, the notification of the new terms came out of the blue, and during a pay period that he has clearly now included in the new terms, when really it should have been paid under the old terms, - the new terms should have started at the beginning of September to avoid any confusion.

    In fact, he has returned a text to me. I asked whether 'net 15' in the new terms meant 'payment monthly net 15' or 'payment bi-monthly'. His reply was "..... it is $2k to get paid weekly, otherwise it's net 15...." - which of course does not answer my question. I sent a further text asking the same question rephrased, but got no reply.

    Other than these exceptions, regrettably I am in agreement with dirtdevil. If Manuel is not broke, then he he is treating his affiliates very poorly, and he will be lucky to keep any of them. Even if he is having problems, the waters would be a lot calmer for him if his communication was good. People want to know what is happening, they want to be informed, instead, we have a wall of silence.

    Again, regrettably I too conclude that any remaining affiliates will struggle to be paid. Personally I am with another network now, if you are still with ACP, I suggest you study the evidence carefully.
     
  5. dirtdevil

    dirtdevil Newbie

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    When you say you are up to date, I'm assuming you mean that you are assuming that the "new terms" are backdated by 8 days, and you haven't been paid for the period 8/1 to 8/7 that should have been paid on 8/10 or 8/12? I would have to say that the notification of terms came out after (8/8), not during (8/1 to 8/7), the pay period.

    This seems to confirm that he is intentionally being vague about when the next payment will be. I think you meant 'payment semi-monthly' (twice a month) and not 'bi-monthly' (every other month). Unless you've seen/read something else that I've not seen yet?

    This reply from him also seems to confirm that he does not actually have two (or more?) accounting people as he has stated. This is very poor use of the terms net15, and surely in his conversations with these 'accounting' people over setting up the new terms, they would have clarified what net15 really means to him, and that its not an indication of pay periods, but very simply (for those that don't know) how long after the pay period ends that they take to pay you.

    Agreed! Communication goes a long way, even if its an admittance that he screwed up. Changing terms AFTER money has been earned and owed comes no where close to that.
     
  6. dirtdevil

    dirtdevil Newbie

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    Here's a quick accounting lesson for those that aren't always sure how the terms are used (it seems like a lot of affiliate accountants need to read this too).

    Payment terms should always be expressed with TWO terms, first, the period, second, the delay, or term.

    For example:

    Weekly-Net 3 should mean that you work for one week, then 3 days after the week you get paid, this is what ACP used to be.

    Monthly-Net 10 would mean that you work the entire month, then you get paid 10 days after the month is up.

    Here's some definitions:

    Net xx - how long you promise to pay within, or the longest you will take to pay.

    Net 15 does NOT, by any stretch of accounting definitions mean that a pay period is semi-monthly, and actually does not give any indication of how long the pay period is, it could very well be annual, its not enough information to determine by itself. ACP doesn't seem to understand this, despite having at least two accounting people on staff.

    Net 3 - means 3 days after the pay period ends, so if pay period ends on a Sunday, you would probably get paid Wednesday. This is what ACP was just a couple weeks ago.

    Net 5 - means you get paid 5 days after the pay period, typically anything net 5 or smaller just means business days and not weekends or holidays. In most cases, this works out to mean a full week.

    Net 7 - means you get paid 7 days after the pay period, typically anything net 7 or longer ignores weekends and holidays unless they happen to fall on the last day, in which case payment could come on the last business day before, or the first business day after the 7 days.

    In most cases, people mean the same thing when saying net 5 or net 7.

    Net 14, means you get paid exactly two weeks after the pay period ends

    Net 15 means you get paid 15 days (slightly longer than two weeks) after the pay period ends.

    Weekly-7 days, unless clarified does not indicate what day the week starts/ends, common periods are (Sunday to Saturday) or (Monday to Sunday).

    Bi-weekly this means every other week, it does NOT mean twice a month, it always means exactly 14 days, there is a difference. Again, weeks typically start on either Sunday or Monday, but should always be clarified.

    Semi-monthly this means twice a month, it does NOT mean bi-weekly, or every other week, it means half the month. Typical periods are the (1st to 15th) and (16th to end of month). Semi-monthly will almost always run a day or two longer than a two week period, and for months that have 31 days, the second half of the month will have one more day than the first half of the month. Sometimes the period will be cut short in February (1st to 14th, then 15th to 28th). Semi-monthly does not have to line up with the calendar month, I've seen pay periods that are shifted, such as (5th to 19th, then 20th to 4th for example).

    Monthly means exactly what it says, a full month, usually, but not always will line up with the calendar month, typically (1st to last day of month), but could also be a date in middle of the month (such as 10th to 9th of the next month).

    Bi-monthly means every other month, for example (Jan and Feb) then (Mar and Apr), and so on.

    Quarterly means every 3 months.

    Semi-Annual means half a year (6 months).

    Annual means full year.

    Have questions or need clarifications? Feel free to ask.
     
  7. aj113

    aj113 Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    Yes, agreed 100%


    Agreed again. I meant twice monthly. To be fair the terms in the original email are quite clear: "Affiliates must hit $2,000 two weeks in a row to get paid weekly, if they go under they are reverted back to monthly net15." But the reason I asked the question was because some affiliates were reporting that ACP's accounting dept had told them it meant that payment was twice monthly. I wanted to check for myself.
     
  8. dirtdevil

    dirtdevil Newbie

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    Its because of confusion like this, and their constant mis-use of the terms (you seem to have a good grasp of them, they don't) that really makes me wonder if he has ANY accounting people.

    Until I see otherwise, I believe all of these people he's claiming he has are actually the one and only, him!

    I'm currently of the belief that his claim to these new accounting people are to buy time with existing affiliates until they figure out he's already pulled the plug.

    September 15th, which is basically the first promised payment, is approaching, but still a month away. But, we've already seen him change terms twice after the pay period was already up.
     
  9. canwedothis

    canwedothis Registered Member

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    I always try to give someone the benefit of the doubt and although sometimes I jump to conclusions in my mind when things seem to be wrong, I try NOT to act on those in a public forum until I have no other choice.

    I WILL say that except the the period of 8/1 to 8/7, which I personally believe should have been paid out under weekly terms as his bombshell of new monthly net 15 payments had not come out when it was earned, that I have been paid all that I have earned with him.

    But sadly, the several abrupt and drastic payment term changes have put some serious red flags up in my eyes. If you are pushing this network, I would tread carefully as this isn't a normal change going from weekly pay to monthly pay? Wow.
     
  10. mstrain

    mstrain Registered Member

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    Yeah something is wrong for sure. You don't make those types of changes if everything is working the way it should.
     
  11. flowergay

    flowergay Newbie

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    If it is really true what dirtdevil said on Manuel's spending habits and blowing his $ on parties I am very concerned. Manuel does owe me some money leftover so I am concerned. Like I already mentioned I stopped my traffic to AffiliateCashPile already so I am done with ACP 100%. I hate to be judgmental towards Manuel because I do consider him as a good person but you cannot ignore all these red flags especially when $ is involved.

    PS - Although I know few people who made over $2k and they were suppose to get paid "weekly", they still have NOT been paid.
     
  12. canwedothis

    canwedothis Registered Member

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    We will see I guess. Kinda bums me out because his network did convert really well for me.
     
  13. dirtdevil

    dirtdevil Newbie

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    It does appear that Manuel has read this thread and has chosen to ignore it.

    How's that for building up your affiliates confidence?
     
  14. dirtdevil

    dirtdevil Newbie

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    Something struck me with this thread, and I'm wondering if I'm the only person that has noticed.

    Usually when someone says anything negative about any program/network, there's always a bunch of clueless defenders that come in and say "Such and such is a good person, he's going to take care of everything", that even happened to a point in the recent payment thread, but this thread has been around three days now and not a single defender has come in.

    Does that mean that everyone see's the writing on the wall? Does that mean that ACP was so small to start with, that there is no one left to defend? Or does it mean that he owes a lot of people a lot of money and it just can't be defended any more?
     
  15. aj113

    aj113 Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    They need to make $2k for 2 consecutive weeks - did they do that?

    Can anyone confirm that they have met the threshold for weekly payments and still not been paid?
     
  16. aj113

    aj113 Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    I think the most telling point is that Manuel has not replied to this thread. That speaks volumes.
     
  17. flowergay

    flowergay Newbie

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    Yes, they did make $2k for 2 consecutive wks and did NOT get paid. I am talking about them being probably one of the biggest $ makers for his company. Of course they have now left ACP and went to somewhere else.

    That's what I don't get because no network would dare do anything stupid to lose those kind of affiliates because they bring so much $ for them. Unless ACP is going broke. :confused:

     
  18. sukataetumba

    sukataetumba Senior Member

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    so where did you move? I am now having doubts with its future.
     
  19. canwedothis

    canwedothis Registered Member

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    Yes, like I said a move from weekly to monthly was NOT a good plan if he wanted to continue making money. I won't totally discount him until mid sept and see if I do get paid.
     
  20. OldFatGuy

    OldFatGuy Regular Member

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    Sounds to me like he's getting hit with a lot of fraud which means he doesn't have the cash to pay out everyone... Pretty common to get hit like that when you try and do weekly payouts as people will hit you hard and get paid out before they get caught. Very few companies can handle that unless they have awesome fraud control. His changing to monthly payments with a 15 day hold is a pretty clear indication of that.