Copy Writing and why if you don't know how to do it, you'll leran here

Discussion in 'Making Money' started by scubaslick, Dec 24, 2007.

  1. scubaslick

    scubaslick Regular Member

    Aug 23, 2007
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    Read this. It's worth the time and I promise I won't ramble too much.

    Copy writing is the art and science of making people do what you want them to do, buy what you want them to buy and act how you want them to act, all with the power of words.

    If you can do this, you can get rich. Period.

    If you can't do this, you can either take the time to learn how or take the time to learn how to HIRE someone who already knows how.

    How do you learn to do it? How do you learn to judge a good copy writer from a bad one if you yourself can't write good copy?

    Let's try to put some resources, methods and suggestions together.

    Post your favorite copy writing resources, books, methods etc. I propose that we break this out into its own mini-section(s)

    Copy Writing | Downloads | Links | Books | Methods | Examples

    Something like that.

    I'll kick this off. Maybe if this thread gets some traction, the mods will run with it.

    I started with a link to Clayton Makepeace in another thread. Let's make this the beginnings of a solid resource for beginners and experts alike.


    This is a great newsletter written by some of the biggest names in the business. If you spend any time reading this, you'll find out the names and methods of all the superstars back to the beginning of the 20th century when copy writing was born.

    And I'll recommend an incredible book. Go to your library. Get it. Read it. Or find a copy online (wink nudge) I've tried to find a .pdf by my blackhat skilz ain't nearly l33t enough. I suxorz.:

    "Influence: How and why people agree to things." by Robert Cialdini, PhD.

    Just one tiny section of the book talks about this:

    37 people witnessed a murder. The killing took place in the middle of a busy residential street. The attacker came back 3 separate times over a period of hours. No one called the police.

    Why not? Why didn't anyone call the police, even though the woman who was murdered screamed and screamed for help and was stabbed dozens of times before she finally died?

    If you want to sell things to people, you need to know the answer to this question.

    I'll give it away though, so you'll see why this book is so valuable and go read it.

    Everyone assumed that someone else had already called, so they did nothing. That's the power of flock behavior. Humans are flock animals just like sheep. Ever heard the term "sheeple?" There's a reason for it.

    In that circumstance and many others, most people just assume that if more than one person is present, someone else did the hard part.

    What if you want someone to buy something from you? What if you can show them that 37 other people have already done the research and the work and they picked your product?

    Get it?

    Who's next?

    Diabolik offered these tasty tidbits in another thread. Go. Love them.

    Anyone else want to chip in?

    In my experience not a lot of forums have copy writing sections and they tend not to get much traffic from members. That's a shame because without this YOU ARE THROWING MONEY AWAY.

    Flock behavior also dictates that people follow the easiest path. It just goes to show you, people are lazy. Copy writing is hard ass work so most people won't ever even try to learn it. Do yourself a favor though. Be smart. Learn it. Live it. Love it.

    That way you get to be the shepherd instead of the member of the flock getting fleeced.

    • Thanks Thanks x 6
  2. scubaslick

    scubaslick Regular Member

    Aug 23, 2007
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    Cool. Well I'll throw a couple of methods out that I've been thinking of trying out. Maybe I'll get the flow of ideas started. If anybody likes these, feel free to use them. Just remember me fondly. :)

    Method 1 - "The angel on your shoulder."

    You'd have to be a coder to pull this off, or hire one but it works like this:

    As your prospect reads your sales letter, there are several questions that you're asking them to answer. In face to face sales this is called a "tie down." You ask a question to which you know the answer is "yes." For example: "Do you want to work less, but make more money?"

    Of course your normal prospect will have to click the "yes" button.

    When they do, a little box materializes in the corner of the browser with the first question text and a checked box that says, "yes"

    Like this for example (forgive the crappy image, I just threw it together in paint. I'm in my car on the way to the in-laws working by air card. :eek:)


    As each question is asked the little "angel" (the checkbox) is sitting there whispering in the prospects ear all the really good reasons to buy your product.

    The last question of course isn't a question at all.

    <click here to buy>


    Method 2 - "Personal Service"

    Everybody and their grandmother gives away freebies these days. And people are getting used to the freebies being ridiculous, over the top, useless and unrelated. But there is one type of freebie that is working very well. It's the "Here's what's wrong with product x and if you buy it through my link, I'll show you how to fix it" trick. Incentivizing your prospect not only to buy, but to buy through your affiliate link.

    The next step in the evolution of this is to personalize what you give away. It's really a matter of working your squeeze page right, then doing a little bit of data management. If you can get a zip code or area code out of a prospect, you have everything you need -- with some work of course -- to create a "customized" solution for each person.

    For example:

    and of course the link is your affiliate link and email opt in etc. The database spits out what amounts to a mail merged form letter based on the area code and your solution to reason_01 is based on the prospects own answers to a quick survey. You really only need a few versions of the letter based on some pretty simple demographic stuff for this to work. Off the top of my head it's hard to come up with one of these without wasting a lot of time, but it might look like this:

    I know that's a bit of a weak example, but the idea is that you can make this APPEAR to be very personal service based on the data you gather from your prospect.

    There is a lot of money to be made if you'll make your prospect feel like they're more than just a number.

    Ok. Anybody want to throw some ideas around?

  3. Diabolik

    Diabolik Newbie

    Apr 11, 2011
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    Saw what you wrote about "tie downs", this is also known as a "yes ladder" or a "yes set"...

    This is built on the psychological principle of consistency and commitment

    From Noted Social Psycologist Robert Cialdini:

    Commitment and Consistency
    People have a desire to look consistent through their words, beliefs, attitudes and deeds and this tendency is supported or fed from three sources:
    1. Good personal consistency is highly valued by society.
    2. Consistent conduct provides a beneficial approach to daily life.
    3. A consistent orientation affords a valuable shortcut through the complexity of modern existence. That is-- by being consistent with earlier decisions we can reduce the need to process all the relevant information in future similar situations. Instead, one merely needs to recall the earlier decision and respond consistently.
    The key to using the principles of Commitment and Consistency to manipulate people is held within the initial commitment. That is--after making a commitment, taking a stand or position, people are more willing to agree to requests that are consistent with their prior commitment. Many compliance professionals will try to induce others to take an initial position that is consistent with a behavior they will later request.
    Commitments are most effective when they are active, public, effortful, and viewed as internally motivated and not coerced. Once a stand is taken, there is a natural tendency to behave in ways that are stubbornly consistent with the stand. The drive to be and look consistent constitutes a highly potent tool of social influence, often causing people to act in ways that are clearly contrary to their own best interests.
    Commitment decisions, even erroneous ones, have a tendency to be self-perpetuating--they often "grow their own legs." That is--those involved may add new reasons and justifications to support the wisdom of commitments they have already made. As a consequence, some commitments remain in effect long after the conditions that spurred them have changed. This phenomenon explains the effectiveness of certain deceptive compliance practices.
    To recognize and resist the undue influence of consistency pressures upon our compliance decisions--we can listen for signals coming from two places within us--our stomach or "gut reaction" and our heart.
    • A bad feeling in the pit of the stomach may appear when we realize that we are being pushed by commitment and consistency pressures to agree to requests we know we don't want to perform.
    • Our heart may bother us when it is not clear that an initial commitment was right.
    At such points it is meaningful to ask a crucial question, "Knowing what I know now, if I could go back, would I have made the same commitment?"

    I use this on girls when I want to escalate into a sexual frame. You just set it up as a challenge, something they wouldn't want to disagree with, best used after you've established rapport.

    Me: You seem like a fun person, but I'm not sure about you yet...

    Her: I'm fun!

    Me: Are you sure?

    Her: (Qualifying herself) YES!

    Me: Cool, I also like adventurous girls...are you adventurous?

    Her: Yes, I'm VERY adventurous!

    Me: What's the MOST adventurous thing you've ever done?

    See? I have her sliding down a slippery slope of challenging and qualifying. Now she has to come up with something adventurous to remain consistent with all that came before, of course they always go sexual with this even though it's not a sexual question.
  4. 5l33p3r

    5l33p3r Newbie

    Nov 11, 2007
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    Here are my contributions:

  5. deth_by_uv

    deth_by_uv Power Member

    Feb 26, 2008
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    I am so new to copy writing that I can not yet contribute anything of higher value than what I've seen in this thread. It's new to me - mostly to use tie downs in writing as I am actually in sales and use tie downs verbally over the phone all the time. For some reason, it just never occurred to me to write like that - I turn off my "sales talk" at home I guess and I just lose it...

    ANYWAY, I support this thread whole heartedly...keep it going guys!
  6. bigdaddy

    bigdaddy Newbie

    Nov 28, 2007
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    Copywriter, speaker, Daddy...and professional bum.
    East Coast of the USA.
    Wow - I can't believe that this thread is this old, yet very little has been contributed
    to it for quite some time now.

    If we get more action on this thread, I can happily provide some more info & downloads.

    In addition to the resources provided here, I'll definitely recommend Dan Kennedy as well.
    Get whatever he has - and he has a lot.
    It's all good.

    Anyway, I saw this thread & thought I'd take a quick look & chip in a bit.
    I'm a copywriter myself, and I love the craft.
    There's nothing more satisfying than writing a beautifully-crafted salesletter,
    setting it out in to the world & observing the reactions of the masses who read it.

    It's like a work of art.

    Ok, before I go, I'd like to suggest that you find the thread started by Wiz,
    titled something like 'Massive Collection of copywriting works' or something like that.
    I made a few posts in that thread & provided some resources.
    I don't know if those links are still live or not, but the thread is worth reading,
    because there are a lot of resources shared.

    Well, that's it for now, my friends.
    Happy writing,

  7. royalmice

    royalmice BANNED BANNED

    Aug 23, 2007
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    I am in the market for a good web sales copy writer, If someone could point me in the right direction i would be thankful
  8. thinkinghat

    thinkinghat Regular Member

    Nov 27, 2009
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    i am starting to learn copywriting as soon as i complete my current work load
  9. cyvex

    cyvex Regular Member

    Nov 30, 2010
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    awesome stuff!! does anyone know where I can download this "Influence: How and why people agree to things." by Robert Cialdini, PhD.??
  10. mandude

    mandude Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

    Feb 18, 2008
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    Tampa FL
    you can sample some of the pages on amazon "look inside"
    also, the book is $0.02 haha I think Im just going to buy it.
  11. googlepirate

    googlepirate Newbie

    Jan 30, 2010
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    Anyone has john carlton's "simple writing system". Please! :)
  12. cyvex

    cyvex Regular Member

    Nov 30, 2010
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    Was this on Amazon? you got a lonk mate? I could not find it that cheap..
  13. Gold Hat

    Gold Hat Regular Member

    Feb 14, 2011
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    London, UK
    this is a great thread yet so little replies, its the one subject newbies overlook which should actully be the first, if you cant write an attractive sales letter, how you gona sell?
  14. britcpa

    britcpa Power Member

    Mar 25, 2010
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  15. 3rdRock

    3rdRock Newbie

    Dec 12, 2011
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    Check the used link.
    I got one for $0.04 plus $3.99 shipping.