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How is this guy ranking so high for these 100K+ SEOC terms, with almost no backlinks?

Discussion in 'White Hat SEO' started by Daemon, Jun 27, 2010.

  1. Daemon

    Daemon Registered Member

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    All right, I saw a webinar from Offer Vault with a guy who was pimping one of those browser-based minisite builders. He showed a few of his sites, and I was stunned at how high they ranked - and simply couldn't figure out how?

    The sites he showed and their search terms are -

    villageautoinsurance.org (village auto insurance, SEOC 352,000, ranks #1)
    casualtyautoinsurance.org (casualty auto insurance, SEOC 2,820,000, ranks #1)
    autoinsuranceaccident.org (auto insurance accident, SEOC 1,070,000, ranks #1)
    homeownersautoinsurance.org (homeowners auto insurance, SEOC 195,000, ranks #7)

    I don't really know how great these keywords are - the Adwords exact match results are 33, 29, 24, and 16 per day. But there's definitely competition there from the SEOC figures.

    What I'm amazed by is how little backlinks they have. These were all registered on 12/31/09. They have 1, 24, 1, and 5 BLDs! Some of the SEO matrixes aren't that tough but those BLD numbers are definitely confusing as fuck. And here's the SEO matrix for 'homeowners auto insurance', which he ranks #7 for with 5 BLDs -
    [​IMG]
    The min BLP results are 1221 and 2204 yet this guy ranks top 10 with 5. And the only special thing I see about these sites is that they have the keyword in the domain. I mean his sites even seem to be using a Traffic Equalizer type strategy in the bottom left!

    So there's nothing special I can see on-page, certainly nothing special in terms of backlinks, yet they rank great on terms with pretty good competition - and in the case of the matrix above, great competition. I don't quite follow how these rankings were achieved.
     
  2. wallofiron

    wallofiron Power Member

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    simple...

    because that keyword you are looking at is "home owners auto insurance"


    its just an ELD, it doesnt need backlinks
     
  3. beatuplunchbox

    beatuplunchbox Junior Member

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    I have battled in that turf before. Believe me, there are folks out there battling over useless keywords. Insurance companies are really bad about this. They throw good money after bad.
     
  4. moserw

    moserw Junior Member

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    That guy is Nathan Anderson and he is into SEO research for a good number of years and very respected too.

    Now coming to why he is ranking above, its because of onpage SEO. Good onpage SEO + 10 links will beat no/bad onpage SEO with 100+ links. Even Daniel Tan teaches this stuff and you can sign up for free videos on his SEOPressor site.
     
  5. Daemon

    Daemon Registered Member

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    I'm aware these keywords are likely not worth much, as I posted their exact match results above. From the SEOC numbers alone these keywords shouldn't be terribly easy though.

    And that site stands out like a sore thumb in the matrix I posted - if it weren't for that, you'd think that would be a pretty tough keyword. Don't recall seeing a matrix like that - where every site has 1,000+ BLPs and then you have one random site with just a handful.

    As for the on-page SEO, it just doesn't seem like anything special - I'm not seeing why it's so effective. He's using old-school Traffic Equalizer type content even. If anyone actually knows what's so nice about his on-page SEO, please fill me in :)
     
  6. MisterGemini

    MisterGemini Senior Member

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    Nothing special about his onpage seo.

    What does make his site relevant though is the 'Article' section where you have a drop-down to select the state to get a quote in. Certainly seems like a quote system would be evidence to google of a quality signal for the insurance industry. This guy got in there because of the Mayday shakedown using that coding. If you make a site similar that offers quotes etc similar to what you see in the 1-3 spots, you will do just as well if not better.

    It's all about the page now, not the domain.
     
  7. Daemon

    Daemon Registered Member

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    He said these sites have ranked there since well before Mayday. And I'm almost completely positive (as much as you be in the world of SEO anyway) that there's no magical 'you can get quotes here' signal :) The drop-down is purely about monetization and is not going to affect SEO.
     
  8. MisterGemini

    MisterGemini Senior Member

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    Duplicate it then and find out.

    Everyone I have advised on coding changes to match the quality signal has done much better.

    Take a look at alexa: http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/homeownersautoinsurance.org

    In the last month his ranking on that term increased by 45%. I would say that's a significant boost over where he might have been in the past. So he lied. At least that's what the stats suggest. To accept that he lied, explains everything. To assume he is being 100% honest, just leaves you banging your head against a wall looking for some kind of voodoo that isn't there.

    That drop-down might be about monitization, but fact is that people searching for insurance and every major company offering it offer quotes online. It's similar in all sectors where you need to identify the coding elements and content that matches the query and it's intent so you understand the category google has placed that site in.
     
  9. Daemon

    Daemon Registered Member

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    I certainly don't mean to demean your advice, but to randomly suggest he's lying about Mayday not affecting his rank makes no sense, and he has zero motivation to do that. If anything Mayday would've hurt it - and he did imply that a post-Mayday update hurt his rankings, not helped them. So one can safely throw the "he's lying" out, because that's something out of thin air.

    Alexa means pretty much nothing and is most likely just caused by him sharing this site with marketers if anything.

    And again, the notion of the drop-down helping SEO is a bit far-fetched. That's voodoo SEO type stuff.

    As for duplicating it, that would certainly be the goal and I'll try out some stuff. I doubt I'll be able to replicate a result anything like the one for the matrix shown in the first post though. Anyone seen a matrix like that before? 1K+ BLPs all the way around except for one site with almost no links?
     
  10. imperial109

    imperial109 Regular Member

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    Daemon, there's no secret. There never is and there never will be. That's just something the so called gurus and the big G throws out there that will have you spinning on your head. It's simple really, spend about a week on this forum and learn all that you can, then go out and play by big G's rules. It will come natural when you spend enough time on this forum, and the only thing you'll be saying is that it's logical.

    Also, MisterGemini didn't pull it out of thin air, he looked at the sites' rankings and saw that they increased. That's contrary to what the so called guru said, therefore we can safely assume that he's lying.

    loaked-out, don't spend hours on end trying to figure out what G's coding is. There are always golden rules that have always been in place from the beginning of time, and those should be followed with a twist. Just think for a second, who stayed on top? The ones that stuck to the rules. In their case though, they took the rules and interpreted them in their favor. I hope that sheds some light, but it's just my 2 cents.
     
  11. Daemon

    Daemon Registered Member

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    I'm aware there's no secret. I've been doing SEO for 4 years, you don't have to tell me this. This thread was not supposed to be about "guru" junk and I never intended it to be about the SEO himself, which is why I never mentioned his name.

    I was just surprised at the SEOC and matrix results above and had hoped to get other's insights on this. Not "the guru is lying" stuff that makes absolutely zero sense - no offense meant, but that's completely ridiculous. He has zero motive to lie, and if he was lying he would say the exact opposite of what you're saying. He would say Mayday and post-Mayday helped his rankings - instead he implied they were stable or hurt, and that he was going to have to adjust. This is just common sense here. This notion that he's lying here is illogical junk and nothing more.

    Again though, I don't want to talk about this specific guy. If you yourself have seen matrixes and SEOC vs. BLD numbers like this regularly, by all means share. I found them irregular and noteworthy.
     
  12. ultimategamechain

    ultimategamechain Power Member

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    I got a lot of minisites ranking #1-5 with much more competitor.

    His formula might be the same with mine (and I just learned it from here!)

    Keyword must be in the domain. must be .org .com .net

    Keyword must be in title, description and keyword metatag. And also must be in header.

    Must use keyword in the content.

    I find 10 high PR related blogs(on its exact page the PR is) and comment leaving my link. D0 f0ll0w blogs.
     
  13. SuperBlackHat

    SuperBlackHat Power Member

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    I hope someone chimes in with valid reasoning for this guys ranks soon, because i want to know he's doing it as well
     
  14. bizroot

    bizroot Supreme Member

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    I don't think any magic forumla is used here as MisterGemini, ultimategeamechain and imperial said it's simple and basic SEO... If you really want go and build one site with every on page optimization and start promotion... I believe you will start ranking with in a month if not early...

    Check for competition and you will find it very low... inurl and intitle will tell you how low competition is with that keyword... Hardly 23k... As i said just replicate or improvised it and you will rank with in a month for that keyword... If you do everything well you may get it within 1 week... Most probably you will outrank that guy...
     
  15. MisterGemini

    MisterGemini Senior Member

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    I said he was lying based on what the stats suggested. I didn't pull it out of 'thin air' as you put it. If I didn't see any reason to think he was lying I wouldn't have said it. It wouldn't be the first time someone peddling their guru status to onlookers didn't manipulate the facts or fudge their numbers a little bit to 'keep the excitement going'. The guy was selling a minisite builder, and he needed to show something working. So I'm not sure why you believe he has no reason to lie.

    Think what you like about Mayday, but the new reality is quality signals that match what google thinks is the intent of the keyword to match. It's a quality measure. Beyond the basics of optimization, this is all new. Just because it's new doesn't make it voodoo. Earlier this year had someone suggested the same as what I just said I would have said the same thing you did, but now, it's a common factor.

    The BLP thing is now happening all the time everywhere post-Mayday, for the same reasons I stated from the beginning. So yeah, I have seen it many many times now. I actually spent an entire day doing nothing but queries and analyzing what was going on across multiple searches in different areas in early June. Saw the backlink thing drop everywhere. I guess you are just starting to notice the same.

    Besides all this, just look at the site. Am I the only one that wants to barf from vertigo when I look at this thing? Anyone else want 100s of these? :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2010