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Are no follow links useful for rankings?

Discussion in 'Black Hat SEO' started by nikoman, Jul 19, 2010.

  1. nikoman

    nikoman Regular Member

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    Hi there,

    Reading some posts here in BHW, I noticed some members affirm that no follow links help to improve SERP. NF links definitively do not pass page rank nor anchor text according to Mr. Matt Cuts. Nevertheless, this guy is from Google anti-spam team so is hard to believe him whether is saying the whole true.

    Does any one has had success ranking with no follow links?

    Thanks in advice.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2010
  2. BassTrackerBoats

    BassTrackerBoats Moderator Staff Member Moderator Jr. VIP

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  3. nikoman

    nikoman Regular Member

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  4. moremoney

    moremoney Junior Member

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    I think they do help a little but no where as near as much as DF

    I can never trust that Matt Cutts guy
     
  5. BassTrackerBoats

    BassTrackerBoats Moderator Staff Member Moderator Jr. VIP

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    I've seen the threads in the past from members here and sometimes I think that Cutts is smoke screening us. On this I do not think he is.

    I personally do not bother with no follow links as there are a zillion other places to use that are do follow. That being said, before I realized the difference, I put a lot of links on Wikipedia. The traffic from there is close to nothing though.
     
  6. Sharksfan

    Sharksfan Registered Member

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    They are useful for rankings.

    Matt Cutts has alluded to this several times actually. He has always said they do not pass PR. Think about that for a moment though - all that means is that that website owners can "sculpt" where the PR passes to - it does not mean the links do not have other value.

    Any normal organically indexed site will have a huge mix of follow and no-follow links to it. You want both. If you have 10,000 backlinks and they are all do-follow Google will see that as unnatural and it can (and does) hurt your rankings.

    Also, just because something is no-follow doesn't mean Google doesn't know what is on both ends of it. In most cases it will (or will very soon) index the URL on the other end. If a link goes to a very highly related site with good related content but it is no follow Google can - and probably does - use it for it's Search Results ranking (which is not directly related to Page Rank).
     
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  7. newkid...

    newkid... Jr. VIP Jr. VIP

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    It all depends on the effort. If you are taking the route of scrapebox, it does not make sense to segregates NF from DF... you blast them to all. And in my exp, NF also counts in ranking.. not only in yahoo/msn but also in google. Recently i posted 800 nofollow blog comments for one of my website and that too for "make money online" keyword and it stands at position #34 today which was not in Top 500...

    Having said that, if you are doing it manually you should better stick only to DF
     
  8. nikoman

    nikoman Regular Member

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    If they help how much are needed to get some rankings? 800?
     
  9. hasselblad

    hasselblad Newbie

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    I think ratio is 1/50 (follow/nofollow)...
     
  10. -Jericho-

    -Jericho- Jr. Executive VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    People often get SERPs and PR mixed up. They are two different things. Just because you have a high PR doesn't mean you rank well in SERPs and vice versa.

    I have yet to find a definitive source that says nofollow tags don't help SERPs. All it does is prevent PR from flowing to your site.
     
  11. nikoman

    nikoman Regular Member

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    Well, I do not really care whether my site has PR0 as long is ranked #1. In fact, the damn site has PR5 because a musicmoz.org link but has no visitors. I want rankings!!
     
  12. flaktrak

    flaktrak Power Member

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    Basically not long after google started publishing page rank, they realised they probably shouldn't have. People lived by it and people like the black hatters here at BHW started exploiting it. So they implemented nofollow allow webmasters a way of dealing with comment spam and other attacks they were getting. Easy enough just make any comment link nofllow and bam link juice doesn't leave the site and therefore the spammers theoretically won't spam your site and therefore spam googles index. We all know this is not true! because spammers will spam anyway whether they get link juice or not.

    So google has developed other metrics to do with links and anchor text. Things like "Trust Rank" which they won't publish! and rumor has it there are other "Rank metrics" based on links that google uses but doesn't publish.

    My Speculation is as follows and of course I don't have any real insight into what google does.

    It's not to hard to work out what sites out there will pass trust to your site, the problem is how do they pass it? Does google pass trust trank through comments? I doubt it! Will google pass trust through nofollow links? I think they would but not through your standard comment links. I bet if failblog linked to you outside the comment area with a nofollow link, you would get some serious trust rank but within the comments not a whole lot.

    Anyway as I said this is all speculation.
    However I have said this before google is not just in the search business. They are in the Information Business, so it would be stupid of them to only keep one map of the internet based on page rank alone. I am sure they have multiple maps of the internet and have different ranking metrics based on them. Anyway I still believe links from big trusted sites are worth pursuing whether they are nofollow or not.
     
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  13. websuperman

    websuperman Registered Member

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    NoFollow Links Still Send Traffic

    The most obvious reason to gain these links is because they can still send traffic to your site. Who cares if your site doesn't get any "link juice" from a nofollowed link if it still sends visitors? Those people could still become customers.

    There is More Than Link Juice That Determine Link Value

    Going on the assumption that nofollow links don't pass much link juice, they still pass relevance. Just because Google doesn't "count" the link, doesn't mean that they don't see what anchor text is being used. The anchor text is still showing the search engines what your site is about and is passing relevancy.

    Some NoFollowed Links Are Very Trust-worthy

    I also believe that nofollow links pass trust. If you have a link on Wikipedia for example, do you really believe that the search engines won't pay attention to that link? If you can get links on highly trusted domains, whether they are nofollow or not, they will be taken into consideration by the search engines.

    Keep It Real and Natural

    Lastly, if you're building incoming links to your site and almost all of them are DF links, your link profile is going to look very unnatural. A natural link profile will have nofollow links, DF links, different domains (.info., org, .com, etc.) and various types of anchor text (brand name, url only, keywords, "click here", etc). This is how a link profile should look and this is how you build a trusted domain.

    If you still put all your focus into avoiding nofollow links after this, you're a lost cause.
     
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    Last edited: Jul 20, 2010
  14. coolfx35

    coolfx35 Regular Member

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    no follow do not help with ranking, but google bot does crawl your site for relevency.

    it's better than no link at all.
     
  15. nikoman

    nikoman Regular Member

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    I guest testing is the only way to determine this issue. Testing getting many nofollow links.
     
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  16. MagicMike

    MagicMike Power Member

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    Yes... this is one of my biggest dilemnas... it is relatively easy to find high pr blogs to comment on that are NF... I'm just always second guessing myself about whether or not I'm wasting my time.

    I have analyzed other sites who rank well in competitive niches and it seems they have very few DF links... so, given that, it seems they MUST have an impact on ranking... but I'm still not sure or comfortable.

    I'm thinking of testing a brand new site with ONLY NF links and see where it takes me... or maybe I'm too impatient for that!!!
     
  17. bannedfree

    bannedfree Regular Member

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    if you are campaigning for ad-sense earnings then i am afraid Cutts is right. But if you are aiming for other source of earnings then Cutts is wrong. And yes NF helps you rank well. I have been studying competitors site before and they have loads of them on their backs.
     
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  18. Micallef

    Micallef Supreme Member

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    Nofollow seems to be the "in thing" at the moment. However, I think you are all making a serious mistake.

    Google has a very hard job to do. Spam is a huge problem for them, and it's important to understand just how big the problem is. They are beset from all sides - trust me on that.

    The automated spider does not have AI. It has impressive abilities but it cannot tell the difference between spam and non-spam links to an acceptable degree. This is true because spam links work. My websites have no business in ranking, but they do. They are powered mainly by blog comments and mini-nets.

    Google wants to isolate the links it can trust - the links made by webmasters and other "authorities" who will make genuine "votes" for sites of value. User generated linked content creates noise which confuses Google's results and lets spam seep onto the first page. What better way to cut out this noise than the nofollow tag?

    I simply do not see why Google would not disqualify nofollow links from their ranking calculations. They have a problem, and nofollow makes it easier to deal with that problem. It denotes user generated content - content which can be made by just about anyone. Why would Google let its results be twisted by user generated content when it knows the powerful incentives for manipulation?

    Let's get one more thing straight - not one single person on this forum has anything even approaching proof that nofollow links help with rank. SEO is a near impossible test environment. Anything that happens could be due to any number of factors which we cannot verify.
     
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  19. PEBAL

    PEBAL Newbie

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    Guys...

    I've heard from numerous informed sources that get their hands dirty with this tuff everyday, that no-follows do indeed provide page juice.

    You can read about 1 case study by googling...

    "Google NoFollow on Links, working? by Ben Fischer"

    I'd post the link but as a newbie I'm unable.

    Cheers,

    Peter
     
  20. gorang

    gorang Elite Member

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    According to billions of people there is a man in the sky who created everything and if you don't do what he says you're going to hell.